Broker - P.O. issues on mainsail

[Fiftybucks]

Hi all, we are in st Pete post survey to close in boat. The boat a cat 350 has full batten main with Dutchman reefing that doesn’t work. Yesterday went on seatrial with broker. The sail jammed going up. Sail jammed coming down blew the breaker on the electric winch and the rotted sail cover does not accommodate Dutchman. I sa they should get it working and include proper mainsail cover. Or compensat for new Mack Pack system. They say no way. I’m tied of this. The main was all over the deck blocking vision and still 1/4 the way up. Sail slugs jammed because the plate had screws intentionally removed so the slugs could go lower and the crap mainsail over could be closed up. I’m am going to another broker today different boat 4 years newer.

Mostly just venting. I’m already out 2500 survey short haul hotel and travel.

[mabowers]

Originally Posted by Fiftybucks

Hi all, we are in st Pete post survey to close in boat. The boat a cat 350 has full batten main with Dutchman reefing that doesn’t work. Yesterday went on seatrial with broker. The sail jammed going up. Sail jammed coming down blew the breaker on the electric winch and the rotted sail cover does not accommodate Dutchman. I sa they should get it working and include proper mainsail cover. Or compensat for new Mack Pack system. They say no way. I’m tied of this. The main was all over the deck blocking vision and still 1/4 the way up. Sail slugs jammed because the plate had screws intentionally removed so the slugs could go lower and the crap mainsail over could be closed up. I’m am going to another broker today different boat 4 years newer.

Mostly just venting. I’m already out 2500 survey short haul hotel and travel.

Lower your offer, demand repairs prior to closing, or walk.

[sailorboy1]

I have a love/hate relationship with my Dutchman. But:

you can't break it so that it "doesn't work". You can set it up and adjust it wrong in lots of ways.

[Fiftybucks]

I’m not faulting Dutchman system. Seems to work but not on this boat where it has been intentionally disabled and mal adjusted. They seem to work fine when used, maintained and adjusted

[sailorboy1]

I’ve had a Dutchman system for8 years but don’t know how you “disable”

But your question is really a standard “durin* the survey we found X” question. It all depends on the price you are paying verse boat condition. Now you have spend $2k, which for my 41’ boat is lame 75% of tg3 cost for am OEM type sail.

Only you can decide

[44'cruisingcat]

That's basically how it works. You find a problem, lower your offer. The seller either accepts it or doesn't.

If the answer is no, you either accept you'll have to fix it yourself, or you walk.

If you walk, there's always the chance the seller will change his mind later.

[JPA Cate]

Talk to a sailmaker and find out how much for a sail cover that fits, to find out what $$ you're really arguing about, and maybe a rigger as well. [I don't have a feel for whether the Dutchman reefing will work with the screws replaced, or if there are other adjustment issues.] It is normal for sellers to resist what amounts to lowering their price any further. Usually the broker can make them see sense.

If you like the boat well enough, you can still leave the game and see what happens, or you can try and work with the situation. Just stay cool, and pretend it's a game.

Ann

[Scout 30]

Since the sail cover issue was apparent before you negotiated the price asking to reduce it now or replace it is poor form. If the Dutchman system just needs to be adjusted to work that's not worth blowing the deal over in my opinion. If that's the only problem you came up with you're lucky.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by Scout 30

Since the sail cover issue was apparent before you negotiated the price asking to reduce it now or replace it is poor form. If the Dutchman system just needs to be adjusted to work that's not worth blowing the deal over in my opinion. If that's the only problem you came up with you're lucky.

New, hidden items that showup in the seatrial are open to good faith negotiation with the seller (not broker). Items that are in clear view in prior inspections or stated by the seller before the price was negotiated really shouldn't be a reason to renegotiate.
Not sure how expensive this boat is, but the issues you found don't sound like a hill to die for, unless you just want out of the deal - which is a perfectly rational choice at times.

[skipmac]

As other's have noted, if you find a problem in the survey or sea trial the seller has no legal or moral obligation to fix it. Only if the purchase contract or some other written agreement specified that the item was in working condition would you have any reason to demand repair.

Otherwise you can ask that the item be repaired, reduce your offer or walk away. The seller can accept or refuse. Whether or not the seller agrees may depend a lot on the price negotiated and how much he/she has already cut off the asking price. If the boat is in otherwise good condition and the selling price is a very good deal then, unless the seller is desperate or anxious you may be stuck.

Unfortunately you as the buyer are risking the cost of survey and travel and there's little you can do to mitigate that.

[grantmc]

OP I don't get why you don't just walk away. What is the point in all the negative energy when there are so many boats for sale? And yes it does cost money to look, (unless you restrict your search geography).

The problems described sound trivial anyway, but the seller owes you nothing. Maybe your attitude has something to do with the seller's unwillingness to engage about the issues you've raised. There's no obligation to fix anything unless a deal is done.

[S/V Illusion]

seems like some pretty minor issues to become a show-stopper. A sail cover is cheap and repairing the sail slugs,track and Dutchman is a one day DIY project.

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by S/V Illusion

seems like some pretty minor issues to become a show-stopper. A sail cover is cheap and repairing the sail slugs,track and Dutchman is a one day DIY project.

This. A mal-adjusted flaking system and a worn sail-cover are the hallmarks of a used boat.

[Fore and Aft]

As a surveyor I always laugh when owners and brokers put their head in the sand and ignore such obvious issues. Every buyer who steps on that boat is going to pick that issue and I have no idea why they do not get it fixed or tell you from the start. I see it so often and I always ask myself why? It’s like I did some sea trials the other day and the boat could barely move thanks to the reef under the waterline. I just shook my head and thought what a waste of time for the buyer.
Cheers

[Scout 30]

Although the problems seem minor I have to admit I'd be pretty pissed if I couldn't actually sail a sailboat in a sea trial.