Choosing a boat for a Lifetime of Cruising..

[estarzinger]

Webb's current boat is Gannet, a Moore 24 . . . . GANNET ? GANNET is a Moore 24, one of the first ultra-light displacement boats from Santa Cruz, California, where she was launched in 1979. 156 Moore 24s were built in the late 1970s and 1980s. GANNET is hull number 40.? I?d harbored vague thoughts a

[Island Time O25]

Few years back I was having a conversation with my twice circumnavigator friend about the most terrifying experience that he had in all of his sailing life. Mind you this is a guy, who prior to becoming a full time livaboard cruiser 20 years ago, was a ship's captain (int'l unlimited tonnage license), competitive racer (we're talking way up there in qualifications), etc. He flatly stated that other than one delivery where he was misled as to condition of some system on board by hurrying owner, the only time he though he may really die was an underestimated and misjudged by weather service as to its direction, typhoon in the Sea of Japan where he got caught up in his 38ft glass on mahogany mono. And this is from a guy who has 100s of Ks nm on the water in his 45+ marine career.

Anyway, to get back to the OP. Same guy said that basically one should not be wasting one's time searching for the perfect boat but to get on with one's plans in the boat he/she can afford and sail comfortably. And once on the water and travelling, opportunities to acquire a better suited boat will come one's way together with an understanding of what one needs in a boat. After selling his 38footer he had various boats up to 51ft Formosa and ended up for the past 10 years with 46ft Dubois designed and Kiwi shop built former racer with a 9' keel picked up from a boatyard's donation for under $10K. But as he gets on in years and wants to be able to anchor in many more places than his current draft allows he says he is looking for a deal on a steel or aluminum cutter with lifting keel or a CB. He can't afford it not to be a deal but is happy with his current boat enough to just keep looking for that opportunity to present itself.

[colemj]

Originally Posted by estarzinger

Webb's current boat is Gannet, a Moore 24 . . . . GANNET ? GANNET is a Moore 24, one of the first ultra-light displacement boats from Santa Cruz, California, where she was launched in 1979. 156 Moore 24s were built in the late 1970s and 1980s. GANNET is hull number 40.? I?d harbored vague thoughts a

Wow, look at that! I haven't kept up with him. However, my point about him choosing boats that are hardly a popular choice for the OP's type of cruising still stands with this one also.

Mark

[thomm225]

Moore 24

MOORE 24 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Well, Robert, I don't think that your final comment about "less than stellar" is appropriate at all. Our decision to change boats wasn't due to our dissatisfaction with I-one, but due to a somewhat improved fiscal situation and the desire for enough room for kids and grandkids to visit. The latter hasn't proven to be a real factor, BTW... while some have visited, it is just too big a trip for busy families to make very often.

I will admit that the larger boat has meant an improvement in many aspect of our cruising and we feel very good about her, but don't feel that I-one was a bad choice at all. And I don't think that attributing it to luck is right either...

Jim

Sorry if my comment "less than stellar" was not appropriate, it was probably me living my own experiences when we sold our first cruising boat as my choice was certainly less than stellar. R

[colemj]

So tallying up the boats that fit the OP's stated style/use, we have a Heritage One Ton IOR racer, a 24' ULDB, two Lyle Hess BCC-types, a Shannon 37, a custom-designed Van de Stadt, a Deerfoot, and others that Evan mentioned whose boat types I don't know (but he describes them as very different).

Sounds like a dog's breakfast to me.

Mark

[colemj]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Moore 24

MOORE 24 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com

Yep, I agree with Jim's assessment of him marching to a different drummer! Hooboy, I wouldn't want to be crossing oceans in that!

Mark

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by colemj

So tallying up the boats that fit the OP's stated style/use, we have a Heritage One Ton IOR racer, a 24' ULDB, two Lyle Hess BCC-types, a Shannon 37, a custom-designed Van de Stadt, a Deerfoot, and others that Evan mentioned whose boat types I don't know (but he describes them as very different).

Sounds like a dog's breakfast to me.

Mark

Well take out the Moore 24 as Web is so unique a sailor that few if any fit into his class.

[colemj]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Well take out the Moore 24 as Web is so unique a sailor that few if any fit into his class.

Fair enough - can probably remove the Heritage also?

But he is doing long-term, regular ocean-crossing sailing, isn't he?

The definitions and criteria seem to be getting narrower...

Mark

[robert sailor]

Mark, give it a rest. For some reason you are ripped about this thread but I do not have a clue why. Evan, Jim, Larry and all the others mentioned fit into this catagory and there are more of course. Each of their choices are very unique and I am sure they have their reasons. Yes there are steel boats and aluminum boats and fiberglass boats and some are big and others are small. I haven't see anyone mention the high volume production boats as a choice and nor have they mentioned multihulls but I expect in time they will surface.

[Pelagic]

Robert, I commend you for trying, but......

Whenever I read of someone trying to define intangibles, I am reminded of this quote:

“We assign a moment to decision, to dignify the process as a timely result of rational and conscious thought. But decisions are made of kneaded feelings; they are more often a lump than a sum” Hannibal Lector..

I doubt if any cruiser could honestly say their choice is perfect, as boats are a series of compromises and the weight given to each feature, is as individual as the weight of each wave.

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Robert, I commend you for trying, but......

Whenever I read of someone trying to define intangibles, I am reminded of this quote:

“We assign a moment to decision, to dignify the process as a timely result of rational and conscious thought. But decisions are made of kneaded feelings; they are more often a lump than a sum” Hannibal Lector..

I doubt if any cruiser could honestly say their choice is perfect, as boats are a series of compromises and the weight given to each feature, is as individual as the weight of each wave.

Thanks for your thoughts however I was not interested in finding or being able to discribe the perfect boat but I am interested in the choices people make. I just believe that people that are voyaging for long periods of time make different choices than those who do not..on average. I don't think Evans would have made the decision to buy the boat he did if he was planning on cruising around the Med or Caribbean. Heart of Gold was a very quick boat and I remember reading about many of their passages, why would they own that boat to cruise Mexico? Closer to home Jim and Anne cruise on a a very unique boat and they must have had very good reasons for making that choice. These cruisers and the boats they cruise in are very interesting to me because by and large I see them as outliers in many ways, dancing to a different drummer if you will. Most of these folks could have decided on sailing what most of us sail but they didn't.

[oregonian]

Ahoy Robert sailor,
I found your OP question is well worded and leaves no ambiguity. My wife and I currently have 70,000+nm on our present boat and have made 29, non-stop passages of 2000nm or more. Our current boat is a Westsail-32. We previously owned a Westsail 42 but found it to be uncomfortably large. The W-32 has proven to be all the boat we've wanted in over 26 years of full time living aboard and voyaging and occasionally racing. (we are not currently living aboard and my wife may have made her last 2000 mile crossing)
Behind our boat in this same marina is another live-aboard voyaging boat that will never be making an appearance on this forum. They are currently preparing for their next adventure. A three year exodus to Japan. They are also on a Westsail-32.
Both of these Westsails are, of course, production boats, but both were owner completed.
Thanks.

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by oregonian

Ahoy Robert sailor,
I found your OP question is well worded and leaves no ambiguity. My wife and I currently have 70,000+nm on our present boat and have made 29, non-stop passages of 2000nm or more. Our current boat is a Westsail-32. We previously owned a Westsail 42 but found it to be uncomfortably large. The W-32 has proven to be all the boat we've wanted in over 26 years of full time living aboard and voyaging and occasionally racing. (we are not currently living aboard and my wife may have made her last 2000 mile crossing)
Behind our boat in this same marina is another live-aboard voyaging boat that will never be making an appearance on this forum. They are currently preparing for their next adventure. A three year exodus to Japan. They are also on a Westsail-32.
Both of these Westsails are, of course, production boats, but both were owner completed.
Thanks.

Thanks for your feed back. Your sailing resume is very impressive!

[JPA Cate]

robertsailor,

The crux of the matter is perceived value for purpose for costs. Yes, I agree you're looking at a population of extremely independent cruisers, AND the decisions as to vessels are made as processes, involving experience (which is what gives you your vessel type preferences, but is also affected by your values, desires, and available funding.

Experienced cruisers who like to spend time in the woop-woop (boonies, to Yanks) tend towards simplicity or reliability where "it" can't be simple. We'd rather play than play fix-it. The need for independence tends to keep us at a level, in terms of boat goodies, where we can fix things.

If you're harboring a desire for a circumnavigating boat, you'll probably have to learn more about what makes quality built. Read 3 or 4 yacht design texts, or look at successful boats. Like the aluminum Hawk.

There's lots of people who try to ask the question "what is the minimum quality build boat that you would take to sea?" and all the experienced offshore sailors have different opinions, just like Chiles, Starzinger, Pardeys, the Corenmans, Boatman61, and other great world sailors. For instance, some friends of ours are on the way back to Oz after a trip that included Bluff, NZ, the Australs, Alaska and Canada, Chile, Labrador, and Georgia. The boat? He designed it, it is a round bilge aluminum cutter; and he designed the rollers to roll the plates for it in a size his wife could manipulate through said rollers. Another friend of ours, who is a CF member, Mirar, is also building his own aluminum cutter. So, yes, independent, intelligent, and multi-skilled people.

Nonetheless, the process for the decisions all come from individuals who although they have commonalities, also have profound differences, their preferences, derived from experiences and hopes, and factor in budget, not how much you can afford, but how much you want to spend. Some prefer not to over-extend financially. Life is long, one's boating life is usually shorter than one's whole life, and you will need to have some money for the expensive years ahead.

Ann