Derelict Boats

[a64pilot]

I've been noticing since this anchoring restrictions thing got started, that compared to South Fl, the Panhandle is pretty much devoid of derelicts, and wondered why.
Well I think I got my answer last weekend, there were two derelicts in the Bay at Panama City, one has been raised and is in a slip at the city Marina, I'm sure awaiting disposal, the other has a big red sticker on it that sates if it's not removed by the owner in 5 days, it will be removed and disposed of.

It's an FWC sticker, quotes chapter 705, Florida Statues and goes on to say owner is liable for costs of removal, storage and publication of notice.


We have all been saying that derelict boats ought to be treated like abandoned cars, apparently at least in Panama City, they do.

[denverd0n]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

We have all been saying that derelict boats ought to be treated like abandoned cars, apparently at least in Panama City, they do.

That's the problem with all of the new, proposed anchoring restrictions. They justify them by pointing to derelict boats, but they have had the means to deal with derelict boats all along. They just don't use it.

Too inconvenient. Too much paperwork. Takes too long. Much easier to just put a blanket ban on anchoring. And, of course, there's the money. Usually hard to get any out of truly derelict boats or their owners. Not so hard to get out of responsible folks who just happen to anchor a few feet too close to someone's McMansion.

[GordMay]

It’s not cheap to dispose of a derelict boat.

Case History - Disposal Cost $3,818.57 ➥ http://www.livingoceans.org/sites/de...-Practices.pdf

➥ Derelict boat costs add up for Nanaimo Port Authority - Nanaimo News Bulletin

➥ http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...it-100423.html

[Kenomac]

Nobody wants this crap parked on front of their house, McMansion or not. I see no difference between a derelict boat and a car up on cinder blocks, except the car probably doesn't stink as bad.

[a64pilot]

Gord,
It may not be cheap, but the Panhandle is not the Gold Coast, and if they can afford it, then the Gold Coast can too. Panhandle is not the wealthy part of Florida.
I suspicion that the cost are largely inflated due to low volume, and an excellent way to not do something is to claim it's too expensive.

I'm under the impression that money to dispose of derelicts exists, but it may not be being spent on derelict boat disposal

[newhaul]

Don't know about Florida but here in Washington they charge every boat a fee on registration that goes into a fund designed to pay for the removal and disposal of derelict vessels in addition I'm sure there are federal funds available thru the epa for that purpose as well.


Edit: just found this link for Florida.
http://myfwc.com/boating/grant-progr...relict-vessel/

[Captain Bill]

Disposal of derelict boats should not be a problem in Florida. Each county gets back roughly 40% of the boat registration fees in that county from the state. There is a list of legal uses for that money and one of them is derelict boat removal. This amounts to almost 8 million dollars a year on a state wide basis. If that money is not used for a listed purpose it is supposed to be returned to the state. If we round Gord's boat removal figure to $4000 then roughly 2000 derelict boats could be removed a year. Each county is supposed to issue a report by November on what it used their boat registration funds for during the previous year. Florida is supposed to have government in the sunshine, but even the SSCA has been unable to get copies of these reports. It appears that these funds disappear into the county general revenues, never to be seen again. Even if only half of these funds were used every year for derelict removal the problem would be quickly cleaned up. Keeping up with the yearly issue after that would not take that much effort. See Florida statute 328.72 for details.

[GordMay]

Has the Florida The Derelict Vessel Removal Grant Program been funded recently?

I note that, NOAA has awarded nearly $1.4 million to groups across the U.S. to remove marine debris from their communities. This is the ninth year of this annual grant competition, and over that time, the program has distributed more than $10.5 million for removal projects.
➥ NOAA’s Marine Debris Program funds 13 new community-based removal projects

➥ NOAA Marine Debris Program’s community-based marine debris removal grants: September 2015

[Captain Bill]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Has the Florida The Derelict Vessel Removal Grant Program been funded recently?

]

The Derelict Vessel Removal Grant program is from an annual $2 million grant program for general marine infrastructure projects which can include requests for funds for derelict boat removal. The distribution of these grants can be easily found on the internet and often include requests for grants for derelict boat removal. The funds that I am talking about are not part of this grant program, but are distributed to the counties annually. Some counties get in the neighborhood of $300,000 annually under 328.72 yet are applying for $50,000 grants for derelict boat removal. It might make some sense if you could find out that they spent their $300,000 on other things, but you can't.

From the MYFWC web site:

Pursuant to section 328.72(15), Florida Statutes, the portion of vessel registration fees designated for the use of the counties, shall be used for providing recreational channel marking and other uniform waterway markers, public boat ramps, lifts, and hoists, marine railways, and other public launching facilities, derelict vessel removal, and removal of vessels and floating structures deemed a hazard to public safety and health.

If you look at the grant program counties are applying for funds to build boat ramps and other marine facilities which would seem to be covered under 328.72. The amount of money they are asking for is often far less than the county's allocation of registration money. So what are they doing with the registration money? Nobody knows, or at least they're not saying.

[Boatguy30]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I've been noticing since this anchoring restrictions thing got started, that compared to South Fl, the Panhandle is pretty much devoid of derelicts, and wondered why.
Well I think I got my answer last weekend, there were two derelicts in the Bay at Panama City, one has been raised and is in a slip at the city Marina, I'm sure awaiting disposal, the other has a big red sticker on it that sates if it's not removed by the owner in 5 days, it will be removed and disposed of.

It's an FWC sticker, quotes chapter 705, Florida Statues and goes on to say owner is liable for costs of removal, storage and publication of notice.


We have all been saying that derelict boats ought to be treated like abandoned cars, apparently at least in Panama City, they do.

5 days often turns into a few years. At least around here.

[Boatguy30]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Nobody wants this crap parked on front of their house, McMansion or not. I see no difference between a derelict boat and a car up on cinder blocks, except the car probably doesn't stink as bad.

Where in florida did you take that pic? Looks like the Rio Dulce to me on a rental mooring.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Boatguy30

Where in florida did you take that pic? Looks like the Rio Dulce to me on a rental mooring.

Halfway between the two city marina's in the bay. It caught my eye when I was out in the dinghy as I though it had to be a bilge keel and went over to take a look, it's obviously aground

[valhalla360]

So if my car dies, can I just tow it into your yard...because you can afford to have it disposed of?

The local citizens paying to remove them is treating the symptom. They may or may not have the money but they shouldn't have to pay for idiots trashing the waterway.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Boatguy30

5 days often turns into a few years. At least around here.

Yeah, I can see that, but it does illustrate that the mechanism for removal exists if they chose to, they in this case being the FWC I guess.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

So if my car dies, can I just tow it into your yard...because you can afford to have it disposed of?

The local citizens paying to remove them is treating the symptom. They may or may not have the money but they shouldn't have to pay for idiots trashing the waterway.

Unless measure to remove the data are taken, ownership of cars and boats aren't that hard to determine. Of course if you take those measures your making it obvious you intended to dump and I assume the law takes intent into account. But no obviously owner should pay. I think derelicts usually just sort of happen, people lose interest, can't or don't want to afford the thing anymore and just forget about it, I doubt most are "dumped".
You ought to go to a local country airport and see just how many airplanes there are sitting on flat, rotted out tires. Similar thing.

And I don't think local government pays for the clean up, I would think State does, but I think driving around in high power go fast boats is a whole lot more fun, so that is where the money goes I bet.