Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 08-03-2010, 15:03   #16
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Morlaix Brittany France blog: theguerns.blogspot.com
Boat: Colvic Watson/32ft/Feels Good
Posts: 461
Images: 4
Send a message via Skype™ to feelsgood
heater

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingmonica View Post
We are looking to buy a central cabin heater and have a hard time deciding which one would be the best when it comes to efficiency, fuel consumption and especially reliability (not really big fans of having to fix something we just bought). Currently looking at Espar Airtronic D5 and Webasto Airtop 3500. We welcome your opinions and experience.

MONICA's hull is 38 feet and has four separate rooms (five if you count the bathroom). We are looking for an unit that would keep the boat comfortably warm during the migration South.
We have had both but the Webasto is the best and gives alot les bother
__________________

__________________
feelsgood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 15:23   #17
cruiser

Join Date: May 2008
Boat: Bermuda 40
Posts: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingmonica View Post
We are looking to buy a central cabin heater and have a hard time deciding which one would be the best when it comes to efficiency, fuel consumption and especially reliability (not really big fans of having to fix something we just bought). Currently looking at Espar Airtronic D5 and Webasto Airtop 3500. We welcome your opinions and experience.

MONICA's hull is 38 feet and has four separate rooms (five if you count the bathroom). We are looking for an unit that would keep the boat comfortably warm during the migration South.
We put an Airtop 3500 in our 40 ft sailboat and it is excellent. Installed heat ducts in main cabin,head and forward cabin. More than enough BTU's We turn the dial to the mid point and it keeps the boat interior at about 20 degrees C in April and October in Atlantic Canada and Maine coastal waters. Very easy on fuel. One of the best improvements that we've made in the boat.
__________________

__________________
camtep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 15:39   #18
Nearly an old salt
 
goboatingnow's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 13,649
Images: 3
Quote:
You might think about hydronic instead of air-based. Hydronic is the only way to go if you want to heat different spaces. Quieter, too. Plus you can heat your domestic hot water with it.
not in my experience. The air units are quite good, I have installed and owned several different D series over the years. However the hydronic are not in my experience anywhere as reliable and seem to suffer premature failue. If you use fan modules they are actually more noisy then the air units.

In my experience for a 38 footer the d5 will be slightly overkill but in my experience bigger is better. Put silencers on the exhaust and the air intake and theunits are almost inaudible

mount the pump on a couple of bits of rubber as well as it's rubber mount and the ticking noise can be reduced. I actually like it as the heater is so quiet that I use the ticking to tell me how the heater is running

if you can. Buy and fit the timer module. This will give you access to the diagnostics and fault codes. The units Are simple enough to dismantle and service yourselk
__________________
goboatingnow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 16:37   #19
Registered User
 
Mango Bob's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: So Cal
Boat: Amel Mango 52'
Posts: 24
Take a look at some of the manufacturers links; Most installers who match a proper heater to your boat will tell you that if you plan to live aboard - hydronic is the only choice. I prefer hydronic systems as they can heat your hot water tank, engine and either run heat to any cabin via hydro or by pushing through a heat exchanger fan for forced hot air through your boat.

With 21 years in the Navy, we had Webasto systems on many of our boats and trucks and they all ran well.
__________________
Mango Bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 16:50   #20
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
pot heater?

Quote:
Originally Posted by alaska pirate View Post
Had a Webasto forced-air heater (it was on the boat) for the first 2 years I lived on board. It averaged $400-600 a year in parts to keep it going. The third year I installed a Sig Marine pot heater mounted to the forward bulkhead in the main salon. It has worked flawlessly for 8 years. My experience was similar to several others who were living aboard in Valdez, AK.
What's the advantage of heating your pot? Is this an Alaska thing?

(Just kidding. And welcome to Cruiser's Forum.)
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 17:52   #21
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,413
I'll weigh in with a recommendation for the Espar Airtronic 4. This one replaced a D4L which while a good heater gave up the ghost and it was simply not a smart idea to throw good money after bad.

I did the original install which requires finding paths for 3" flexible ducts an exhaust hose to the transom in my case... and fresh air for the combustion air. The install is pretty much plug and play after working out where to mount and run everything.

The Airtronic 4 is a pleasure - quiet and low amp draw especially when it get the cabin up to design temps and then it goes very quiet. The heat is even and dry and it has a fuel pick up from the main diesel tank so there is no additional fuel source to worry about.

Love the heater and it's high tech monitors gives me a sense of safety. I'd still recommend that you have a CO monitor or let some fresh air in. The oxygen is drawn from outside so that a good feature as well. The heat comes up very fast.

There's nothing not to like here... it takes up only unused real estate in my case under the aft berth. It's quiet, clean and heats.

The newer model is far superior to the D4L.
__________________
Sandero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 18:21   #22
Senior Cruiser
 
Cheechako's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 19,334
The boat company I worked for sold mostly Webasto. These went on a lot of ALaska fishing boats. Seemed very reliable, but we always set them up to run on Kerosene with a separate tank. One repeat customer bought 3 new boats and insisted on Espar's as he had been given the "pitch" at the boat show by them. He had warranty issues the first 120 days...
__________________
Cheechako is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 18:45   #23
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Currently Milford, CT
Boat: S/V Running Fish - Passport 40
Posts: 78
Using outside air

My Espar Airtronic is configured to heat outside air and blow it throughout the boat, and this helps control moisture.

For those with Hydronic systems, do you have issues with humidity?
__________________
RunningFish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 19:02   #24
Registered User
 
jrd22's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: San Juan Islands, WA
Boat: 1988 Brewer Three Seas 40' Pilothouse
Posts: 251
Quote:
Originally Posted by hpeer View Post
I have an Airtronic Espar D4 that seems to work fine but I have not used it much. It puts out lots of heat for my 33'er.

JRD22 - which Wallas unit are you talking about? The furnace or the stove/oven/heater?
It's the D40 furnace. We insulated our heating ducts and it really made a big difference in heat output. I considered the hydronic units but in the locations that I wanted outlets there wasn't enough room for the individual units. The D40 is adequate for our 40' boat at our latitude (48N).
__________________
John Davidson
S/V Laurie Anne
1988 40' Brewer Pilothouse
jrd22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2010, 20:35   #25
Moderator Emeritus
 
hummingway's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gabriola Island & Victoria, British Columbia
Boat: Cooper 416 Honeysuckle
Posts: 6,933
Images: 5
What did you use to insulaste your ducts John?
__________________
hummingway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 18:58   #26
Senior Cruiser
 
hpeer's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Boat: Murray 33-Chouette & Pape Steelmaid-44-Safara-both steel cutters
Posts: 3,896
So for you guys with the Airtronic D4 experience, I have a question.

Would you leave the heat on in your boat if you were away for any length of time?

My thought is to leave the D4 set on minimum heat (Espar says 45F) in order to keep the boat from freezing.

I can't find any reports of an Espar creating a fire.

Do you trust your heater unattended?
__________________
hpeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 20:48   #27
Vendor
 
witzgall's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Eastern Shore, MD
Boat: Camper Nicholson 44 Ketch
Posts: 1,773
I have a Webasto sitting below my desk to be installed, hopefully before springtime..

I know I will need more ducting and connectors than came with the unit. Where is the best place to get these online?

Chris
__________________
witzgall is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 17-11-2010, 02:06   #28
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Morlaix Brittany France blog: theguerns.blogspot.com
Boat: Colvic Watson/32ft/Feels Good
Posts: 461
Images: 4
Send a message via Skype™ to feelsgood
Our Webasto3500 is on all winter weather we are on the boat or not and in 10 years we have never had a problem.Pete
__________________
feelsgood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-11-2010, 04:42   #29
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,413
I would not leave the Airtronic 4 on if no one is on the boat for more than 1/2 hr. It has lots of fail safe features but I think even those can fail. If you think to use it to keep the boat warm in winter storage, it will also use a lot of fuel and work your batts... and you are "using up" the heater.. ie putting lots of hours on it.

Not recommended.
__________________
Sandero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-11-2010, 05:26   #30
Nearly an old salt
 
goboatingnow's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 13,649
Images: 3
Quote:
I would not leave the Airtronic 4 on if no one is on the boat for more than 1/2 hr. It has lots of fail safe features but I think even those can fail
They are designed for unattended operation. and some can even remote start over a GSM link etc

In my experience, having owned Webasto and Eberspacher ( Espar) units both in Air and Hydronic form, I would say that Eber is a slightly more reliable unit. In my eperience the hydronics units in both models are much more unreliable then the Air systems ( and they are more complex). Also the air system gives near instant heat.

IN all my cases the heated air was NOT taken from the outside. The combustion air was , not the hot air. My installation manual doesnt reccomend it and since this is a big duct (4") I cant see how you could prevent water access into it if you did.( not to mention lowering the system efficiency drawing air in through a duct) I be suprised many are plumbed to outside air, Certainly in all the European installations Ive seen are taking in internal air.

dave
__________________

__________________
goboatingnow is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cabin

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Need Help with Espar Heater limmer General Sailing Forum 21 17-10-2012 14:16
Espar Heater kimberlite General Sailing Forum 8 07-07-2012 14:20
Kerosene Cabin Heater Mainebristol Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 17 27-09-2010 20:30
Webasto or Mikuni heater ? recommends davis911s Liveaboard's Forum 8 15-01-2008 18:52
Cabin Heater clausont Construction, Maintenance & Refit 3 29-10-2007 02:05



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:14.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.