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Old 26-07-2010, 05:55   #16
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Originally Posted by Get-a-Life View Post
When we came back to our berth there was a yacht in the berth alongside us, he had removed all our docking lines except one to tie his boat up with.
Some people are just dumber than donut's and selfish with it, with an over inflated sense of entitlement. Some people are simply evolutionary dead ends

As a non-marina dweller:-

1) if danger of damage to my boat then I do WTF I like - but I tell the Marina management what I am doing / have done (or both) - timing is everything with a fait accompli . But I would be looking to put additional lines on and not remove the existing - unless I had to..........ideal scenario is that Marina comes later with own lines and fixes the problem. if not, my additional lines get removed when I depart or when owner arrives (some people will assume a gift from the free dock line Fairy).........if he does not see the problem or is obnoxious on my efforts then I would deploy the tyres and if needed the fender board

2) if no danger to my boat, first step is to Marina Management - but if not available will rig up something if the boat is likely in danger - if however it's simply cosmetic damage and clearly something that has been going on for a good while I would leave as is until Marina management are available - some people simply have differing ideas on "OK" .........besides, I doubt if I would have enough rope onboard for the whole Marina


In the Mud on a drying mooring you keep an eye on the boats around and do whatever is neccessary (50 / 50 on being nice and from self interest ).


Over here we tend to have different issues to contend with - last week me Father left his Wellington Boots at the bottom of the boarding ladder (yeah, you've guessed what happened next just add lots of swearing whilst watching them float away on the incoming tide )..........last weekend we found that someone had returned the left Welly to his boat But if anyone sees a right Welly (green, from a builder's merchant) floating past - would appreciate a shout. Postage paid
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Old 26-07-2010, 05:58   #17
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Wot-

In the Land of Oz, you folks seem to still have a sense of community and an overall better attitude than we do here in the U.S.

In the U.S., good intentions are often rewarded with litigation at worst, and total indifference at best.
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Old 26-07-2010, 06:05   #18
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I see stuff like this frequently. I just go fix it and don't tell anyone. It makes me feel good helping someone and is good karma which pleases the sea gods.

Exactly.

With not a word to the dockmaster or any thought about any potential liability, but on the other hand, how would anyone know it was me anyway?
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Old 26-07-2010, 06:21   #19
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but on the other hand, how would anyone know it was me anyway?
Invariably some busy body around..........

On legal stuff the trick is to deny from the get go .
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Old 26-07-2010, 06:32   #20
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I boarded a stranger's boat Saturday night. I helped him dock (I think he was a dry stack customer who had rented a slip for the weekend) after several failed tries to back in on the other side. He pulled into a vacant slip on my side. Nobody on his boat knew how to tie up a boat and I had to shout just to get lines thrown.

They all left about six o'clock and about nine o'clock I noticed that they had left their generator running. Since the marina has shore power available, I figured this was an oversight.

After talking it over with one of the other "regulars", we both knocked on his boat and when we got no answer, we boarded, knocked again, then went below and shut off the generator.

As of nine o'clock Sunday, the owner had not returned.

BTW: Also on Saturday, I retied a friend's boat that had been left by the staff to ride up on the dock with an outgoing current.

Each case is different, but we should try to be good citizens.
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Old 26-07-2010, 06:40   #21
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I see stuff like this frequently. I just go fix it and don't tell anyone. It makes me feel good helping someone and is good karma which pleases the sea gods.
Me too. I realize there's a risk of it being miscontrued, but that's life.

We need to stop worrying so much about liability and start caring more about each other.
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Old 26-07-2010, 06:48   #22
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Ethics aside, one would be wise to know whether they are in a common or civil law jurisdiction.
For the most part, Common law does not impose any duty to rescue, whereas Civil law generally does.

For more information, Google:
Duty to rescue
Good Samaritan doctrine
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Old 26-07-2010, 07:04   #23
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Courtesy of Sarafina who taught me how to do it

Let me google that for you
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Old 26-07-2010, 07:39   #24
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At least in Florida, I do not believe the "Good Samaritan Law" would apply. That is because it specifically addresses "emergency care or treatment either in direct response to emergency situations related to and arising out of a public health emergency declared pursuant to s. 381.00315, a state of emergency which has been declared pursuant to s. 252.36 or at the scene of an emergency..." What's more, it ONLY mentions protection from liability as regards "medical treatment", "medical care", "medical services", and so on. I think most judges and juries would conclude that this law was only intended to cover situations where you render first aid to a person in a medical emergency. I think that any good lawyer could argue that a bad job of tying up to a dock does not constitute an "emergency", is not covered by the Good Samaritan Law, and so you COULD very well be liable for any subsequent damage that occurs after you "fix" the problem. Duty to Rescue laws, where they are formalized, also generally describe situations where a person is at risk, not just property, and so the same argument would apply.

This does NOT, however, mean that I would do nothing in this situation. First I would contact the marina office. If they wish to fix the problem, I'm in the clear. If they get in touch with the owner and he grants permission to fix the problem, I'm in the clear. If they are not able to get in touch with the owner, and they choose not to fix the problem themselves, then I would go ahead and fix it.

I might take some pictures of how I fixed it, or get another experienced boater to take a look and say "Yeah, that looks like a good job of tying up to the dock" just so that in the future I could defend myself against charges of negligence. It is unfortunate that you need to worry about legal consequences when you are trying to help someone else, but the inescapable fact is that you do. The only reason that we even have Good Samaritan Laws is because of people who tried to help and got sued for their efforts. It may not be right, but it is what it is. Ignore these kinds of considerations at your own peril.
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Old 26-07-2010, 07:43   #25
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That was only half the equation.

Let me google that for you
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Old 26-07-2010, 08:10   #26
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Find an old cushion or lilo and tie it to the post to minimise the impact, then call the owner. No need to touch the boat.
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Old 26-07-2010, 08:39   #27
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In the event I see a yacht in distress as described by the OP, I will do what I can to remedy the situation and think no more of it. I don't expect thanks and I am unlikely to receive criticism.

Some years ago I had an an interesting experience.

Our marina is very small, 50 boats or so, and highly desired, so if one is not an active "boater", or one fails to maintain one's yacht to stipulated standards, one can (and some have been) evicted from the marina.

As it occured, one of the fellows (I'll call him Ernie) who had been one of the founders of the club and marina upon his return from the service at the end of WWII (he flew B-29's), had become quite frail and was frequently unable to perfom maintenance on his, by then, 50+ year old boat, which, as a consequence, had grown a crop of green mold over the top-sides and lines. One Satuday I happend to see Ernie standing on the bulkhead in a walker, looking down at his boat. He was very distressed as it seemed he's gotten a threatening letter about cleaning up his boat or getting out of the marina.

We spoke for a short while after which Ernie's attendant (his wife had passed away some while earlier) came and led him back to his car and drove off. I stood there looking at the bedraggled green boat. A hose was at hand so, for whatever reason, I turned on the water and played the stream over the little foredeck, which blasted off some of the green. I thought. "What the heck", and went back to my boat and got a bucket, a jug of bleach, some Zip Car Wash soap, and my long handled scrub brush. It really didn't take long to scrub Ernie's little boat from stem to stern--burning off the mold with bleach and water and restoring a little bit of shine to the paint with the Zip and a good rinse. Afterward I sat on the bulkhead with a cold beer and enjoyed looking at the restored little boat--at least until it began to rain. And it rained like heck that night.

The next morning while having my coffee in the cockpit, I noticed a deputation purposfully marching down the seawall with Ernie laboring behind in his walker, obviously headed for a confrontation over Ernie's boat--and intentions of evicting him from the coveted slip. All seemed dumbfounded when they arrived above the boat, not the least being Ernie. The party shorly skulked off, leaving Ernie standing there. I walked over, coffee in hand, and said hello. Ernie turned to me, silent for a moment, and then said softly, "It must have been a hell of a rain last night." "Yep Ernie--it was a hell of a rain." And that was the end of it.

Sometimes ya just gotta do the right thing, no?

FWIW...
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Old 26-07-2010, 09:19   #28
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The guy in the slip next to me is a German here to teach NATO pilots how to fly. A couple of weeks ago there was a bit of unexpected wind and a boat a couple of docks or suddenly had its roller furling jib fully extended and flogging all over. I called the office and one of the so called dock masters rolled the sail up by hand BACKWARDS and left the sheets tied up like they had gone through a washing machine.

My pilot friend and I went over after the rain had quit and ran the jib out and correctly rerolled the sail and reset all the sheets and control lines neatly.

We found out that the owner had left in some sort of a hurry and had not secured all the lines properly allowing the sail to get loose.

I guess my point is that some dockmasters are better and more concerned about YOUR boat than others. First line of defence is set by you.........m
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Old 26-07-2010, 09:22   #29
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In my yacht club we have a group of liveaboards called "dockmasters". Their voluntary efforts as first responders to local incidents are generally recognized as critical to the safety of our members and their boats. We are granted absolute permission by our Club's Port Captain and Board of Directors, to board vessels that MAY be sources of fuel leaks, flapping halyards, or taking on water (assuming, of course, no one answers our knocking on the hull first). This concept is based on the expectation that we care for one another's health, safety and property. We also stock a variety of electric and gasoline emergency bilge pumps, spare docklines, oil containment booms and other emergency gear. Taking it a step further, we have first aid kits and oxygen cylinders on each dock, our members are trained in CPR and use of the defibrillators inside and outside the Clubhouse, and we train several times a year on emergency responses to a variety of situations, including fire suppression, sinking and medical first response. Our local fire department knows us well for our proactive response by the general membership to create a safe harbor for our fellow boaters. So far, no one has raised any objections to our efforts.
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Old 26-07-2010, 09:56   #30
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That was only half the equation.
Actually, it wasn't. You must have missed my comments about Duty to Rescue laws. All of those that I could find were written similarly to the Florida Good Samaritan Law. That is, they said nothing about situations where ONLY property was at risk, and instead addressed rescue of people in emergency situations. Hence my conclusion that the same argument would apply.

I always try to do the right thing. But I think that includes doing the right thing for myself (to the extent that I can) at the same time that I am doing the right thing for others. Hence my belief that--in the world that we live in today--one needs to consider legal consequences at the same time that one is considering moral consequences. Especially in a situation where you can take care of both equally well, it seems foolish to me not to.
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