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Old 05-06-2010, 20:08   #376
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Yep, navionics on the iphone/ipod/ipad does not need a net connection to work. Just a GPS signal. I think the same applies too most if not all the other idevice charting software, ie inavx.


Which means that yep you don't need a wireless connection, once charts are downloaded they are stored on the device. I've been navigating around SE queensland for a few months with generally no phone reception and using an iphone as my sole means of navigation.

I've got too admit that a single purpose sunlight readable/waterproof chartplotter would be kinda handy. But they cost from $600-$4000 and the charts for them are alot more expensive. whereas an ipod+gps costs hundreds. I got my iphone cause i needed a new phone, so cost for nav was cost of navionics australia which i got on special for i think $10.
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Old 06-06-2010, 12:49   #377
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Thanks to James Baldwin, who sailed a Pearson Triton of 28 ft LOA around the world twice.
Jim has written many articles, delivered his share of boats, and cruised the nether regions of the world.

His views confirm what I and Capt Douglas have been saying.
GO SIMPLE, GO MODESTLY, GO YOUNG

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Old 06-06-2010, 12:54   #378
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Engines....

The man on a micro-budget may want an engine... Jim Baldwin recommends outboards.. I recommend simple diesels.. because they are more fuel efficient and today, the cost of fuel dominates.

I did some calculations using the tools I use to design propulsion systems for the yachts I design. Here are the results for the Southern Cross 31:
ENGINE CALCULATIONS
Water_Line_Length___25 ft
Displacement__13,500 lb__6_Tons
Boat_Speed_knots_____________4.00_______5.00______ __7.53
Speed_-_Length_Ratio_%______80.00%____100.00%_____150.50%
Resistance_/_ton_lb_____________6_________10__________47
Resistance____lb_______________42________70_______ __330.
Engine__hp_________________1.21______1.53________12.64
rpm__________________________738._____1096._______ _2200
Fuel_Consumption_gm/hp-hr______220______205_________190
L/hr__________________________0.29_____0.35_________ _2.67
Fuel_Cost_at_$_1_/_L_$/hr__$0.29____$0.35_______$2.67
Hourly_Operating_Cost______$0.80____$0.80_______$0 .80
TOTALOPERATING_COST _$1.09__$1.15____$3.47

The above numbers are for the Farymann 43 w engine, which is the most efficient of their small engines. What follows is a cost comparison of a yanmar engine vs the Farymann.

Yanmar Style Engine

10_hp_engine______1___$4,500.00___$4,500.00___4500 ___$1.000___
Trans(included)_____1____$500.00_____$500.00___450 0___$0.111___
coupling___________1____$400.00_____$400.00___9000 ___$0.044___
Seacock___________2____$100.00_____$200.00___9000_ __$0.011___
Hose_and_Fittings___1____$100.00_____$100.00___900 0___$0.011___
Muffler____________1____$200.00_____$200.00___9000 ___$0.022___
Thruhulls__________2____$120.00_____$240.00___9000 ___$0.013___
oil_cooler__________1____$160.00_____$160.00___450 0___$0.036___
shaft______________1____$200.00_____$200.00___9000 ___$0.022___
prop______________1____$200.00_____$200.00___9000_ __$0.022___
cutless_bearing_____1____$100.00_____$100.00___240 0___$0.042___
Hourly_Operating_Cost_____________________________ ___$1.34
Traditional styled engine with water pump">raw water pump and fresh water pump, heat exchanger, oil cooler, cooling water injected into exhaust riser. Requires quarterly zinc replacement on raw water circuit.
Farymann water cooled Engine 15 w

10_hp_engine_______1___$2,500.00___$2,500.00___450 0___$0.556___
Trans(included)_____0______500.00_______$0.00___90 00___$0.056___
coupling___________1_____$400.00_____$400.00___900 0___$0.044___
Seacock____________0____$100.00_______$0.00____900 0___$0.011___
Hose_and_Fittings___0_____$100.00______$0.00____90 00___$0.011___
Muffler____________1_____$200.00_____$200.00___900 0___$0.022___
Thruhulls___________0_____$120.00______$0.00____90 00___$0.013___
Shaft______________1_____$200.00_____$200.00___900 0___$0.022___
prop_______________1_____$200.00____$200.00___9000 ___$0.022___
cutless_bearing______1_____$100.00____$100.00___24 00___$0.042___
Hourly_Operating_Cost_____________________________ ____$0.80
Note the Farymann diesel is air cooled, no water touches the engine
The engine uses a dry exhaust. There is no oil cooler or heat exchanger or raw water pump or fresh water pump or seacock or raw water plumbing.


The simpler Farymann engine costs only 60% of the Yanmar's cost.


INDY
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Old 06-06-2010, 13:07   #379
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[QUOTE=troymclure;464017]Yep, navionics on the iphone/ipod/ipad does not need a net connection to work. Just a GPS signal. I think the same applies too most if not all the other idevice charting software, ie inavx.


Which means that yep you don't need a wireless connection, once charts are downloaded they are stored on the device. I've been navigating around SE queensland for a few months with generally no phone reception and using an iphone as my sole means of navigation.

I've got too admit that a single purpose sunlight readable/waterproof chartplotter would be kinda handy. But they cost from $600-$4000 and the charts for them are alot more expensive. whereas an ipod+gps costs hundreds. I got my iphone cause i needed a new phone, so cost for nav was cost of navionics australia which i got on special for i think $10.[/QUOTE

Thank you for mentioning the expense of a chart plotter system. Since electronics are involved, life expectancy of such a system is likely about 5 years... The charts don't come for nothing as you mention...

So.... Chart Plotter SIMRAD $ 1600
Charts for East Coast us $ 200
Charts for Caribbean $ 200
Total $ 2000 / 5 years = $ 400 / year.

Can the man on a micro-budget afford this? How many excursions ashore is this stuff worth?
Remember our budget....
Our annual cruising budget now is:
Maintenance and Repair __$ 970
Provisions _____________ $ 2,400 ( diet high in legumes, )
Entry & Clearance Fees ___$ 150
Fuel____________________$ 100 ( LPG for galley stove )
Mooring & Marina Fees ___$ -0-
Communication __________$ 200
Excursions/ Entertainment_$ 800
Navigation ______________-$ 700
Insurance, Boat___________ $ -0-
Insurance Health__________ $ 240 (money put in rainy day fund)
Souvenirs ________________$ 150
Clothing and Sundries______$ 290

TOTAL ___________________$ 6,000

INDY
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Old 06-06-2010, 13:16   #380
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Homebuilt Windvanes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v Breakaway View Post
"a homebuilt wind vane" goprisko, can you point me to assembly info for a homebuilt windvane? Thanks
There is a book you can buy through Amazon...
The Windvane Self-Steering Handbook (Hardcover)


Self-Steering for Sailing Craft (Hardcover)


Self-steering for sailboats (Hardcover)


And the classic............

WIND-VANE SELF STEERING
By Bill Belcher. Pbk, perfect bound, 240mm x 170mm, 128 pages, monochrome plans and tables.
This classic book describes the theory, principles and practice of wind vanes for self steering. It tells the blue water sailor how to construct his own wind-vane self steering system, including full working drawings.
Wind-vane Self Steering is generally regarded world wide as the definitive work on this topic and currently, as far as we know, is the only such work generally available. NZ$40.00 + Delivery


INDY
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Old 06-06-2010, 13:24   #381
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w1651 - I'm still at the planning stage for this, but I have assembled a spreadsheet of things I know I will have to spend money on and (at today's prices) it comes to about 800 per month (= $1200) and I'm sure that's a minimum. I'm planning a 30-39 footer and at the minute I'm very taken with the Hunter Legend 33, ideally in a bilge keel version.

Hunter Hunter Legend 33 used boat for sale. The Yacht Market online boat sales and charters.
The Hunter is a boat built to a price.. not a strong boat I see they are going for $75,000 GBP... Lots of money there....

INDY
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Old 06-06-2010, 13:25   #382
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Hummous and arabic bread - yum yum. With cucumbers and sweetcorn. Delicious. Also, sarge bread (looks like pancakes, never seen it outside Kuwait) stuffed with tons of salad. Just found a recipe for chapattis - gonna go practise now. Flour and water with a drop of oil - how difficult can that be....??

Sushi - yep, made some the other day, but although it's way cheaper, it's just never as good as at the sushi bar! My crab/salmon/avocado salad is getting there though - I've figured out to use a potato peeler to make those really thin slices of cucumber!
Can you offer other favorites ?

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Old 06-06-2010, 13:38   #383
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Aaza Dana wrote "flour and water with a drop of oil-how difficult can that be?"
I ask how nutritious/tasty could it be?
I think if you tried to feed that to criminals in jail they would sue you for cruelty.
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Old 06-06-2010, 13:42   #384
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Aaza Dana wrote "flour and water with a drop of oil-how difficult can that be?"
I ask how nutritious/tasty could it be?
I think if you tried to feed that to criminals in jail they would sue you for cruelty.
heh. not much baking experience huh?

Most of the worlds breads are flour water and a drop of something. Sometimes oil, sometimes yeast, sometimes just flour and water.

Ever had a tortilla?

Nice thing aboard about flat bread (unrisen, no yeast) is it keeps longer. English muffins have a wonderful shelf life as well.
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Old 06-06-2010, 13:57   #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nonam View Post
Aaza Dana wrote "flour and water with a drop of oil-how difficult can that be?"
I ask how nutritious/tasty could it be?
I think if you tried to feed that to criminals in jail they would sue you for cruelty.

follow chapatti recipe but after rolling spread with butter, fold in half... spread again and fold... re-roll and fry in pan with a spot of oil... and you have a Parhatta... delicious... with sweet or savoury spread...
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Old 06-06-2010, 14:06   #386
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heh. not much baking experience huh?

Most of the worlds breads are flour water and a drop of something. Sometimes oil, sometimes yeast, sometimes just flour and water.

Ever had a tortilla?

Nice thing aboard about flat bread (unrisen, no yeast) is it keeps longer. English muffins have a wonderful shelf life as well.
The bread is just the binder. It's what you put on it that counts. Remember we're Americans here. We can make a sandwich or Taco outta anything...
My Ex used to make whoe cake for me. She hated it because she grew up poor and had to eat it all the time as a kid. I loved it and could not get enough of it. Just flour water and a lil oil in a cast iron skillet. I'll eat Sarafinas cooking any day of the week.
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Old 06-06-2010, 17:12   #387
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As Capt. Douglas mentions above, it is essential the boat be "well Found" and the best place to do that is where supplies and equipment are "cheap".

Having refitted Pegasus in various countries around the world, there is nothing like home... Your home country is the best place to fit out your boat. You know the suppliers, how business works, there are no currency conversion issues, and you know the way to get a place to work on the boat at the cheapest price.
INDY touches on something I discovered during my extended (albeit non-boaty) wanderings RTW over many years..........knowing where you are is cheaper. far cheaper than being new somewhere. And by that I don't mean checking your chart but knowing the things that INDY describes above.....but even more importantly (IME) is knowing people. people onshore.

IMO for a boat owner the biggest resource is...........the land. and all the stuff folks have built on it (over the last couple of Millenia folks ashore have been busy ). and as important are the folks on land themselves...........of course a line between seizing opportunities as and when they arise and simply sponging off the good will of folks (ashore and afloat........have met plenty of folks in distant shores who like the maxim of "I'm living on a dollar a day - yours" ) - and the line is drawn in different places by everyone, whether sponger or spongee .

Folks on land have useful things that (most?) boats don't. Like cars. workshops. tools. baths and an ability to lend a hand - if they want to / have an incentive to............and the folks themselves have something that simply can't be bought. A lifetime of local knowledge. And onshore their are simply more opportunities to work / trade / do business than afloat (their is a reason why all the economically succesful countries are on land ) - and by onshore in this case I am meaning beyond the Marina

The secret to cheap cruising is therefore:

a) don't go anywhere (else)

and

b) go onto land.




Of course that kinda takes the point out of "cruising" by boat but life is full of compromises. and the less money yer have the more compromises needed.........and smarts yer need to actually use.

Apart from the fact I would go loopy (er? ) if I simply stayed onboard 90% of the time (I've seen Seagulls before. and water ) if I ever leave the dock on a extended cruise I suspect the challenge (for me) will be less about seeing new & exciting foreign lands (got a few T-shirts already) but more about doing so in a manner that does not bore me sh#tless within shortorder and is sustainable financially - the latter is kinda complicated by the fact that I am happier at the end of a year if I have more in the pot than when I started, sometimes that means I have to work more / harder than I would like sometimes it means I am not happier at the end of year .........but overall I guess it means that I don't want to spend $500 a month. I want that added to my pot at year end Fortunately? (for me) work often meets the need for a challenge - which leads on to the ever popular qusetion: "how to make money whilst cruising?".............

Well, y'all will just have to wait until I've finished my new book "how I went cruising and earned a million dollars a month by selling folks a book on how to cruise on $500 a month" ..........but as a clue, it's based around what Geese do. migrate accross the world. Have you ever seen a poor goose? No?, I thought not

So that's an additional secret to cheap cruising:-

c) have lots of money.


It's been a longgggggggg day
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Old 06-06-2010, 22:51   #388
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The secret to cheap cruising is therefore:

a) don't go anywhere (else)

and

b) go onto land.

This, my friend is why these threads don't provide the infomation real people need.
Its very difficult to work out a budget from home and expect it to be anything like reality in the context of a world cruise.

One great example we read about virtually every day on Cruisersfoum is buy it cheap on Ebay. Well cruising internationaly you can't use Ebay!!!!!!

Anyway, there's people who will belive any gold pot at the end of a rainbow and they will not be swayed by anything I say. And those that realise the reality don't need to be told they are wise

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Old 07-06-2010, 04:47   #389
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Well, y'all will just have to wait until I've finished my new book "how I went cruising and earned a million dollars a month by selling folks a book on how to cruise on $500 a month"
Can people planning on crusiing for $500/month afford to buy your book? Sounds like making a product to service a market that can not/will not be able to buy it
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Old 07-06-2010, 06:01   #390
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. . . One great example we read about virtually every day on Cruisersfoum is buy it cheap on Ebay. Well cruising internationaly you can't use Ebay!!!!!!
Anyway, there's people who will believe any gold pot at the end of a rainbow and they will not be swayed by anything I say. And those that realise the reality don't need to be told they are wise
Mark
- - That is pretty much what happens on these types of forums - - "pipe dreamers" smoking some good stuff that makes anything in the world possible and the "pot of gold" an arm's reach away. Reality is a bummer sometimes especially when it involves money.
- - If you have money you probably got it by being "cheap/frugal" and can afford the necessary "stuff" to be able to cruise economically. But spending a quarter million, plus or minus, outfitting a boat so you can cruise on $500/mo for a year or two is not what life is all about. Camping out is fun for a weekend or maybe a week, but then you want your "life back."
- - If you cannot spend significant money to purchase and re-fit a boat then you must want and enjoy living the life-style of the "under the bridge homeless" person. Because actually cruising on $500/mo is going to be just like living like an "under the bridge homeless" person. Nothing wrong with that if it is your "stlick." They certainly have less paperwork and bureaucrats to deal with.
- - This is the 21st Century and what was possible a decade or two or three ago is not possible today unless you multiply that amount of money by 2 or 3 or 4 to equal what the money purchased back then. Just replaced a water pump that cost me $250 ten years ago - cost me $400 today. Same pump.
- - Oh - "eBay" - yes you can purchase stuff at a fraction of the new cost in a boat store. I do it all the time. You must have a USA (or other major home country) address that is attached to your credit cards and the item must be shipped to that address. Then a friend/relative/agent then ships the item to you via normal international mail/express. The freight/postage will be the same if you have the expensive boat store ship it to you - but - the cost of the part/item will be significantly cheaper so you save that portion of the overall cost of getting the item to you. Normal post office shipments are usually 1/4 or less than express parcel services but take two weeks to a month to get to you. Express parcel services take 2 to 4 days.
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