Effects of Global Warming ??

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Thames 4 Blood

What a strange post. Effectively, in answer to a thread asking for annecdotal posts, you have declared yourself above the thread and then delivered a sermon on what science really is...

I assume that was aimed at my post ... point taken. Did not mean to come off so arrogant. Sorry about that. It's just that we're already seeing the "denier" comments that seem inevitable on threads like this. It frustrates me b/c the information, the data, and the analysis are all readily available to anyone who can post to this forum.

Climate change is a well-established understanding (theory) in the scientific literature. There is no grand scientific dispute. There are a very few researchers who argue for a different understanding, but the consensus is as strong as it gets in science. The dispute is being fought is in the popular media, in the "think tanks" and in corporate blather. It is the exact same pattern we saw over the tobacco/cancer fight.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by LakeSuperior

Earth warming has seriously slowed in the last 15 years, about 0.15 deg C for the period. The warming is just not as cut and dry as one might imagine. On top of that, as you said the causes are murky.

Take a read through this. It's a good overview of actual research on the question. Here's the summary statement:

"The planet has continued to accumulate heat since 1998 - global warming is still happening. Nevertheless, surface temperatures show much internal variability due to heat exchange between the ocean and atmosphere. 1998 was an unusually hot year due to a strong El Nino."

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Climate change is a well-established understanding (theory) in the scientific literature. There is no grand scientific dispute.

you mean the "Climate should be staying the same" crowd not gained any traction? I wonder why? maybe because they don't exist .

Man Made (how very apt a term!) Global Warming / Climate Change is just the latest way of explaining to folks that there is not enough to go around - for them at least.

Climate Science same same as Creationist Science.......except without the god stuff and more numbers (it's got numbers! - it must be science ).

Not sh#tting on own doorstep is a different matter - for some a strange new concept, for others pretty much the norm.

[cfarrar]

From the scientific literature I am confident that it's happening, but I don't claim to "see" it. Daily temperatures and weather events are statistical noise.

[goboatingnow]

remember all through history, right back for as long as you care to look, the mass of public opinion is never swayed by "scientists" its swayed by showmen, charismatic showmen, tabloid press mis-information and vested interests. The average Joe, doesnt read peer reviewed papers, subscribe to Nature magazine etc. Very few average Joes can be bothered to assemble and rationalise the various threads of the argument or be bothered to arrive at their own confusion.

Hence they are susceptible to "well packaged" arguments that everything will be "all right" and "dont worry". No doubt the same things was said to Londoners just before the "plague", or to Neville Chamberlin etc !!!.

DAve

[Bash]

NASA - NASA Finds 2012 Sustained Long-Term Climate Warming Trend

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

remember all through history, right back for as long as you care to look, the mass of public opinion is never swayed by "scientists" its swayed by showmen, charismatic showmen, tabloid press mis-information and vested interests. The average Joe, doesnt read peer reviewed papers, subscribe to Nature magazine etc. Very few average Joes can be bothered to assemble and rationalise the various threads of the argument or be bothered to arrive at their own confusion.

Hence they are susceptible to "well packaged" arguments that everything will be "all right" and "dont worry". No doubt the same things was said to Londoners just before the "plague", or to Neville Chamberlin etc !!!.

DAve

All through history the mass of public opinion has been swayed by folks preying on the fear / prediction of doom - and with a cure to sell. Strangely enough always involving money moving in their direction.

MMGW just woo without the god(s), very handily it has arrived in an age where the god(s) have lost their mojo .

[LakeSuperior]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I assume that was aimed at my post ... point taken. Did not mean to come off so arrogant. Sorry about that. It's just that we're already seeing the "denier" comments that seem inevitable on threads like this. It frustrates me b/c the information, the data, and the analysis are all readily available to anyone who can post to this forum.

Climate change is a well-established understanding (theory) in the scientific literature. There is no grand scientific dispute. There are a very few researchers who argue for a different understanding, but the consensus is as strong as it gets in science. The dispute is being fought is in the popular media, in the "think tanks" and in corporate blather. It is the exact same pattern we saw over the tobacco/cancer fight.

Take a look at the cold fusion debacle. A number of premier laboratories (GTRI for example) were able to reproduce the results of Pons et al and reported such in the world media. Cold fusion has never occured in the laboratory. There is too much at stake (funding) in the scientific community for the mainstream to swim upstream. I submit that you are seeing gang mentality that is exactly analogous to cold fusion.

[atoll]

the big picture is ,any change is just the earths way of stabalising its existence,the 7 billion plus people on earth are immaterial, if we are lucky climate change will restore the balance to a sustainable 3 billion,future generations will be digging through the topsoil and finding pieces of plastic and concrete and commenting on the wasteful nature of early modern man.................and how it led to their downfall

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by Jesse

Why does this Koolaid taste funny?

Because someone has been stirring it with your end of the stick.

the sh#tty end.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by LakeSuperior

Take a look at the cold fusion debacle. A number of premier laboratories (GTRI for example) were able to reproduce the results of Pons et al and reported such in the world media. Cold fusion has never occured in the laboratory. There is too much at stake (funding) in the scientific community for the mainstream to swim upstream. I submit that you are seeing gang mentality that is exactly analogous to cold fusion.

Show me the published study...

I remember the event well. As I recall, they did not publish their findings in a scientific journal where it would have received a critical review first. They went directly to the popular media. As soon as the claims were considered by researchers -- when the effects could not be reproduced -- it was shown to be a fraud.

[Gelfling]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I usually just ignore this kind of thread. Clearly it's headed for the crapper, but I'm trying to avoid work, so here it goes...
--> The summary notes: "Many of the changes in land-surface temperature can be explained by a combination of volcanoes and a proxy for human greenhouse gas emissions. Solar variation does not seem to impact the temperature trend (My bold added for emphasis)." A direct link to the paper.

I have to admit......I lost interest in what you were saying right about here. When I get back to a PC I have an interest in these reports....but if this is a true summary then I take it there is no mention about atmospheric temperatures....which are surely effected by solar variations. Heat from a volcano won't sustain life on Earth. But this is the "natural phenoms" that do and will occur. It could be that 'life' (aka.....humans....animals...etc) are a part of the phenom process. There is no hard proof other than dinosaurs and even that isn't totally clear as to why the species no longer resides on earth......to many loose knots in this rope.

Again....I support a healthier living environment and there is lots that can be done to make that happen, some of it has already started.

[delmarrey]

The same argument by (mostly) the same people with the same internet facts that goes to 500+ posts and gains nothing except condemnation and disrespect. And probably with the same results, burnout.

What a waste of megabytes!

If you want some so called facts, check the archives. This argument has been going on since CF started 10 years ago. Ya'll can add this to the gun/anchor threads!

[HappySeagull]

a primer for deny-ers...
Where does oxygen come from? Photo-synthesis.
What was the atmosphere like before photosynthesis? Poisonous to humans
What is an important side-effect of photosynthesis over billions of years? Carbon is separated from atmospheric molecules and sequestered in the ground as coal and oil.

What should we do with this knowledge?
."no worries-burn all the coal and oil as fast as possible"

[Tar34]

There really is no worry. It's beyond your control. We just have to hope those running the program tweak the game.
Physicists say there may be a way to prove that we live in a computer simulation