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Old 08-05-2014, 08:25   #271
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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Originally Posted by weavis View Post
I dont find Angelina Jolie attractive. Is life over for me?
sigh.
No, maybe you are changing sides, like multihulls versus monohulls or the other way around no wrong in that.

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Old 08-05-2014, 09:19   #272
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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No, maybe you are changing sides, like multihulls versus monohulls or the other way around no wrong in that.
Naah. I think I just dont find her attractive....
I feel better now.
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Old 08-05-2014, 09:27   #273
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

She is, unfortunately, plasticine in a gown.

i dont' find her attractive either. Her lips are too big.

Not like my girl Lucy:

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Old 08-05-2014, 09:46   #274
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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What was the purpose in posing that photo, serious question, trying to understand the message.
It's an interesting multi-hulled ketch showing shallow draft and demonstrating the ability to remain upright on a mud flat. Presumed sailors would pick up on that instead of me saying the obvious.
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Old 08-05-2014, 09:53   #275
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

@mark picked that up right away, no biggie observation. thanks
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:09   #276
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
It's an interesting multi-hulled ketch showing shallow draft and demonstrating the ability to remain upright on a mud flat. Presumed sailors would pick up on that instead of me saying the obvious.
Enter lesson No7 about internet chat rooms...even if you posted the obvious: 1/4 won't see/get it, 1/4 will disagree with it and attack your mother, 1/4 will change the subject to something totally unrelated to what is being discussed and then 1/4 will contribute to the discussion....heck....I'm not even sure where I fall in most of the times...ha ha ah
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:19   #277
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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Enter lesson No7 about internet chat rooms...even if you posted the obvious: 1/4 won't see/get it, 1/4 will disagree with it and attack your mother, 1/4 will change the subject to something totally unrelated to what is being discussed and then 1/4 will contribute to the discussion....heck....I'm not even sure where I fall in most of the times...ha ha ah
Did you know Angelina Joli flies a Cirrus?
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:22   #278
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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Did you know Angelina Joli flies a Cirrus?
wow…look at that display:

Cirrus Aircraft

A jeanneau with wings.
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:43   #279
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

Hardly a Jeanneau with wings monkey...that is an extremely well built aircraft that few can rival.
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:44   #280
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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Originally Posted by steve.garlick View Post
Thought I'd offer a different point of view. After a history of being dedicated multihullers (my wife and I raced a Nacra 5.8, sailed several Farrier tri's ), we bought a 44' Chamberlain cat as our first cruising boat. It was a disaster on many levels. It was too big for my wife and I to easily handle, it cost a fortune to haul and dock fees were high. It required way too much maintenance, and while being fast, it was unenjoyable to sail. It felt like sailing a truck, with no feel of 'being in the groove'. We sold it after 6 months, realising we'd bought the wrong boat for us.

We also realised that the smallest boat you can live aboard is the best for many reasons (we are retiree's on a limited budget). We have now been living in the Med for 2 years on a 40' mono. We love the boat, it is a cruising classic (A Bowman 40). It has impeccable sea-worthiness and is a delight to sail. We can get it into and out of the small harbours, ports and anchorages here. We've sailed in horrible conditions (50 knot meltemi winds with short 4m chop) and the boat has handled it impeccably.

We've also done a delivery in a Lagoon 40'. I would NEVER want to go back to a cat like that. The motion in a reasonable MEd chop was horrible, it wallowed and pounded like a pig. The interior fit out was cheap and nasty.

I know there are some great cat's being built now, but I have adapted completely to mono's. The boat has a small footprint, I feel totally safe with the seaworthiness of the boat, and feel comfortable in high winds at anchor and port.

Each to his own, but the OP was asking about people who 'went back'. We did, and we're happy we did.

Steve
S/V Pavlov
Hi Steve and Mrs Steve.

Thanks for that. Ive read it several times and wonder if you ever really went forward into multihulls for cruising? By that comment I mean that things were not set up right from the start.

Racing Tri's and Cats is not the same as living on one as you found out.

I agree with the issues regarding the boat being too big for you, The costs associated with Cat ownership can make your eyes water, and the different wave motion of the CAT can make you wonder. I learned/am learning how to counteract certain known features of CAT boating and once known make the discomfort go away or lessen considerably.
I have to agree about the Lagoon too. Im not fond of that hull design.

The short time you had the vessel, and your experiences, certainly would make most people think hard about the breed of boat and return to a known quantity. Im also sure, had you got the right CAT, your experience would have been less fraught, but the outcome might well have been the same.
I for one applaud your attempt at MultiHull life, and am glad you found what worked for you.
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Old 08-05-2014, 15:55   #281
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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The thread needed an opinion like that to balance things.

I am not saying that cats have not lots of advantages and they obviously suit the needs of most but being sailing on the med on the last years I thought that going upwind on a force 6 on a cat should be very uncomfortable on the typical conditions. It is not comfortable on a monohull, it should be much worse on a multihull. .

Should be? You're making an assumption, which seems to be what most monohull dedicated people do. Like everything, mono's included, it will vary depending on the design. We have no difficulty going upwind. We sailed all the way down the Vanuatu archipelago, mostly upwind. In winds generally from 20-30 kts, and stronger at times.

Having owned a 40 foot cruising mono, I can say with certainty we were more comfortable in this boat than we would have been in that.

Interestingly, when we were at Tanna, we met some people on a 60 foot steel mono. They had motored all the way from Vila, where we had sailed. The lady was quite amazed we had sailed all the way, upwind. She said at one stage :"I've never sailed on a cat, I wouldn't like the motion."

To which I replied "Nothing like keeping an open mind...."
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Old 08-05-2014, 19:17   #282
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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Should be? You're making an assumption, which seems to be what most monohull dedicated people do. Like everything, mono's included, it will vary depending on the design. We have no difficulty going upwind. We sailed all the way down the Vanuatu archipelago, mostly upwind. In winds generally from 20-30 kts, and stronger at times.
...."
Not an assumption since it was confirmed by other poster that expressed that opinion based on his experience:
Quote:
Originally Posted by steve.garlick View Post
T.. we bought a 44' Chamberlain cat as our first cruising boat. It was a disaster on many levels. ... while being fast, it was unenjoyable to sail. It felt like sailing a truck, with no feel of 'being in the groove'. ....We've also done a delivery in a Lagoon 40'. I would NEVER want to go back to a cat like that. The motion in a reasonable MEd chop was horrible, it wallowed and pounded like a pig. ..
Steve
S/V Pavlov
I was talking about the conditions that he experienced, med typical conditions with strong winds and upwind sailing, not Ocean Pacific conditions. The med with wind creates some nasty short period steep waves that are very uncomfortable upwind.

I have heard and read other sailors talking about the uncomfortable motion of a multihull upwind in steep waves and also about the noise and jerky motion (when sailing fast). James Baldwin explains well what I mean:

"Over the years I've been fortunate to have sailed a variety of boats, from cruising the coast of China on a three-masted junk, to spending two circumnavigations aboard Atom, my 28-foot Pearson Triton.... I were hired to help sail a 44-foot Dean Catamaran, Dawn Dancer, on a 2,050-mile passage from Cabedelo, Brazil, to Trinidad in the West Indies. ....Despite the thrill of sailing fast and level, we soon became acquainted with the multihull's dirty little secret—the incredible pounding of waves on the bridge deck's flat underside. The slamming was so severe that I could not sleep at all the first two days. Below decks, the shockwaves felt like we were being dropped on concrete. I kept looking through the hatch to see if the mast had fallen. Mike comforted us neophytes by saying: "Yes, she always pounds, sometimes much worse than now....I kept waking every few minutes whenever a particularly hard impact nearly lifted me off my bunk."

Off course that would not prevent me of having a Dragonfly 35 trimaran if I could afford one. Don't have that noise problem but I am quite sure that it is as uncomfortable as any multihull against the wind on steep waves. A Monohull close upwind takes the wave one time, a cat takes it two times, first on a hull, then on other and that's why it is jerkier and more uncomfortable.

I would accept that disadvantage in exchange for the speed advantages and fun of faster sailing, while not pretending that it is the ideal sailboat or the more comfortable in all circumstances.
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Old 08-05-2014, 19:28   #283
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Polux View Post
Not an assumption since it was confirmed by other poster that expressed that opinion based on his experience:


I was talking about the conditions that he experienced, med typical conditions with strong winds and upwind sailing, not Ocean Pacific conditions. The med with wind creates some nasty short period steep waves that are very uncomfortable upwind.

I have heard and read other sailors talking about the uncomfortable motion of a multihull upwind in steep waves and also about the noise and jerky motion (when sailing fast). James Baldwin explains well what I mean:

"Over the years I've been fortunate to have sailed a variety of boats, from cruising the coast of China on a three-masted junk, to spending two circumnavigations aboard Atom, my 28-foot Pearson Triton.... I were hired to help sail a 44-foot Dean Catamaran, Dawn Dancer, on a 2,050-mile passage from Cabedelo, Brazil, to Trinidad in the West Indies. ....Despite the thrill of sailing fast and level, we soon became acquainted with the multihull's dirty little secret—the incredible pounding of waves on the bridge deck's flat underside. The slamming was so severe that I could not sleep at all the first two days. Below decks, the shockwaves felt like we were being dropped on concrete. I kept looking through the hatch to see if the mast had fallen. Mike comforted us neophytes by saying: "Yes, she always pounds, sometimes much worse than now....I kept waking every few minutes whenever a particularly hard impact nearly lifted me off my bunk."

Off course that would not prevent me of having a Dragonfly 35 trimaran if I could afford one. Don't have that noise problem but I am quite sure that it is as uncomfortable as any multihull against the wind on steep waves. A Monohull close upwind takes the wave one time, a cat takes it two times, first on a hull, then on other and that's why it is jerkier and more uncomfortable.

I would accept that disadvantage in exchange for the speed advantages and fun of faster sailing, while not pretending that it is the ideal sailboat or the more comfortable in all circumstances.

This is the reason I think cats are a poor choice for crossing oceans. They excel in flat water, but in any kind of sea state you are faced with reducing speed, thereby defeating the point, or being miserable and risking damage to the boat. The ability to do 15 knots is great in flat water, but useless in any kind of waves.
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Old 08-05-2014, 20:29   #284
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

Seems obvious to me that the previous two posters have little to no experience with multis.


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Old 08-05-2014, 20:34   #285
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Re: Do Multihullers Ever go Back?

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SNIP
Interestingly, when we were at Tanna, we met some people on a 60 foot steel mono. They had motored all the way from Vila, where we had sailed. The lady was quite amazed we had sailed all the way, upwind. She said at one stage :"I've never sailed on a cat, I wouldn't like the motion."

To which I replied "Nothing like keeping an open mind...."
When I hear someone make a comment like "I've never sailed on a cat, I wouldn't like the motion." I tend to take them at their word.

One thing I have noticed is that my Seawind (not saying it is what I would pick as an upwind blue water boat) does pound/slam (or what ever you want to call it) when going up wind in some conditions. But if I trim the sails a little and change the course maybe five degrees the pounding goes away. It does increase the time to the destination but a more comfortable motion is worth it to me.

When I hear stories about folks pounding into the teeth of the wind for days I wonder why they they simply don't change course a little and be more comfortable. If I sailed my cat that way I would not like the motion either.
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