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Old 08-03-2015, 07:34   #1
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Canadian leaving boat in Florida

We are planing to take our canadian registered boat to Florida in the very early fall and leaving it on the hard till the next following winter ...
YEEE Hawwww

I have been searching the web for info on this but I cannot nail down the answer to my question, we are from Toronto and we purchase a $27 entry permit for our boat every year since we travel to the us often, we are also insured till Hudson River NY...

We have been in contact with our insurance company here and the want us to pay around 1200$ on top of our annual fee once we get past the Hudson ...

My question is once I get down past the Hudson should I ( or can I) obtain insurance from a USA agent?? Will they give me insurance with a Canadian address ???... What's the norm here???

Also, I am confused about keeping the boat in Florida... Some of the info is old that I have searched and I cannot get a answer that i understand....so again I have a Canadian registered boat and want to leave it on the hard in Florida ...is there a time limit or can the boat stay as long as it wants ??? What do I need to make this work besides all the money I have
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Old 08-03-2015, 07:48   #2
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

Re your Insurance. check the company to see if you can raise the deductible instead of a higher premium. That's what we have done no problems. Re leaving the boat.
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Old 08-03-2015, 08:56   #3
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

This is from an acquaintance, who up to this year left his Canadian boat "on the hard" down in Florida....." Today I went to USCBP to get my cruising permit and they refused me, my vessel is not Registered, they did the same to Richard my friend from Quebec. This puts the boats in a very bad position, every time I move the boat I must go to the nearest USCBP and pay, surrender the ships documents until I plan to leave , then go back and pay to clear out to the next port, every time the boat moves. If I haul it out they can sieze it after a time and force me to pay import tax and State Property taxes. If I had known this I would have left the boat in the Bahamas and said good bye to Florida for good!"
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Old 08-03-2015, 09:01   #4
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

More info for you....."OK, I have been in touch with a Marine Lawyer that does Registries, they have been in touch with the federal ministry and were told that they knew nothing about the changes. They are looking into it and if so and there are hundreds of boats to be registered they are looking into streamlining the process (I have been told). The law firm is Brechin&Huffman, the lawyer is Scott Henderson, and his Legal Assistant is Julie. The contact number is 905-681-2476
For those affected could you help to get the word out?"
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Old 08-03-2015, 10:12   #5
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

To bring the boat south into the USA you will need a cruising permit which you should be able to get when you clear in. Since you are in Pickering I assume you wll be entering the U.S. at Oswego, NY. You can get one there. Your cruising permit is good for a year after which you will need to take the boat out of US waters for 14 days then you can return and get a new permit good for another year.

Also available to Canadians if you are going to take your boat out of the U.S. is the Small Vessel Reporting system. To participate in this program you register with US Border and Protection. Once registered we have been told by an agent in Port Canaveral you no longer need a cruising permit.

Our boat is Canadian registered and so I am not aware if Provincial licensing will create problems. Just in case, I would suggest that you register your boat if you have not already done so.

We have our insurance with BoatUS which only requires that you have a US mailing address. I'm not sure if other insurers will insure Candian boats. Regardless I would shop around to see how other insurance rates compare.
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Old 08-03-2015, 10:17   #6
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

We have been doing this for a few years with a Canadian documented vessel.

We get a cruising permit that is good for one year. To renew the permit the boat has to leave the USA for 15 days. We go to the Bahamas as we keep the boat in Florida.

We are supposed to phone in each time the boat is moved from one area to another. Some Canadian boaters do this others don't. Some customs officers insist it is required other say they don't enforce it. Phoning in to report a move the officers sometimes have no idea why you want to report your move, sometimes they don't answer the phone. It can be confusing.

We haul the boat each summer. US customs likes to hold our documentation while the boat is hauled. They told us if the crusing permit has expired and we can't renew it we will need to get a "permission to proceed" ($19) each time the boat is moved. Most boats in Florida with this issue wait for weather and head straight to the Bahamas, come back in a month or 3 and get a new permit.

One solution to the hassle would be to import the boat, get a Florida title, pay the taxes. The import duty is low if the vessel was built in USA or Canada, sales taxes in Florida 6%, sometimes a bit higher depending on county or city additions.

BoatUS recommended Harbour Insurance in Toronto. We found the prices to be very good and a great company if you do have a claim.

Just our experiences, I'm sure others have found it different, Bob
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Old 08-03-2015, 11:09   #7
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

American built boats can get crusing permits renewed with out leaving u.s.
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Old 08-03-2015, 11:41   #8
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

Insurance prices will always reflect geographic cruising range, i.e. "home waters" or "abroad" so that is part of the insurance kick, you have wider cruising grounds. Also, at least for US insurers but I'd bet for yours as well, none of them want to cover any boat in Florida during "hurricane season" which is about 6 months long, May to November 1(?).


You might try contacting Al Golden (owner) at IMIS International Marine Insurance Service to ask how to best insure your boat while it is in the US. He may say to stick with your company. Al and IMIS have gotten nothing but high praise for 30(?) years, they do a comprehensive job. Not cheap, but competitive and without surprises.


Storing the boat north of the "hurricane zone" may reduce costs.


Some folks have posted reports that ICE wants you to call even if you if you move your boat from one slip to the next one, so if they want paperwork, make them happy. Phone calls are cheap these days. Unhappy bureaucrats, not so cheap.
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Old 08-03-2015, 11:42   #9
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

Quote:
Originally Posted by olepedersen View Post
American built boats can get crusing permits renewed with out leaving u.s.
I've heard this from several cruisers but have yet to meet a customs agent who will do it for our built in Florida boat. And owned by a non-US resident.

If anyone can provide an actual reference in the regulations I would be most appreciative.

Bob
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Old 08-03-2015, 11:57   #10
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

I think the confusion arises because a foreign flagged vessel owned by a US resident can get a cruising permit without leaving the country. Here are the regulations as I understand them,

Resident aliens may apply for successive cruising licenses if their foreign-flag vessel was made in the U.S. or if duty has been paid on its importation provided that the vessel is documented under the laws of one of the countries listed in 19 CFR 4.94(b). Under CBP policy, non-U.S. residents are not eligible for successive cruising licenses. A new license will not be issued unless the following two conditions have been met: (1) at least 15 days have elapsed since the previous license either expired or was surrendered, and (2) the vessel arrives in the U.S. from a foreign port or place. (Customs Directive 3130-006A) CBP will want to see foreign clearance paperwork as evidence that you are arriving from a foreign location.

Non-residents are cautioned to plan carefully so that the mandatory 15-day period does not fall in the middle of a planned stay in U.S. waters. It may make sense to surrender your cruising license to a CBP Officer when you leave U.S. waters and then obtain a new one when you re-enter the U.S. Traveling outside of U.S. waters while your cruising license is still in effect does NOT fulfill the 15-day requirement.

Ref, https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/det...ld-one-expires
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Old 08-03-2015, 12:06   #11
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

Great information!

I am in a bit of a different situation, being Canadian who spends half my time at my condo in Florida or on my sailboat. It is registered in Florida, as I purchased it there.

I have been contemplating changing the registration to Canadian, however, it appears there is no real advantage, and in fact, some disadvantages to that. The boat will never see Canadian waters, so even if I did change it, there would be no GST consequences.
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Old 08-03-2015, 12:07   #12
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

We are insured with Harbour Insurance in Toronto (Boat Insurance Ontario | Harbour Insurance Services in Ontario Canada). We keep the boat in Florida all year round. We are insured from Lake Ontario, down the east coast of USA, Bahamas south to the Turks and Caicos but not Gulf of Mexico. We do not have to haul the boat in summer. We have a 10% deductible for a named storm, reduces to 5% if we have a hurricane plan. Very reasonable rates on an agreed value policy.
Bob
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Old 08-03-2015, 13:51   #13
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

I'm surprised insurance companies are still writing viable policies for boats located in a hurricane zone. I just spent a couple of weeks on a boat in the Windward Islands and this was an ongoing topic of conversation with the owner. His insurance company makes him keep his boat below 14 degrees 30 minutes of latitude and on the hard during the entire hurricane season.
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Old 08-03-2015, 14:48   #14
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

Hi,
Give Sally (the owner) a call, she runs a yard called Riverside Marina, in Ft. Pierce. I have used her services repeatedly over the last ten or more years. Many Canadian's use the yard to put their boat on the hard. I am sure she can answer your other questions about length of stay and so on.
PS: Winter is a great time to cruise the keys, much better in fact than summer.
Danny L. Davis
"Read more, be More"
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Old 08-03-2015, 15:09   #15
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Re: Canadian leaving boat in Florida

Welcome to the world of long distance boating... May the farce be with you!!!
As to insurance, I looked at US policies and would not touch them with the proverbial barge poll. I am sure some who live there know how to do it but there where so many loopholes and caveats it seamed that a claim would almost certainly get dismissed. Some of the small print also included the insure having the absolute wright to pay you out and cease the boat in the event of a claim, this came with a valuation that was about 25% of the replacement cost of the boat!!! Also getting a dispute resolved in the US courts look horrifically expensive and takes years which means the insurer knows you are probably going to take whatever they offer. My advice stay with the nationality of you registration for all contracts if at all possible. Only based on relatively little experience though so may be just me.
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