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Old 17-03-2015, 13:20   #31
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

I should like to see the official complaint, filed with the British and Spanish "state departments", and the subsequent explanation.


A UK-flagged vessel, assuming it was in fact UK-flagged, making passage through Spanish waters, would not be subject to search by Spanish authorities in that manner, would it? Or has the UK consented to unsupervised interdiction by the Spanish?


Someone still pissed about that Armada fail, are they?
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Old 17-03-2015, 13:28   #32
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

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I'm not surprised.. if it took you a month to get to Palma from Cadiz non-stop.. its only 600 miles if that..
Lol, but they dont know or they dont bother i stop along the way, Almerimar, Valencia Alicante, but hey in summer is the Kings Cup regatta in Palma, and those dam Levantes in summer in the Strait is a no no , take wait for weather....
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Old 17-03-2015, 13:30   #33
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

You guys just don't get it, do you? It is never really about drugs or smuggling or what have you. It's all about the control. Full time cruisers are probably the most independent minded people in any society. And the only way for "the man" to keep you in check is to board you periodically under whatever pretense is popular at the time. Least you get any funny ideas and pass them on to the sheeple ashore.
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Old 17-03-2015, 13:32   #34
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

Can a US flagged vessel travel more than 12 miles offshore and expect to be taken into port of a foreign nation? I have asked this question before and have not really gotten an answer. Any Coasties around?
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Old 17-03-2015, 13:43   #35
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

I don't know about being taken into port if > 12 miles offshore but there is an international agreement on stop and search in international waters.

Example, 300 miles out enroute to Bermuda from St Martin a USN vessel called me up on 16 and ordered me to heave to for boarding. when I questioned the caller he offered me the choice of waiting for a UK navy vessel that was 100s of miles away to come while I waited or just get it over with....

In the end he just questioned me over 16 without ever boarding while a helicopter took a closer look. (Humourless sons of bxxxhes arn't they, just always remind you of the "lighthouse joke")
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:01   #36
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

A few years ago a Swan 60, a 65 and a 68 all left Antigua at the same time heading for Palma. Obviously this meant a race. It was decided that the first boat in starts drinking. They stop drinking when the second boat comes in. The third boat pays the bar tab...

All 3 boats were planning on fueling up in Gibralter. We were the second boat in and looking good to hold on to second. However, as we were about to leave Gib. Customs showed up on the boat with a dog and several tool boxes. Needless to say we ended up stuck in Gib for two extra nights.

We finished 3rd. It was expensive. Last year I found out the boat that was in third "tipped"'off customs...! I am still plotting revenge...
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:05   #37
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

A professional smuggler woould keep sensitive material INSIDE a fuel tank, or atop inside the mast.

Not impossible, but unreacheable to 99,9% of those stupid controls we hear about :-)
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:13   #38
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

Newt, the problem is that laws (of your sovereign) apply, which can usually be searched online. But then, foreign treaties apply, and those are harder to find. Then there's the FUD that most uniforms want to apply, in order to gain more cooperation than they are entitled to.


I just wish more recreational sailors would follow USN standards. That is, when questioned about weapons or contraband, remember to declare that as you comply with US Navy standards and procedures, you can make no comment on whether you do or do not have any nuclear weapons onboard.


You may hear some member of the boarding party say "Captain, I think we're gonna need a bigger boat."


Last time I understood it, the USCG, courtesy of the US Congress, had many reciprocal arrangements BUT they are required to carry an officer of the foreign flag nation on board with them, before they can "share" his sovereignty over a vessel on the high seas.


Bear in mind, the War of 1812 was started over such matters as stopping a foreign flag vessel while on the high seas. I see no valid reason to change that. The Brits said they could stop who they pleased, Congress said uh, no, you can't.


These days...? I knew we shouldn't have thrown ALL the lawyers overboard in chains. We shoulda kept one on hand for reference.(G)
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:22   #39
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

With regards to the War of 1812, it was my understanding that the umbrage was taken over taking of our seamen to sail aboard the British ships.


Many years ago when I was in the Army, the MPs would run the dogs through the barracks looking for drugs and someone had sprinkled cayenne pepper on the floor and it put the dogs out of commission and really pissed off the MPs.
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:26   #40
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pirate Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

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Originally Posted by neilpride View Post
Lol, but they dont know or they dont bother i stop along the way, Almerimar, Valencia Alicante, but hey in summer is the Kings Cup regatta in Palma, and those dam Levantes in summer in the Strait is a no no , take wait for weather....
Europe has a centralised computor system.. every marina you book into files all your details into the data bank.. you likely got jumped in Palma for saying Plama was your next stop.. not your destination.
Lotta drugs come over from Morrocco all the time.. a fast boat can cross in 3-4 hrs.. or stop and do a transfer at sea..
Your runs port to port are timed one could say..
Mallorca/Ibiza however is to far for the speedboats/ribs so its often brought in by sailboat after a RAS... lotsa Luvvies looking to get high..
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:30   #41
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

Flying the Stars and Stripes is waving a red flag to some authorities. I get stopped and boarded by the Dutch Marchausee several times a summer. They are always polite and my papers are always in order.

The last time I was boarded, two of the officers boarded, a male and a female, checked my papers, the male officer went into my cabin and was looking around for five minutes, I was at the helm and we were motoring across the Wattensee.

High noon, bright sunny summer day.

The male officer came to the companionway inside the cabin and held up a baggie with about 3 grams of fine Dutch cannabis and asked me if I had any more.

I said "No."

He asked where I got it and I told him in my local coffeeshop.

He asked what did my two young boys think about it as he was waving the baggie around.

I told him I thought it was the first time they had ever seen it.

Then he asked me about my switchblade with the saw teeth.

I told him he took that out of my sailing jacket and it is a "one hand for the ship and one hand for the knife knife".

First time the authorities ever gave me my stash back.

I would not try to carry anything outside of The Netherlands.
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:34   #42
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

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Originally Posted by valhalla360 View Post
While it almost never happens, this is where I really wish we could hear the other side of the strory.

I guarantee there is more to it.
Of course there's more to it. It would take years and many encyclopedic sized volumes to even begin to convey everything that took place in an encounter like that. But your comment implies that the OP's condensed version is not substantially correct (in fact, you guarantee it) which seems like a pretty amazing assertion for someone who not only wasn't there but who doesn't even have conflicting reports from other sources on which to base his doubts. Seems like before essentially calling someone a liar, one might wait for evidence of such.
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:37   #43
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

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Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post


Last time I understood it, the USCG, courtesy of the US Congress, had many reciprocal arrangements BUT they are required to carry an officer of the foreign flag nation on board with them, before they can "share" his sovereignty over a vessel on the high seas.

.(G)
A verbal and faxed 'permission' to board a reciprocal agreement country is all that is required these days.

Ships of all sizes are readily exposed to public scrutiny and comprehensive regulations. Indeed ships may merit a lesser expectation of privacy than automobiles;

at sea, a person's expectation of privacy may be severely restricted compared with expectations of privacy on land.

The reduced expectation arises in part because of the long history of customs and safety inspections. Depending on the ships registry and its location, it may be subject to a limited search based on absolutely no evidence or even suspicion of wrongdoing. Clearly there is no expectation of privacy of the ship's position. Thus authorities can track a ships position without raising any constitutional issue.

Foreign vessels also may be boarded with the consent of the flag nation, usually upon showing of reasonable suspicion that the vessel is involved in illegal activity. The Coast Guard is entitled to detain a foreign vessel while awaiting the flag nation's consent. The flag nation's consent agreement to allow the Coast Guard to board a foreign vessel on the high seas recognises United States jurisdiction over the vessel. For example many Caribbean countries will consent to the boarding of their vessels upon a showing of reasonable suspicion.

An agreement with Great Britain permitted the stop and search of a British vessel within 150 miles of the United States.
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:39   #44
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

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Originally Posted by s/v Beth View Post
Can a US flagged vessel travel more than 12 miles offshore and expect to be taken into port of a foreign nation? I have asked this question before and have not really gotten an answer. Any Coasties around?
12nmi is territorial waters, 13-24nmi out is contiguous waters. This area is
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within which a state can exert limited control for the purpose of preventing or punishing "infringement of its customs, fiscal, immigration or sanitary laws and regulations within its territory or territorial sea".
If they feel you are violating any of the above, they can detain you up to 24nmi out.
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Old 17-03-2015, 14:47   #45
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Re: Deplorable behaviour from Marina manager and other yachties

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A few years ago a Swan 60, a 65 and a 68 all left Antigua at the same time heading for Palma. Obviously this meant a race. It was decided that the first boat in starts drinking. They stop drinking when the second boat comes in. The third boat pays the bar tab...

All 3 boats were planning on fueling up in Gibralter. We were the second boat in and looking good to hold on to second. However, as we were about to leave Gib. Customs showed up on the boat with a dog and several tool boxes. Needless to say we ended up stuck in Gib for two extra nights.

We finished 3rd. It was expensive. Last year I found out the boat that was in third "tipped"'off customs...! I am still plotting revenge...
Someone deserves a god beating, or worse, for that.
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