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Old 09-09-2013, 21:21   #46
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

So be it, doubt me. Are you familiar with the Texas gulf coast?
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Old 10-09-2013, 08:49   #47
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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Originally Posted by Jammer Six View Post
If that statement were true, no boat would ever survive a hurricane on your coast. Since they do, I have to doubt your statement.

As a general policy, when someone refuses to name names, I doubt their claim.

Why was there any reason to say that?

What boat has survived a hurricane in the area she is talking about? Please name the boat, the area, the storm, and the sea and wind conditions.

Since we should be specific ...
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Old 10-09-2013, 08:51   #48
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

PS I would not want to be in the Gulf of Mexico in any hurricane and would not pick it as a place to go. Much of the Gulf of Mexico is pretty shallow and it can develop 15 ft waves from just a front moving through. I think it would be pretty bad in a hurricane.
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Old 10-09-2013, 09:13   #49
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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No worries, I understand if you're not comfortable with giving the name publicly.
Well I don't. The whole point of a public forum like this is to share information. That's where all the value comes from. Without that sharing browsing around here is a pretty useless waste of time!

I have never been able to understand why some people come to a public forum like this, and then want to keep all of the useful information private.
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Old 10-09-2013, 09:16   #50
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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Well I don't. The whole point of a public forum like this is to share information. That's where all the value comes from. Without that sharing browsing around here is a pretty useless waste of time!

I have never been able to understand why some people come to a public forum like this, and then want to keep all of the useful information private.

It's simple.

This is the INTERNET and I do not want to broadcast someone's name all over the INTERNET without their permission!

When I declined to do it, the person at issue was not someone I knew well at all. I think it's just RUDE to put a person's name out there without their permission.

In my case someone finally quoted newspapers, which for me makes it marginally better but I am still responsible for his name being out there and I didn't want to do it.

You don't have to AGREE, but I think a reasonable person could see that point of view.
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Old 10-09-2013, 14:36   #51
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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Originally Posted by Rakuflames View Post
Why was there any reason to say that?

What boat has survived a hurricane in the area she is talking about? Please name the boat, the area, the storm, and the sea and wind conditions.

Since we should be specific ...
Wrong direction.

According to her logic, all boats would be either in marinas or wrecks.

Since that isn't the case, her logic is flawed.

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Originally Posted by Rakuflames View Post
It's simple.

This is the INTERNET and I do not want to broadcast someone's name all over the INTERNET without their permission!
She's not talking about an individual. She's talking about a business, a marina.

Talking about businesses has been happening since the first business went into business. The internet makes it more efficient, but it's nothing new.

When someone talks about a business and doesn't name the business, it puts the comment in the same category as those who saw a UFO.
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Old 10-09-2013, 14:58   #52
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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Originally Posted by Jammer Six View Post
Wrong direction.

According to her logic, all boats would be either in marinas or wrecks.

Since that isn't the case, her logic is flawed.



She's not talking about an individual. She's talking about a business, a marina.

Talking about businesses has been happening since the first business went into business. The internet makes it more efficient, but it's nothing new.

When someone talks about a business and doesn't name the business, it puts the comment in the same category as those who saw a UFO.

I guess --- if you believe that everyone is a liar until they have proved themselves to your satisfaction.

Meanwhile, the business might not have grounds to sue if they don't like what you said, but that might not stop them. Lots of small/privately owned business don't have lawyers at their beck and call to say "This isn't a good lawsuit ..."

I will name the four that *I* know close the entrance to either coming in OR leaving, and that most certainly includes those renting slips there: Pasadena Marina, the two sections of the Municipal Marina in Gulfport, Florida, and Twin Dolphin in Bradenton. I'd bet you a liverwurst sandwich that Regatta Pointe across the river has the same clause in their rental agreement, and I bet St. Pete Public Marina and the Harborage do to.

At some point the weather is so bad that it is dangerous to move boats about. In addition, in Pasadena, they do spiderweb at some point. That's where I first heard about it.

Even giving shelter to a marineer in trouble has its limits. The mariner is supposed to be intelligent enoough to know that a big storm is coming and to make his or her plans in a timely way.

So it really doesn't matter what marina it is. It's what I would expect, and if I had my boat in a marina that didn't have that policy I would consider it a good reason to get my boat out of there before someone else tried to come in with the wind and waves pushing him around like Forrest Gump's ping pong ball.
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Old 10-09-2013, 15:27   #53
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

I don't think I've ever had a liverwurst sandwich. Accepting one off the internet seems risky, since I've made it this long without one...

We're agreeing. I think marinas in the United States have the right to open or close, based on criteria of their choosing, provided that criteria is ethical and legal. (For instance, "closing" a marina to a boat because the owner is black would be both unethical and illegal.)

Weather certainly passes that test, and the rest is degree.
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Old 10-09-2013, 15:31   #54
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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I don't think I've ever had a liverwurst sandwich. Accepting one off the internet seems risky, since I've made it this long without one...

We're agreeing. I think marinas in the United States have the right to open or close, based on criteria of their choosing, provided that criteria is ethical and legal. (For instance, "closing" a marina to a boat because the owner is black would be both unethical and illegal.)

Weather certainly passes that test, and the rest is degree.

You're right, the quality of the sandwich probably would not hold up through the transit.

Yes. A marina cannot refuse a boat in distress because the skipper is the "wrong color," But they can refuse Donald Trump in a named storm if that's their policy ... and I think here, that's pretty much ths policy.
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Old 10-09-2013, 16:02   #55
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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Originally Posted by Jammer Six View Post
Wrong direction.

According to her logic, all boats would be either in marinas or wrecks.

Since that isn't the case, her logic is flawed.



She's not talking about an individual. She's talking about a business, a marina.

Talking about businesses has been happening since the first business went into business. The internet makes it more efficient, but it's nothing new.

When someone talks about a business and doesn't name the business, it puts the comment in the same category as those who saw a UFO.
Sorry jammer, I guess I didn't express myself well. I was talking about this particular area this vessel was in, which is Clear Lake , Texas, off the Gulf Coast. We do not have many places to tuck into and anchor that could of handled Ike. There were lots of sad stories after Ike, marinas were wiped out, but more survived. I did not hear of one boat that went out on their own to tuck up somewhere that didn't end up sunk or so far inland and buried in debris as too make her very hard to recover. There is great little spot called candlelight bay, but everybody and their brother heads there, and then when the shrimpers get there, it is mayhem. In fact, many of the really good hurricane holes now house marinas. We have some well built, well protected marinas that can handle storm surge ( so far, storm surge seems to climbs every year!). Storm surge is usually our biggest issue here because of our geography. We also have some not so good, and some down right bad marinas to be in in a hurricane.

And as far as seeking offshore to ride out a hurricane, I was talking about the Texas Gulf. You may be correct, there just might of been a survivor from riding out Ike off Texas and the story would probably include them ending up in a tree. You just have to take a look at the geography, it is not in the vessels favor, it's shallow 80-100 miles out, littered with oil rigs, and a Gulf Stream with all it's weird meanderings( something reaching 5knots +). I've seen 50 knots out in the gulf and if you are near land, or caught in the stream, it gets pretty crazy. We call it the washing machine effect. Standing waves, with short periods, in all directions, you just kinda pick your best heading and hold on till the squall subsides.

As far as naming names, I already addressed that. Anyways, I don't really mind if you think I make this stuff up, it's the Internet. I could really be a truck driver from Mudflat, Oklahoma. Ooh, or better yet, a prison inmate from cell block C
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Old 10-09-2013, 16:12   #56
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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Sorry jammer, I guess I didn't express myself well. I was talking about this particular area this vessel was in, which is Clear Lake , Texas, off the Gulf Coast. We do not have many places to tuck into and anchor that could of handled Ike. There were lots of sad stories after Ike, marinas were wiped out, but more survived. I did not hear of one boat that went out on their own to tuck up somewhere that didn't end up sunk or so far inland and buried in debris as too make her very hard to recover. There is great little spot called candlelight bay, but everybody and their brother heads there, and then when the shrimpers get there, it is mayhem. In fact, many of the really good hurricane holes now house marinas. We have some well built, well protected marinas that can handle storm surge ( so far, storm surge seems to climbs every year!). Storm surge is usually our biggest issue here because of our geography. We also have some not so good, and some down right bad marinas to be in in a hurricane.

And as far as seeking offshore to ride out a hurricane, I was talking about the Texas Gulf. You may be correct, there just might of been a survivor from riding out Ike off Texas and the story would probably include them ending up in a tree. You just have to take a look at the geography, it is not in the vessels favor, it's shallow 80-100 miles out, littered with oil rigs, and a Gulf Stream with all it's weird meanderings( something reaching 5knots +). I've seen 50 knots out in the gulf and if you are near land, or caught in the stream, it gets pretty crazy. We call it the washing machine effect. Standing waves, with short periods, in all directions, you just kinda pick your best heading and hold on till the squall subsides.

As far as naming names, I already addressed that. Anyways, I don't really mind if you think I make this stuff up, it's the Internet. I could really be a truck driver from Mudflat, Oklahoma. Ooh, or better yet, a prison inmate from cell block C

On the other hand, I live on the other side of the Gulf of Mexico from you, and for me, every word you have said has the ring of truth to it. If you ARE in Cell Block C, you're so good I'm surprised you got caught.
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Old 10-09-2013, 16:16   #57
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

And it takes two guards to watch me, so be nice
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Old 10-09-2013, 16:36   #58
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

Is the one in back available for games of Felon & Guard?
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Old 10-09-2013, 16:38   #59
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

Sometimes, it's easy to spot the exact moment when a thread leaves the rails...
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Old 11-09-2013, 07:28   #60
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Re: Can Marinas Turn a Boat Away When Seeking Safe Harbor?

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I think it's just RUDE to put a person's name out there without their permission.
You seem to have misunderstood. I was talking about the OP naming a business. Yes, in some circumstances it might be rude to name a particular person. Sharing information about businesses that are operating in the boating industry, however, is a completely different matter, and a large part of what a forum like this is all about.
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