Characteristics of Offshore Yachts

[Terra Nova]

Nothing at all wrong with being prepared for what can hurt you.

[Weyalan]

Originally Posted by Terra Nova

Nothing at all wrong with being prepared for what can hurt you.

Of course. But you might also be abducted by aliens, or swallowed by an enormous whale, or hit by a comet.... do we prepare for those too?

99% of the sailing population could continue doing the sailing that they do without ever experiencing conditions where a roll-over is a real and distinct possibility. There are sailors that post here that have experienced those conditions (I'm thinking Jon Eisberg, Estarzinger for example) and sure it is great to hear their experiences and learn from them, but put your preparatory efforts into areas where you will get the most bang for your buck

I know people who won't go swimming in Australia, and also won't go walking in the forest in Australia because of the snakes, spiders, crocodiles, sharks, etc. But here are some statistics...

Australian statistics:
Death by shark attack per year approx 3
Death by crocodile attack per year approx 1
Death by snake bite per year approx 2
Deaths by spider bite per year approx 0
versus, just for example...
Road deaths per year approx 1500
Cancer deaths per year approx 43,000
Cardiovascualr / heart-attack deaths per year approx 43,000
Stroke deaths per year approx 39,000

So check your fire extinguishers are in date.. inspect all your through-hulls regularly, have a health check anually and take some exercise. Worry about your AVS.... not so much

[Terra Nova]

Originally Posted by Weyalan

...put your preparatory efforts into areas where you will get the most bang for your buck...

Fortunately not all of us have accountants running our lives. So we are free to choose based on other than financial reasons. Whatever gives you peace of mind. Like a seaworthy boat.

[Matt Johnson]

Originally Posted by Weyalan

I think that, generally, people spend waaaay to much time worrying about knock-downs / roll-overs / angles of vanishing stability, etc.
If you choose your passages to suit your boat and your ability, and keep your boat in reasonable condition, and pay reasonable attention to the seasonal weather patterns and local weather forecasts, chances are you will never have to experience conditions where a knock-down, rollover, do the hokey pokey is likely.

I just love the over-the-top opinions on what is necessary to safely sail offshore.

Matt

[Weyalan]

Originally Posted by Terra Nova

Fortunately not all of us have accountants running our lives. So we are free to choose based on other than financial reasons. Whatever gives you peace of mind. Like a seaworthy boat.

I'm genuinely not sure what point you are trying to make. A boat needs to be as seaworthy as is necessary for its intended use. Some people like to carry a gun in case they meet a bad person. Some people choose not to carry a gun and try to avoid the areas know to be frequented by bad people. If you choose to go to places where a knock-down roll-over is a real possibility you'd be mad not to consider the boat you were taking and the measures that would minimise the risk of such an event occurring. But if you choose not to go to those places, then there are better things on which to focus your attention.

Edited to add: And for the record - "bang for your buck" is just an expression, meaning "benefit returned for effort invested" - it doesn't necessarily have to refer to dollars and cents

[David_Old_Jersey]

I suspect most folks who ponder over these threads are not simply thinking of the 100 year storm etc but simply using them to focus the mind on the far more common bad weather scenarios where a chain (small) of events can lead to a disaster. But the good thing about those chains is often plenty of chances to break the sequence.

And for that a boat that is kind to the crew will lead to better decisions.

[Robin3]

Originally Posted by mitiempo

No kidding! 40 North is only a short way north of San Francisco. That means do not sail anywhere in Oregon, Washington, or Canada.

Your wording is not correct either. The entire world is either north or south of 40 degrees latitude.

OMG I just qualified, along with many others, as a superhero sailor having sailed and survived over 100,000 miles north of 40 north in boats from 21 foot upwards!

Then reality kicked in and I realised that many Mercans have lttle or no knowledge of geography and probably think that Europe is a small island situated somewhere in the roughest waters in the middle of the Atlantic! And of course they all watch every episode of 'Dangerous Catch' [/IRONY]

With apologies to all my Mercan friends and family who I try to educate whenever possible but often in vain.

I just thought too that 'The Perfect Storm' and 'Dangerous Catch' have a lot to answer for in discussions on here.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Weyalan

I think that, generally, people spend waaaay to much time worrying about knock-downs / roll-overs / angles of vanishing stability, etc.
If you choose your passages to suit your boat and your ability, and keep your boat in reasonable condition, and pay reasonable attention to the seasonal weather patterns and local weather forecasts, chances are you will never have to experience conditions where a knock-down, rollover, do the hokey pokey is likely.

Exactly!

[brookiesailor]

Robin3

I think you should be careful when slinging insults. Obviously not ALL of any nationality is one way or another. I happen to be one of those stupid 'mericans. I don't watch tv so I have no frame of reference of the shows you mention. I have however lived in Africa for five years and done much traveling in Europe, Asia, Africa and South America so I would appreciate it if you would think before speaking next time!


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[Robin3]

Originally Posted by brookiesailor

Robin3

I think you should be careful when slinging insults. Obviously not ALL of any nationality is one way or another. I happen to be one of those stupid 'mericans. I don't watch tv so I have no frame of reference of the shows you mention. I have however lived in Africa for five years and done much traveling in Europe, Asia, Africa and South America so I would appreciate it if you would think before speaking next time!


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

Oh FFS! Get a sense of humour or go back to bed and get out the other side this time.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by mitiempo

No kidding! 40 North is only a short way north of San Francisco. That means do not sail anywhere in Oregon, Washington, or Canada.

Well, thought it obvious I was indicating long passages, offshore or (insert drum roll for dramatic effect here) bluewater sailing. Obviously if you're talking about short trips, day sails, coastal cruising, etc the very rough, rule of thumb, approximate guidelines I listed (somewhat tongue in cheek) do not apply. And of course local conditions and regional weather phenomena also apply. As they say on the internet, YMMV.

Originally Posted by mitiempo

Your wording is not correct either. The entire world is either north or south of 40 degrees latitude.

Well I thought about just saying high latitude sailing but that terminology seems to be too obscure for some so tried to be more specific. I'm sure the meaning of the post was clear to most but if you want to pick the nits then "north of 40 degrees north latitude or south of 40 degrees south latitude".

Seriously, just to be perfectly clear, the point I was trying to make; if you pay attention to extreme weather areas and seasons, which are well known IE tropical hurricanes, north Atlantic winter gales, the Roaring Forties, etc then the odds of encountering a survival scale storm are almost zero.

Sure you can get your posterior well kicked even avoiding these situations but a storm that will roll or pitchpole a 40' or even 30' boat are not a concern for your average cruiser, if they are paying attention and not sailing in extremes.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Robin3

OMG I just qualified, along with many others, as a superhero sailor having sailed and survived over 100,000 miles north of 40 north in boats from 21 foot upwards!

Then reality kicked in and I realised that many Mercans have lttle or no knowledge of geography and probably think that Europe is a small island situated somewhere in the roughest waters in the middle of the Atlantic! And of course they all watch every episode of 'Dangerous Catch' [/IRONY]

With apologies to all my Mercan friends and family who I try to educate whenever possible but often in vain.

I just thought too that 'The Perfect Storm' and 'Dangerous Catch' have a lot to answer for in discussions on here.

Congratulations on your promotion to superhero status but don't let it go to your head.

So your profile says Daytona but you talk like you're one of them furriners that invade the peaceful waters of Merica.

Unlike many I do know that Europe isn't an island although it is certainly small. I'm also pretty sure it's somewhere east of the US of A.

And I'm also aware that lots of sailing happens in places like UK and Ireland (which are islands) which is mostly north of 50 degrees north latitude. However, occasionally that part of the world gets hammered with some really nasty stuff, even when it's not winter, like August 1979. Don't think a 21' boat would have done too well that month.

[Robin3]

Originally Posted by skipmac

Congratulations on your promotion to superhero status but don't let it go to your head.

So your profile says Daytona but you talk like you're one of them furriners that invade the peaceful waters of Merica.

Unlike many I do know that Europe isn't an island although it is certainly small. I'm also pretty sure it's somewhere east of the US of A.

And I'm also aware that lots of sailing happens in places like UK and Ireland (which are islands) which is mostly north of 50 degrees north latitude. However, occasionally that part of the world gets hammered with some really nasty stuff, even when it's not winter, like August 1979. Don't think a 21' boat would have done too well that month.

Yep, I lived at and cruised from 50 north, pretty much dead centre of the southernmost part of the UK. I was at sea around 50 north too during the infamous 1979 Fastnet storm on a 30 foot fin and half skeg Half ton Cup cruiser/racer in it's cruise mode with (first) wife and two kids on board We mIssed the really bad stuff, probable a) as we were slightly farther east of it and b) were on a reach not beating upwind nor running off downwind. mind you when we eventually reached home and our YC swinging mooring, they sent a launch out to take us ashore rather than have us launch our rubber duck tender.

I learned my sailing on small boats and their 'storms' were of lesser intensity but taught the lessons to take forward to bigger boats and often harsher conditions. We used to sail in conditions i would not go out in these days, having got older and wiser but the knowledge gained is still there I hope.

And yes, I am a pesky furriner, better described by US Immigration as a 'Legal alien' and residing now in Sunny Florida. I still have my British nationality and British sense of humour mind and understand it is often misunderstood by some as rudeness here which is sad because it is not intended as such. Mind you, I can 'do' 'rude too if invited.

[Matt Johnson]

Robin3

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: south of 40 north 'cos anything else is too risky
Boat: Beneteau Oceanis 36CC
Posts: 480


Nice!

[Robin3]

Originally Posted by funjohnson

Robin3

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: south of 40 north 'cos anything else is too risky
Boat: Beneteau Oceanis 36CC
Posts: 480


Nice!

yeah but we are in hurricane belt territory according to our insurers, so not entirely risk free, but gotta keep a little spice in life! But then I wouldn't deliberately take our current boat out into a strong storm, it being a humble Bendy toe and all.