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08-06-2015, 15:16
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#16
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 2,492
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
Yesterday I heard the Vessel Traffic Service (VTS) make an announcement on 16, that a ship was southbound and would be heading under the Bay Bridge, bound for the South Bay anchorage, and would all the sailboats south of the western section of the Bay Bridge please get out of the way! I've not heard one of those announcements before.
The wind was very light and the tide flooding, so a number of us were basically tacking back and forth in the same spot south of the bridge. I started the engine, and with generous use of it, stayed about a ship length (his length, not mine!) away. The boat behind me did not, and got the 5 horns and got a bit too close for comfort, crossing in front of the container ship's bow.
The scary thing was how quickly this all happened.
__________________
Bristol 31.1, SF Bay.
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08-06-2015, 15:20
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#17
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
T-shirt for sale on the high street, Cowes, Isle of Wight.
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08-06-2015, 15:35
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#18
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: puget sound washington
Boat: 1968 Islander bahama 24 hull 182, 1963 columbia 29 defender. hull # 60
Posts: 12,121
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkSF
Yesterday I heard the Vessel Traffic Service (VTS) make an announcement on 16, that a ship was southbound and would be heading under the Bay Bridge, bound for the South Bay anchorage, and would all the sailboats south of the western section of the Bay Bridge please get out of the way! I've not heard one of those announcements before.
The wind was very light and the tide flooding, so a number of us were basically tacking back and forth in the same spot south of the bridge. I started the engine, and with generous use of it, stayed about a ship length (his length, not mine!) away. The boat behind me did not, and got the 5 horns and got a bit too close for comfort, crossing in front of the container ship's bow.
The scary thing was how quickly this all happened.
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About 5 minutes to the mile. Had an idiot try to stop us from deployment back in the mid 80's wind surfer verses carrier (uss carl vinson cvn 70) not to smart it he did survive to go to prison his board was in little bitty pieces after our screws got done we didn't feel a thing.
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08-06-2015, 15:46
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#19
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Boat: Beneteau Oceanis 51.1
Posts: 584
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
So that's San Diego, and it appears to be the Dole fruit carrier that makes regular transits in an out of the bay to the 10th Street terminal.
For sail traffic, that's a slightly heavy weekend. The channel in San Diego is a restricted maneuvering area of course, so the freighters have the right of way. The vast majority of sailors know the rules and keep clear. The Navy escorts its ships in and out with small boats that will clear you out of the way these days, but most commercial ships are unescorted.
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08-06-2015, 15:47
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#20
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Carlsbad, CA
Boat: 1976 Sabre 28-2
Posts: 7,505
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
Most of these container ships are not maneuverable AT ALL in confined ships channels. There is just not enough space or time for them to either slow down, stop or turn. Have often seen the ships towing a tug pointed in the opposite direction. The tug is there to slow the ship down. These big guys are direct drive and there diesels operate over a very small rpm range. They cannot throttle them back to slow down to very slow speeds. Not sure how or if they actually have a reverse gear so they could even try and stop. Do they stop the engine and start it up going backwards for reverse???
__________________
Peter O.
'Ae'a, Pearson 35
'Ms American Pie', Sabre 28 Mark II
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08-06-2015, 16:22
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#21
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: puget sound washington
Boat: 1968 Islander bahama 24 hull 182, 1963 columbia 29 defender. hull # 60
Posts: 12,121
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
Actually they operate anywhere from as low as twenty rpm to a high and more eficient 80 to 85 rpm Some of the smaller freighters have variable pitch propellers and constant rpm engines so varying the pitch for reverse . On the really big ones they literally stop the engine and restart in reverse.
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08-06-2015, 17:48
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#22
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 20,420
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
If the camera is where the navigator is then the ship could be in breach of the regulations for visibility from the bridge.
Sure thing the officer and the sailors had some fun that day. ;-)
b.
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08-06-2015, 17:58
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#23
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caribbean live aboard
Boat: Camper & Nicholson58 Ketch - ROXY Traverse City, Michigan No.668283
Posts: 6,356
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbodine88
Plus they are probably not well manned enough to keep a watch on the bow, just in case some one tries sailing in front of that crane.
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Most do keep watch in a crowd. Many have live video feed.
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08-06-2015, 18:07
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#24
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,586
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
Quote:
Originally Posted by newhaul
That's not what I meant and you know it as a ticket carrier yourself I meant to point out they were aware of idiots in the area therefore should have and likely did have extra watchstanders on the bow area in radio contact with the bridge to minimise the likely hood of an unfortunate incident. But you are correct. DQ a few of the idiots and I'm sure the situation will improve for real sailors. Trying to make a living.
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Apologies
Thought you were one of the racers..
__________________
It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
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08-06-2015, 18:15
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#25
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: puget sound washington
Boat: 1968 Islander bahama 24 hull 182, 1963 columbia 29 defender. hull # 60
Posts: 12,121
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61
Apologies
Thought you were one of the racers..
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Nope retired navy engineer no worries
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08-06-2015, 18:19
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#26
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Nevada City. CA
Boat: Sceptre 41
Posts: 3,857
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
A few years ago I was late starting the Baja Ha Ha and a submarine was heading out or coming in. I was on there with future Ex and kids. This guy in a Rib with a machine gun on the bow comes up to me and tells me I needed to be 500 yards away from the submarine. In a calm voice I asked him, " Sir that would put me on shore. What would you like me to do? He told me to get out of the shipping channel and he would stay in between the sub and my boat.
__________________
Fair Winds,
Charlie
Between us there was, as I have already said somewhere, the bond of the sea. Besides holding our hearts together through long periods of separation, it had the effect of making us tolerant of each other's yarns -- and even convictions. Heart of Darkness
Joseph Conrad
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08-06-2015, 18:41
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#27
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: cornwall uk
Posts: 574
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
You can tell its a cruisers forum
i think you might find that most racers would make most cruisers look silly when it come to colregs, if you have ever attended a protest hearing you will find most decent helms are more like barrister when it comes to deciphering the rules.
Yep it maybe boys/ girls playing games in you eyes but I didn't see a collision and would suggest more cruisers hit stationary objects like a safe water mark in a 4 knot tidal stream! Than racers hitting a commercial vessel
I have seen more cruiser near misses who haven't a clue what to do when entering a port with limited space during a race.
Those that race in close quarters just look at these big boys as another fleet of racers on a starboard tack, the advantage is that they know they are going to stay on course and maintain there speed ( they have no option!) I would suggest they know the risk but push the boundary of the rules and know very well the consequences
Just balancing the discussion
Sent from my iPad.......i apologise for the auto corrects !!!
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08-06-2015, 19:00
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#28
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: cornwall uk
Posts: 574
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Container Ship and Saliboats
On another point, have a look at a AIS screen in a traffic separation scheme in the English Chanel , these big boys rely on other professionals in the scheme to do the right thing.but I have seen as many cruisers push the boundaries just the same when crossing them, it may not be a sound signal used, but i have heard some fairly irate VHF transmissions
18 knots closes the ground pretty quickly on a collision course.!
Sent from my iPad.......i apologise for the auto corrects !!!
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09-06-2015, 00:28
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#30
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: Container Ship and Saliboats
Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61
Try Poole harbour on any Sat in the summer when the many club race fleets are out.. Barfluer and others are on the horn all the time..
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I have
Pure madness.
I've had racers shake their fists at me because I didn't divert out of the channel when they tacked right under my bows where I can't even see them . I considered explaining that I can't navigate outside of the channel at all with my draft, then decided not to bother.
Sailors in the US complain about motorboaters. In the UK, the motorboaters are, with rarest exceptions, the most polite and considerate folks out on the water. Over here it's the sail racers who cause all the trouble.
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