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Old 07-10-2012, 19:55   #31
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

[Q



Here's a tip for you, Chief. Don't quit your day job.[/QUOTE]

My day job, after 50 years in the boat business, is to laugh at people like you who think they just invented the wheel.
Hint: if you want to preach, buy some time on a Sunday morning cable channel
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Old 07-10-2012, 20:58   #32
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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Old 07-10-2012, 21:06   #33
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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You nitpick the semantics...
You attributed a statement to me which I did not make. This is hardly "semantics". It is a complete falsehood.
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Old 07-10-2012, 21:12   #34
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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You attributed a statement to me which I did not make. This is hardly "semantics". It is a complete falsehood.
Post #9 in this thread, yesterday at 12:27. Perhaps you would like to retract your previous statement.

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Why not argue that since the military can posess and use nuclear weapons, you should be able to as well? Government entities acting on the behalf of the citizens have always been held to different standards than private individuals.
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Old 07-10-2012, 21:34   #35
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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Post #9 in this thread, yesterday at 12:27. Perhaps you would like to retract your previous statement.
Jeezus, can you get anything right? You absolutely said I compared sewage to nuclear weapons. I never said that, never inferred it, never intimated it. What I did was use analogy about private ownership of nuclear weapons to make my point about government entities not having to follow the same rules as individuals.

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By using a valid argument like comparing sewage to nuclear weapons?
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Old 07-10-2012, 21:45   #36
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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Originally Posted by fstbttms View Post
Jeezus, can you get anything right? You absolutely said I compared sewage to nuclear weapons. I never said that, never inferred it, never intimated it. What I did was use analogy about private ownership of nuclear weapons to make my point about government entities not having to follow the same rules as individuals.
Perhaps you should try reading my posts.

For example, pertaining to your comments above I responded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
OK, I'll be more precise. What you did was compare my issue about different standards for sewage dumping by individuals and municipalities to individuals vs the military owning nuclear weapons.
So, since you wanted to nitpick on the semantics I corrected my statement to reflect exactly what you said.

Or like a previous post where I said

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Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
Before anyone gets excited, I'm not advocating flushing your head into the local harbor but complaining that larger polluters are not held to the same standards as boaters.
And you said in the very next post.

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Originally Posted by fstbttms View Post
While nobody is a fan of municipal sewage spills, the fact that they occur (spilling the waste that you and I put into the system, BTW) doesn't mean that boaters should get a free pass too.
Is it possible to get narc'd on the surface?

Don't see anything positive about boating coming from further participation. Before this deteriorates further I think it best for me to unsubscribe from this thread.
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Old 07-10-2012, 21:54   #37
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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think it best for me to unsubscribe from this thread.
Yeah, heaven forbid you get into a discussion with someone.

BTW- I don't refute most of the points you've here. But you did intentionally misquote me in an attempt to make my position appear invalid. And you steadfastly refuse to acknowledge that you did this. So at the very least I got an insight into your debating tactics.
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Old 07-10-2012, 21:56   #38
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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My concern is what do you do in ten years, if it really does last that long. Now you have a hull coated with a copper/epoxy mix that could be really hard to remove.

So, do the directions for Coppercoat address how to get it off when it's time to re-apply or you want to switch to something different? If the process is anything like peeling the bottom for a blister job it could be quite expensive, which would wipe out a lot of the savings.
Why would you want to remove it? Its epoxy think of it as another barrier coat. Just abraid & apply your AF of choice overtop.
The whole reason I am mixing copper with barrier coat is I may as well as
the barrier coat has got to go on anyway.
I am not using water base epoxy as barrier. (100% solids west sys)
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Old 07-10-2012, 22:15   #39
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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Originally Posted by fstbttms View Post
Yeah, heaven forbid you get into a discussion with someone.

BTW- I don't refute most of the points you've here. But you did intentionally misquote me in an attempt to make my position appear invalid. And you steadfastly refuse to acknowledge that you did this. So at the very least I got an insight into your debating tactics.
OK last post and I'm going to bed. First, what you are posting I don't consider a discussion. I've had plenty of discussions and this ain't one.

Second, I did not directly quote you in the statement you referred to. Quote means to use the exact words of the other person. Maybe you should try to be more precise.

Nor did I intentionally misrepresent what you said. I wrote something, an off hand paraphrase that incorrectly related to your comparison. I immediately corrected that in my next post. I have repeated the correction. I will say here as clearly and simply as I can.

What I wrote in post #15 was not correct. You never compared sewage directly with nuclear weapons.

Again, once and for all, I retract that specific statement and apologize for my lack of precision.


So can you get over it? Maybe take a deep breath, count to ten and read what I actually said in all the other posts?
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Old 07-10-2012, 22:18   #40
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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Originally Posted by lateral View Post
Why would you want to remove it? Its epoxy think of it as another barrier coat. Just abraid & apply your AF of choice overtop.
The whole reason I am mixing copper with barrier coat is I may as well as
the barrier coat has got to go on anyway.
I am not using water base epoxy as barrier. (100% solids west sys)
Not immediately but if one keeps a boat many years, or buys a used boat that someone else has had many years, this stuff could build up to a thick, heavy coat on the bottom.

Besides, I already have one epoxy barrier coat.

PS What's AF?
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Old 07-10-2012, 22:28   #41
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

PS What's AF?

Sorry, antifoul. Being lazy.
Also my boat is essentially a new bottom so I guess I am happy to put as many mm's of epoxy between the briny and my strip planks.

BTW...what is the drum on nano-particle AF?
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Old 08-10-2012, 01:15   #42
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

To Skipmac - a full treatment of Coppercoat is approximately 250 microns thick, reducing to about 200 microns over a 10 year period. After twenty years, by which it's down to roughly 150 microns the chances are that it will need topping up. This is the stage we have reached in the Uk, where the very first boats treated (in the early 1990's) and now being retreated. These vessels are having a new 250 thick coating applied over the original. There is no need to remove the original.

After, say 30 years, the treatment would have a total thickness of about 350 microns, which is thinner than a standard anti-osmosis treatment of West System at about 600 microns. So, the thick and heavy build up you mention doesn't actually happen. In my 20 years of working with Coppercoat I've not known anyone remove it due to build up - you simply leave it (so it can carry on providing physical protection) and paint over it.

And should you (or a future owner) wish to change to a different AF system, fine. Simply abrade the surface of the Coppercoat and apply the chosen AF on top.
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Old 08-10-2012, 06:31   #43
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

Quote:
Originally Posted by lateral View Post
PS What's AF?

Sorry, antifoul. Being lazy.
Also my boat is essentially a new bottom so I guess I am happy to put as many mm's of epoxy between the briny and my strip planks.

BTW...what is the drum on nano-particle AF?
Ah, AF, antifouling, I should have guessed. Maybe a language difference. Here in the southern US I might have said BP (bottom paint).

Have not yet seen any reports on the nano-particle BP. Have do a little research to see if anyone has done any independent testing.
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:17   #44
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

Quote:
Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
Not immediately but if one keeps a boat many years, or buys a used boat that someone else has had many years, this stuff could build up to a thick, heavy coat on the bottom.

Besides, I already have one epoxy barrier coat.

PS What's AF?
If it's just basically epoxy why would it present any more of a problem putting an anti-foul over it than normal?

And if it really lasts 10 years that's a lot less build up than if one is using a hard bottom paint every couple of years.

I'm just asking as my bottom probably needs to be stripped because the last owner used hard paint each year. So afterward I will have a fresh bottom and have to decide the way to go.
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:30   #45
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Re: Coppercoat bottom paint

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The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
I've noticed it's always bluer around the bottom-cleaning diver too; or redder, sometimes blacker or whiter ... depends.
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