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Old 23-02-2008, 01:19   #16
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I will freely admit that I am not the greatest negotiater

I think a lot because for big ticket items I only make an offer for something I have already decided I really want. Kinda removes a lot of my walk away ability which IME is the biggest negotiating asset one can have - being genuinely prepared to walk away.

Also I don't tend to even get involved unless the opening price is in range of what I judge to be a reasonable offer / price - I just do not have the patience to deal with folk who need persuading that their XYZ is NOT worth anything close to what they think. No doubt have missed some good deals along the way, but.........

Just bought a brand new motorbike Price is to me fair enough, but I have a bit of a nagging feeling that their may have been another 5% off the price to be had - but I wanted that bike - and only 1 dealer here, so...........
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Old 23-02-2008, 06:26   #17
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Sean, I wouldn't say 'unfortunately she was in excellent condition' - I have bought fixer-uppers and boats that were well-equipped and in excellent condition and the latter turned out to be the best investment. Even if you do not factor in money for your labour (as you surely should), material, equipment and marina storage costs have escalated so much that there are few true bargains to be had based upon neglect. Indeed, some 'flaws' such as deck delamination are an absolute nightmare for DIY repair.

In my experience, particularly if you are looking to buy a an older model of a popular boat, the low end of the market tends to drag down the price of the upper end. People will see various listings for a particular model at what seem to be incredibly low prices and, while these boats would not pass even a perfunctory inspection, they can appear quite decent in photos. The result is that the owner of a vessel that is well-equipped and in excellent condition gets many less inquiries concerning his boat because the listed price seems incredibly high. If the vendor has no personal knowledge of the boats listed at much lower prices, it will naturally tend to lower his expectations in terms of price. I suspect that this is particularly true in the current soft market where supply considerably outstrips demand.

Put another way, I have never heard of anyone who regretted buying a boat that was well equipped and in excellent condition. I know of many who have regretted being lured by the 'fixer-upper'.

Brad
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Old 23-02-2008, 07:10   #18
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One thing to note is that many boats are listed well above market value. Many boat owners are deluded into thinking that their boats are worth somewhere near what they paid for them.
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Old 23-02-2008, 07:10   #19
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Kanani,

Possibly you need to offer the buyer 50% of what he paid, and get your boat back?
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Old 23-02-2008, 07:32   #20
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Do you know who I really feel sorry for? People that bought with charter companies like the moorings. I bet that they had no idea that after the charter service their boats would be worth half what they paid for them. Think about how bad of a deal that is. Put down 20% or so on a beautiful new boat. For 5-6 years the "charter business" pays your 30 year mortgage. Then after 5-6 years you have paid very little of the new boat cost, but your boat is now worth half and has some pretty serious wear and tear.
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Old 23-02-2008, 08:32   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Southern Star View Post
Put another way, I have never heard of anyone who regretted buying a boat that was well equipped and in excellent condition. I know of many who have regretted being lured by the 'fixer-upper'.

Brad
Thanks for that insight. Well put.
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Old 23-02-2008, 10:49   #22
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Total beginner here but I would do most negotiations before getting the boat surveyed and not *plan* on the survey results for a further price reduction. In theory the survey would only be throwing up issues that someone, yourself or the seller, is going to have to pay for so they are not really savings - though I'm sure that the dollar signs flashing in the sellers eyes by this stage might help that price drop.
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Old 25-02-2008, 08:40   #23
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If you go to NADA's web site there is a section for boat prices.
Just like buying a used car, it shows the price of a base boat and the "popular" options. You will probably be shocked at how low some of these figures are. Keep in mind that the extra 5 sails and the 10K of additional electonics that come with the boat are not figured in. While the additional equipment may be nice and you would like it, the bank is only probably going to finance on what the boat "bluebooks" at. Anything like a dinghy that has it's own title or registration also will not be part of the financing.
Don't be surprised if the 35K boat you really like is only worth 20K to the bank.
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Old 25-02-2008, 22:45   #24
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My experience is a bit difference - that the NADA guides, at least for sailboats in the range we were looking at, have values significantly less than anything you'll pay in real life. The comps a broker can look up are probably going to be more accurate. As far as financing goes, I imagine they, like insurance, are likely to accept a surveyors value assessment. Also, experience and prior coverage are an absolutely huge thing with insurance companies. We chose Boat US for our current boat - it was a no-brainer no-hassle for us, since we had them for our previous boats and they signed us right up with a great rate based on about 10 years insuring with them.
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