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Old 01-05-2012, 05:00   #91
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Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

Remember - Guns don't kill people. Americans do .
DOJ normally your anti-American jabs piss me off, but I find this one hilarious!!

Frank
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:02   #92
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

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On our cat when we visit the Kimberlies up in north western Austrlalia we always carry a semi auto shot gun and a high powered rifle such as my Dads confiscated Vietnam AR15. We use hollow point SS109 (NATO) rounds for the Crocodiles. My weapon of choice in the Northern Territory when ashore is a standard old 1911A1 45 pistol for the feral pigs. You can carry a pistol and shoot pigs there unrestricted. Have to watch out that the pigs aren't full of worms, not too healthy eating.

I'm yet to see a pirate on my travels that has required either of these items to be used between Australia and the lower Asian countries.
I thought the Aussie .gov confiscated all the civilian guns...
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:05   #93
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Nearly all.
because a nut went and kiled 35 innocent people and wounded 21 with his automatics.
Still plenty around though if you have contacts.
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:07   #94
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

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Because it seems like most poeple on this forum are anti-gun. And no, not yet atleast. I joined this forum to try and ask questions and get answers from poeple whom i hope are knowledgeable about these questions.

Hey Lt. may I Suggest you try "Soldier of Fortune" magazine.
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:42   #95
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

I've bumped into a couple of armed bears. good thing they had poor eyesight. and were even more scared of me!! Now armed deer on the other hand!
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:46   #96
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

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Nearly all.
because a nut went and kiled 35 innocent people and wounded 21 with his automatics.
Still plenty around though if you have contacts.
That's a bit harsh, and unnecessary IMO.
In NY some nut killed about 15 people. He had a 15 round magazine.
So they banned 15 round magazines. Only 10 round are legal.
Problem solved!
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:49   #97
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

The topic of firearms onboard obviously generates a lot of opinions. Based on my personal experience both cruising on my own sail boat and as a captain on large motor yachts for over 10 years.

If you are cruising from US to Canada, bad idea. Guns will probably be confiscated and you may be expelled, fined or arrested.

If you are cruising Mexico...TERRIBLE idea. Guns will be confiscated, boat will be confiscated, your crew will be arrested (probably released after a few days), you will be arrested and get to enjoy your remaining years in a Mexican prison, unless your family has LOTS of money to buy you out. Most of central America pretty much the same except for transiting Panama Canal but you will need to remain in the Canal Zone.

French Polynesia...very bad idea. It is possible to bring guns in, but they must be surrendered at your first port and go back to same port to reclaim upon departure of French Polynesia. Not declaring upon arrival will result in arrest and heavy fines if discovered.

Overall firearms are not worth the headaches and if it's real pirates (Indian Ocean, South China Sea) a couple of hand held weapons will not help.

Good luck
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:56   #98
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

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Originally Posted by GeoPowers View Post
DOJ normally your anti-American jabs piss me off, but I find this one hilarious!!

Frank
Just goes to show - can't please all of the people all of the time. That's why I don't bother trying .

FWIW, was not conscious of being anti-American - more anti-numpty, and because of where most of the CF memberships comes from that is simply a numbers game. Get me on a forum full of English and I am a lot less subtle (they mostly being thick as sh#t ).

I have always considered myself broadly pro-American, kinda see it like Soviet Russia - a great idea in theory, just very glad I don't have to live there and thankful it's a long way away . But nonetheless I do accept the fact that it exists works well for me.
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Old 01-05-2012, 06:06   #99
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Thats the event that caused Aus to be disarmed.
He was a brutal screwball that murdered.
The govt straight away started a buyback of anything semi auto to auto.
You can not even get a .22 semi auto to shoot vermin rabbits.
Just the facts.
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Old 01-05-2012, 06:28   #100
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

While I think carrying a gun round the world could be more of a problem than it's worth...there are places (like Alaska while salmon fishing...don't leave home without one) that having one isn't a problem and leaves you options...IF...you are thoroughly comfortable with killing someone...lot's of people say they are but they are not. A little training goes a long way...but it's the killing and living with it most people aren't ready for.

Here's a better written set of thoughts than I can muster over my coffee and reflects some of those who believe in guns as the great equalizer when necessary.

By Maj. L. Caudill USMC (Ret)

Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force.
If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or force me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that's it.

In a truly moral and civilized society, people exclusively interact through persuasion. Force has no place as a valid method of social interaction, and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm, as paradoxical as it may sound to some.

When I carry a gun, you cannot deal with me by force. You have to use reason and try to persuade me, because I have a way to negate your threat or employment of force.

The gun is the only personal weapon that puts a 100-pound woman on equal footing with a 220-pound mugger, a 75-year old retiree on equal footing with a 19-year old gang banger, and a single guy on equal footing with a carload of drunk guys with baseball bats. The gun removes the disparity in physical strength, size, or numbers between a potential attacker and a defender.

There are plenty of people who consider the gun as the source of bad force equations. These are the people who think that we'd be more civilized if all guns were removed from society. But, a firearm makes it easier for an armed mugger to do his job. That, of course, is only true if the mugger's potential victims are mostly disarmed either by choice or by legislative fiat - it has no validity when most of a mugger's potential marks are armed.

People who argue for the banning of arms ask for automatic rule by the young, the strong, and the many, and that's the exact opposite of a civilized society. A mugger, even an armed one, can only make a successful living in a society where the state has granted him a force monopoly.

Then there's the argument that the gun makes confrontations lethal that otherwise would only result in injury. This argument is fallacious in several ways. Without guns involved, confrontations are won by the physically superior party inflicting overwhelming injury on the loser.

People who think that fists, bats, sticks, or stones don't constitute lethal force, watch too much TV, where people take beatings and come out of it with a bloody lip at worst. The fact that the gun makes lethal force easier, works solely in favor of the weaker defender, not the stronger attacker. If both are armed, the field is level.

The gun is the only weapon that's as lethal in the hands of an octogenarian as it is in the hands of a weight lifter. It simply would not work as well as a force equalizer if it wasn't both lethal and easily employable.

When I carry a gun, I don't do so because I am looking for a fight, but because I'm looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don't carry it because I'm afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force. It removes force from the equation...And that's why carrying a gun is a civilized act!!

Maj. L. Caudill USMC (Ret.)
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Old 01-05-2012, 06:34   #101
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

Don Lucas.That works both ways you know. when we come to take over we will find you
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Old 01-05-2012, 06:46   #102
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

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Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
While I think carrying a gun round the world could be more of a problem than it's worth...there are places (like Alaska while salmon fishing...don't leave home without one) that having one isn't a problem and leaves you options...IF...you are thoroughly comfortable with killing someone...lot's of people say they are but they are not. A little training goes a long way...but it's the killing and living with it most people aren't ready for.

Here's a better written set of thoughts than I can muster over my coffee and reflects some of those who believe in guns as the great equalizer when necessary.

By Maj. L. Caudill USMC (Ret)

Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force.
If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or force me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that's it.

I......blah,blah...progun stuff , all been heard before....blah, blah



The gun is the only weapon that's as lethal in the hands of an octogenarian as it is in the hands of a weight lifter. It simply would not work as well as a force equalizer if it wasn't both lethal and easily employable.

When I carry a gun, I don't do so because I am looking for a fight, but because I'm looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don't carry it because I'm afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force. It removes force from the equation...And that's why carrying a gun is a civilized act!!

Maj. L. Caudill USMC (Ret.)
I am afraid this is the greatest load of gun twaddle I have ever read, essentially it rabbits on about muggers, Carrying a lethal weapon can never be described as a civilized act, and thats why countries with long experience of civility ban them.

The facts guns turn people into bullies, invite conflict and turn simple conflict into dangerous armed face-offs. It achieves nothing

I have asked this before, the US is the onlysociety that carries on like this and reasons like this, this debate simply does not happen elsewhere. Why is that?, ( I am reminded of the the joke, honey theres a report of a car driving the wrong way down a freeway, oh no honey there all driving the wrong way!)

The pro-gun lobby in the US has debased an original view of armed militia to justify an armed society. A situation that no other country tolerates.

Quote:
Because it seems like most poeple on this forum are anti-gun. And no, not yet atleast. I joined this forum to try and ask questions and get answers from poeple whom i hope are knowledgeable about these questions.
Im not anti gun, I own several. I am anti personal defense by guns, totally and completely. Thats not anti-gun, its a reminder that I live in a civilised society when personal safety is correctlyentrusted in the organs of the state.
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Old 01-05-2012, 06:48   #103
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

A bit of levity (sort of on topic): Stephen Colbert on "gun fashion," and how we'll need to fear anyone wearing nice khakis and a button-down shirt:
Stephen Colbert Has Some Ideas for New Trends in Gun Fashion
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Old 01-05-2012, 07:14   #104
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...is there anyone that has a story about actually putting the gun to good use? I don mean shooting someone, but a " thank the lord almighty I had my dirty Harry hand cannon at my side" story?

And I also don't want to hear the " well he would have robbed me but saw that I had a gun" story's.

I'm talking cf members that have defended there lives and boats from muggers and pirates with gun in hand, dagger in teeth type story...this is sailing specific as well...

Maybe this should have been another thread
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Old 01-05-2012, 07:31   #105
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Re: Do you pack ''HEAT'' while you sail?

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...I live in a civilised society when personal safety is correctly entrusted in the organs of the state.

There are a lot of us who feel the "organs of the state" have far too much power already, and a huge self-interest in disarming the little people aka citizenry. Indeed, I can't think of many examples where government has done a good job running anything, at least here in the US.

"If the people lead, eventually the leaders will follow." This is a notion that will continue to gain momentum. It may be the only way thru this current mess.
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