Crocodiles in the Kimberley

[Seaslug Caravan]

Originally Posted by Capt Rottnest

One thing you can do is swim at a wide clear beach, with lots of vision all round and can see if it is croc free. This is done all the time, as those nasty jelly stingers are still a QLD and NT only problem.



I was told by a local, Kimberley crocs don't get to eat the large livestock and kangaroos which the NT ones do, thus they aren't as big. But generally, they tend to be a non issue. You'd have to be unlucky.

Sir, I'll be as polite as I can with my reply.
I think you are mistaken on all of the above.
Have a nice day

[Capt Rottnest]

Originally Posted by Seaslug Caravan

Sir, I'll be as polite as I can with my reply.
I think you are mistaken on all of the above.
Have a nice day

I'll return the politeness. I'm from WA, there is no evidence of the existence of some of the more dangerous species of Irukandji in that state. Not what QLD has. As for what the respective crocodiles eat, I'll give you that, I'm only relaying from a Kimberley local.
Hope you have a nice day too.

[SimonV]

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Wotname]

Well it seems this thread has been re-invigorated some so perhaps I can add the following information which I believe is correct but cannot verify with scientific papers and so on .

This is data that I picked from conversations during the late 70's and early 80's with a couple of old croc shooters from Cape York ( now deceased). I stress these guys were solitary bush-men who made their livelihood (in large part) from shooting crocs for skins; they were not croc farmers or tourist operators or environment researchers. I followed their advice and found it be factual.

Crocs are:

solitary (at least old ones are)
they feel secure only when in water
if you surprise a croc on land, it will make for the water in the fastest, shortest manner possible; if you are between it and the water, you are in big trouble.
they are top of the food chain when fully grown
they prefer to hunt from the the water, not the land
they are suspicious of anything unusual
they will normally only attack when they are sure of success; hence they will watch for a pattern to develop before attacking.
however all bets are off when females are nesting

[RaymondR]

It,s a fallacy that drop bears hang by their teeth; they hang upside down like bats by the spurs on their back legs.

[Winf]

Originally Posted by Capt Rottnest

I'm from WA, there is no evidence of the existence of some of the more dangerous species of Irukandji in that state. Not what QLD has.

Please remember that the Irukandji jellyfish are different from the large box jellyfish, chironex fleckeri. Also there are a number of small box jellyfish that can cause Irukandji Syndrome.

James Cook University though considers that the large box jellyfish and jellyfish causing Irukandji Syndrome both can and do occur on the WA coast.

The university is pretty much a world leader in research on these critters and has some good info regarding both species on this site.

TASRU - Distribution

A friend of mine received a very small sting from a chironex box jellyfish caught in his cast net and likened it to a constant stream of molten metal being poured onto his arm.

I would want to be very, very sure there were none around before I got in the water without a stinger suit. I am ex north Qld and have a very health respect for them. Not sure your comment paints the full picture and the potential danger on the tropical west coast.

Regards

Winf

[Capt Rottnest]

Interesting, you ask for replies from actual Kimberley cruisers and one of the few gets attacked by a googler. Some of the big charter boats even let their patrons swim at beaches they obviously feel are safe. Did you know that?

I don't suggest back stroking the entire beach, just a cooling dunk when it looks clear (on a crystal clear beach where you can see an easy 50m radius). Otherwise assume crocs are everywhere. Sure, there are some dangerous stingers in the ocean, somewhere, maybe a million to one chance is enough to turn you off swimming forever, its your choice. The picture I "paint" is that deadly jellies are never mentioned or even thought of as a hazard in tropical WA, what with all the bare backed beach frolicking in Broome and Cape Leveque... But you're entitled to your opinion.

Originally Posted by Winf

Please remember that the Irukandji jellyfish are different from the large box jellyfish, chironex fleckeri. Also there are a number of small box jellyfish that can cause Irukandji Syndrome.

James Cook University though considers that the large box jellyfish and jellyfish causing Irukandji Syndrome both can and do occur on the WA coast.

The university is pretty much a world leader in research on these critters and has some good info regarding both species on this site.

TASRU - Distribution

A friend of mine received a very small sting from a chironex box jellyfish caught in his cast net and likened it to a constant stream of molten metal being poured onto his arm.

I would want to be very, very sure there were none around before I got in the water without a stinger suit. I am ex north Qld and have a very health respect for them. Not sure your comment paints the full picture and the potential danger on the tropical west coast.

Regards

Winf

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Capt Rottnest

Interesting, you ask for replies from actual Kimberley cruisers and one of the few gets attacked by a googler. Some of the big charter boats even let their patrons swim at beaches they obviously feel are safe. Did you know that?

I don't suggest back stroking the entire beach, just a cooling dunk when it looks clear (on a crystal clear beach where you can see an easy 50m radius). Otherwise assume crocs are everywhere. Sure, there are some dangerous stingers in the ocean, somewhere, maybe a million to one chance is enough to turn you off swimming forever, its your choice. The picture I "paint" is that deadly jellies are never mentioned or even thought of as a hazard in tropical WA, what with all the bare backed beach frolicking in Broome and Cape Leveque... But you're entitled to your opinion.

This post demonstrates (in a good way) the difficulty of providing advice to the OP.

The Kimberley is such a large area and covers such a lot of coastline than what is doable and fairly safe in one area doesn't necessarily translate to doable and safe in other areas. It also tells of the wonderful variation that occurs in this remote part of Oz.

For instance, what is applicable at say Cable Beach (Broome) is not so applicable say at Derby or Wyndham.

[GILow]

Just don't get downhill of a hoop snake. That's all I'm saying.

Matt


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[Winf]

Originally Posted by Capt Rottnest

Interesting, you ask for replies from actual Kimberley cruisers and one of the few gets attacked by a googler. Some of the big charter boats even let their patrons swim at beaches they obviously feel are safe. Did you know that?

I don't suggest back stroking the entire beach, just a cooling dunk when it looks clear (on a crystal clear beach where you can see an easy 50m radius). Otherwise assume crocs are everywhere. Sure, there are some dangerous stingers in the ocean, somewhere, maybe a million to one chance is enough to turn you off swimming forever, its your choice. The picture I "paint" is that deadly jellies are never mentioned or even thought of as a hazard in tropical WA, what with all the bare backed beach frolicking in Broome and Cape Leveque... But you're entitled to your opinion.

Sigh.

Just to be clear, I am not questioning or disputing your comments or experience on crocs. Taking a quick dip on a crystal clear beach is quite possibly a low risk croc attack activity. It is not an activity that I would do but hey, if a cooling swim is that important to you, fill your boots.

There is no question that crocs are present in the Kimberley. My original question post to the forum never mentioned swimming. I have no intention of swimming anywhere in the Kimberley that I am not totally confident there are no crocs. I was concerned primarily with attacks on our RHIB dinghy with us being in it or not and the general behaviour of Kimberley crocs and if they really were as bad as some of the stories I had heard. I have had many helpful responses to that.

My original post never mentioned jellyfish either. I am quite comfortable with managing the risk of tropical jellyfish having been born and raised in the tropics. Having an adult box jelly drift to within a few inches of my leg while standing in ankle deep crystal clear water tends to stick in the mind and heighten ones awareness of these creatures. Million to one shots can happen. I was lucky to spot it and leap clear. And this was despite my parents constant harping from a very young age to never, never get into the water during stinger season no matter how deep or clear unless your skin was fully covered up. Lycra wasnt about back then so we had to make do with pantyhose. Not an attractive look.

What I did question however was your comments on marine stingers and I refer to both the box jellyfish Chironex flickeri and the other various jellyfish responsible for irrukanki syndrome. These creatures are not simply dangerous, they can be fatal. Making a comment that there is no evidence of them being present on the WA coast is simply not correct. These jellyfish fully respect the sovereignty of the NT/WA border I suppose and dare not cross that line?

They are found in tropical waters throughout the world. We were warned about them when in the southern islands of Okinawa Japan a couple of years ago. There have been deaths there too.

Yes I know, I am just one of those pesky know nothing googlers but here are some links for anyone interested.

WA Department of Parks and Wildlife media release July 2013 (specifically advising tourism operators to be aware of the risk and first aid)
Irukandji warning for Ningaloo Reef - Department of Parks and Wildlife

The marine stinger advisory centre
World Distribution

Broome Shire Council
http://www.broome.wa.gov.au/pub/pdf/iruk.pdf

ABC Stateline Report
Stateline Western Australia

NT Health Department
http://www.health.nt.gov.au/library/...=pdf/26/02.pdf

National Geographic
Box Jellyfish, Box Jellyfish Pictures, Box Jellyfish Facts - National Geographic

Actually I am glad the topic has been raised though as I had not given marine stingers much thought for a while having been out of the tropics for a few years. It has given me the chance to brush up on some of the latest available information.

I am in no way suggesting that tropical waters of Australia are carpeted with huge fanged jellies just waiting to pounce on the first person to stick a toe in the water. That is most certainly not the case. There have been 60 or more stinger deaths in the past century for this country. Now this is well less than Aussie shark deaths for the same period but the potential exists and people simply need to be aware that a risk exists and how that risk can be mitigated. My previous comments and these were intended to do that. If you have taken them as an attack then frankly that is something that bothers me not in the least.
Winf

[chala]

My experience is that box jellyfish will try to avoid a swimmer. A two occasions when swimming box jellyfish did avoid me by changing direction, box jellyfish do swim. I came to the conclusion that box jellyfish have no interest in getting entangled as they may also perish. By standing and watching for the tentacles to pass will make easier for the box jellyfish to avoid a swimmer. I have been stung by other type of tentacles, mostly by the one hard to see, in Bali and each time I went swimming in Queensland I got stung by something. I do not mind swimming in proximity of box jellyfish so long I or some one else keep an eye on them.

[Capt Phil]

We non-Aussies are always overwhelmed by the politeness of Aussies to each other and the rest of the world. Once you leave for a few years, unfortunately you change into the nasty disposition the rest of us demonstrate on a regular basis! Phil

[chala]

Drop Bear - Australian Museum
nothing to compare with a Gadicha

[Pelagic]

Brilliant!

[Wotname]

I'm at a loss to know why Drop bears are being featured in this thread; they are simply not present in the Kimberley and never were. In fact they are not found anywhere in Northern Australia AFAIK.

I do believe that the Gadicha is a Kimberley resident but I have very little knowledge of them, perhaps Chala may be so kind as to elucidate.