Boarded with bad intentions?

[CarlF]

In 45 years of owning a boat and cruising the US and the Bahamas, I have never had a theft from the boat - even when I was away. I’ve had a dozen thefts from my cars and house ashore.

In a foreign country, even if the local you shoot or hurt isn’t related to the chief of police, he has friends or family who are. When the police arrive you will be the stranger with no friends or family in the country. You will end up in jail.

1. Bars on companionway. Turn off any lights in the cabin so they can’t see you.
2. Bright spreader lights and brighter flashlights
3. Noise - barking dog sound plus air horn is especially effective
4. Get on the VHF.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by wingssail

I like the Beer Spray idea myself, of course that means you have to keep a mouthful of beer at all times.

Yeah, you could befriend the theives with an automatic beer sprayer instead and they would forget all about robbing you. [emoji6]

[belizesailor]

Ive been lucky too, never been boarded, despite having sailed in some dicey places.

The closest Ive come was in Jamaica. I heard a bump in the wee hours. I made no sound and turned on no lights (after all, Ive got the home turf advantage). I slipped out into the cockpit and noticed a local panga under the stern. I was able to get within a few feet of the back of his head unnoticed. Then I asked "can I help you?". I think he made a deposit in the panga. [emoji6] He paddled off in a big hurry.

[gruffa]

ok, here's a boarding story for you. Just the other day in Panama
(seems to be a few stories of boarders being high on drugs):

(from Sailing Seatramp )

Hello everybody, a few of you already heard what happend from our friends. We could manage to borrow a phone to give you an update.
We were boarded and robbed on Saturday evening in Panama, in the Bay Bahia Nombre de Dios.
But let’s start at the beginning.
Around 11am we left our anchorage in front of Marina Linton to sail to the San Blas Islands. As we set sails and wanted to stop the engine, it was not possible. The switch didn’t work. After a short discussion we decided to stop in the next bay and try to fix the problem. We know that there is nothing on the San Blas islands and we didn’t want to have there engine problems.
It took quite a while to find out that the switch behind the panel was broken. Mario fixed it but it took some time. It was already 5pm. Sunset is at 7pm and we wouldn’t make it to San Blas during daylight. It’s to dangerous to arrive there in the night as all charts are not 100% presize.
We anchored in front of a small town. We considered it’s safe to stay overnight if we lock ourselves in the boat when we go to bed.
Around 7.30 pm, we just finished our dinner and we’re both down in the galley to wash the dishes.
We suddenly heard a noise on the deck. In the same moment we could here a fast boat stopping close to us. Mario jumped out into the Cockpit. 2 guys were already on board and hold a gun into his face, tried to push him back into the boat. He yelled to me that I should run into our cabin and look the door.
After a few minutes I had to open the door, 6 people on board holding Mario a gun to his head. Should I stay in the cabin? No. Boat doors are not made to hold when you kick long enough against them. So I opened the door. I thought maybe cooperation is the best way.
The guys opened every storage and found a lot of technical stuff. Smartphones, Laptops, Tablets, Cameras, Satellite phone and much more. Including all the hidden security copies we made on hard disks. All credit cards are gone. A little bit money is left.
To end the story, after 45 Minutes on board, they bondaged Mario and two of the guys threw me into one cabin. They were high on drugs and out of control. They tried to rape me, but luckily the „boss“ of them stopped it. They all left the boat and during that they activated the stolen EPIRB. A mayday was directly sent to the MRCC Germany, they contacted our emergency contact and in a few minutes it was clear that we must have a big problem as our EPIRB was sending from land.
To make the story even sadder, the Panamainan coast guard was informed by the MRCC. The next office was 3 miles away. Nothing happened. After we were free again we lifted the anchor as I just wanted to go back to Marina Linton to get some help and try to manage to block all our bank accounts. On this 7 miles trip we were sending Pan Pan via VHF and issued a DSC distress messages too. We could see container ships on the AIS. Nobody was responding.
We are now back at the anchorage and try to sort things out. We have to check if the insurances will pay for it or not. But it looks to be more complicated then we thought.
For the moment we are not sure what we will do. If we will continue our travel or prepare the boat to sell it. We need some time to forget the shock and get organized again.
We are really overwhelmed about the solidarity and support we have recieved. The generous donations you made even before we could tell you what happened are very appreciated and leave us speechless. It will help to cover the financial loss and replace parts of the stolen gear.
Your kind messages help us to stay positiv and keep the head up.
We truly appreciate your support and kindness. We will keep you updated as soon as possible.
Nina & Mario

[jmh2002]

Of course the joksters have now filled up this thread with more unhelpful and impractical suggestions and nonsense, so I'll quote my summary here again for those who are genuinely interested in this subject:

Originally Posted by jmh2002

In general the summary of this thread, to protect yourself, is mostly:

- a Light and Alarm System something like above
- a Stowed and Secured Boat to discourage opportunists
- a Restriction of Access to the Interior
- a Pepper / Bear Spray arsenal in the case of actual confrontation

Additionally all of the above seems to be within reasonably achievable levels of cost, practicality, ability, skill, etc.

Whether these items be commercial equipment, professionally installed, or DIY 'copies' by the owner, is and will always remain boat dependant.

But that doesn't really change the above summary and the various options are still reasonably achievable by most boats of different financial capacity.

One note about fish bats, billy clubs, hand spears, and the like. These types of weapons require close quarters and some physical ability (think about age, skill, partners, children, etc, etc) and if taken may be used against you, possibly lethally.

So from cruisers who posted real world experience that is why such items are not on my summary.

A Pepper Spray arsenal is on the summary though, since it can be used by anyone with very low physical or skill requirements, and different versions are available that are more directional such as a jet of liquid (or even a fireable gel ball) not actually a 'spray' as the name suggests.

This enables some type of distance proximity, even if it's just a few feet inside the cockpit or cabin - although the idea is that the Alarm, Lights, and Restricted Access help prevent such close proximity occuring in the first place, but of course it can still happen.

Always trying to keep (or put) distance between you and the attacker is normally taught in self defense. It's common sense of course.

Let's try to keep discussion of this serious subject, well, serious I guess, please.

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by gruffa

ok, here's a boarding story for you. Just the other day in Panama
(seems to be a few stories of boarders being high on drugs):

(from Sailing Seatramp )

Frightening and distressing. Sorry to hear of this. Unfortunately it seems to be happening more and more often.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by jmh2002

Frightening and distressing. Sorry to hear of this. Unfortunately it seems to be happening more and more often.

The Linton Bay anchorage has become a problem spot. Nombre de Dios is not far away so may be same bad guys.

[B23iL23]

If you read the post above from Sailing Seatramp (which is scary and distressing) , the time they had from hearing a noise, looking out on deck and finding a gun pointed at you - even if the crew were armed, they would have had no time to arm themselves and take any action. All happened in a matter of seconds so I doubt any defense measures would have worked.


The Seatramp experience is thankfully rare and most people that come aboard uninvited are just opportunists and want a quick in and out. Lights/sirens and other methods might just be enough to keep them away. I know someone who sails with his (very) big dog and he leaves the companion way open at night so the dog and roam. Never has any problems.

[belizesailor]

The recent murder of a cruiser in the San Blas illustrates another point. Some say they will only cruise "safe" areas. Well, historically the San Blas has qualified as such. Crime against cruisers is rare there...then this particularly violent attack happens out of the blue. Historically Bocas del Toro has been a reasonably safe haven for cruisers too, but a few years ago an uncharacteristically violent attack occurred there too. Ditto for Belize, until a few years ago violent crime against cruisers was unheard of. Nowhere is "safe" 100% of the time.

Despite having lived/travelled/cruised all over Central America, Ive never been the victim of a crime. The only time Ive ever been robbed at gun point was in an upscale neighborhood in the USA...because I was just not expecting it in that venue and let my guard down. Bad stuff happens everywhere.

[mikedefieslife]

Originally Posted by CarlF

In a foreign country, even if the local you shoot or hurt isn’t related to the chief of police, he has friends or family who are. When the police arrive you will be the stranger with no friends or family in the country. You will end up in jail.

It doesn't really work like that. Especially small countries when your embassy gets involved, and especially if that country is a crown dependency of your own or similar which many Caribbean countries are for UK/EU nationals

In Venezuela, Columbia and likes sure, but not in BVI, T&C, Martinique, St Maarten etc...

[Tetepare]

Originally Posted by mikedefieslife

It doesn't really work like that. Especially small countries when your embassy gets involved, and especially if that country is a crown dependency of your own or similar which many Caribbean countries are for UK/EU nationals

In Venezuela, Columbia and likes sure, but not in BVI, T&C, Martinique, St Maarten etc...

It really DOES work like that. Perhaps not on some Carib islands, but in most of the rest of the developing world. Certainly in most of the Pacific. The more remote from the capital, the more likely issues will be handled locally outside of the rule of law- at times with locally-aligned “law enforcement “.

By the time US Embassy in PNG or HighCom is involved the locals have “settled” the matter. The bad guys are secreted off, and witnesses have their story straight, to the yachties concern. Local courts almost always favor the locals. The yachtie best move on because the local’s family and community make it well known the yachtie is at best unwelcomed.

Wontok and Kastom are the rule of law first.

[Group9]

Originally Posted by mikedefieslife

It doesn't really work like that. Especially small countries when your embassy gets involved, and especially if that country is a crown dependency of your own or similar which many Caribbean countries are for UK/EU nationals

In Venezuela, Columbia and likes sure, but not in BVI, T&C, Martinique, St Maarten etc...

A very good friend of mine killed someone in the Bahamas with a gun in self defense back in the eighties. The US embassy was involved and he was allowed to leave the country while the hearing was pending. He was nervous about returning for the hearing (about six months later) but did come back, and said the hearing, which was just like being in US court (except for the wigs and having to stand while told his story from the witness “Stand” ) cleared him and he was released.

The dead guy’s family (and, an attorney they had retained) were also present and the judge had to admonish them to settle down several times, he recounted as well.

[a64pilot]

There are pepper sprays that are gel like and often are dyed to identify the person sprayed, with the gel there is no aerosol to worry about drifting on you.
However if you spray someone they don’t just disappear and you will have a very ticked off person to deal with and the confrontation has just become violent, so think about what your going to do after you spray someone, before you do.

[Saleen411]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

It really DOES work like that. Perhaps not on some Carib islands, but in most of the rest of the developing world. Certainly in most of the Pacific. The more remote from the capital, the more likely issues will be handled locally outside of the rule of law- at times with locally-aligned “law enforcement “.

By the time US Embassy in PNG or HighCom is involved the locals have “settled” the matter. The bad guys are secreted off, and witnesses have their story straight, to the yachties concern. Local courts almost always favor the locals. The yachtie best move on because the local’s family and community make it well known the yachtie is at best unwelcomed.

Wontok and Kastom are the rule of law first.

Yes...local justice.........

Lynching of tourists, 2013 Nosy Be


The island, like most of Madagascar, suffers from an extreme level of uncertainty linked to crime and violence. Rumours quickly turn into accusations in Madagascar, and lynchings are common, even for allegations related to traffic accidents or theft. On October 3, 2013, the body of an 8-year old boy was discovered at the beach of Ambatoloaka on the island. The condition of the body was poor after one week in the water, and a rumour was spread that the child had been murdered by Western organ-trafficking tourists. The uncle of the boy, a local named Zaidou, was detained by the local police for questioning, but a violent mob gathered to storm the local jail to punish the supposed murderer.[7]

As the uncle was not found, the anger of the mob turned to the Westerners having been in contact with the person, French tourists Sébastien Judalet and Roberto Gianfalla. Judalet was found and dragged from his hotel to the beach of Ambatoloaka, where the large mob repeatedly hit him with sticks and stones. The police received at least five calls from bystanders or expatriates but did not respond. Two police officers actually joined the mob, one of which who was filming the lynching on his smartphone.[8] After three hours of torture and humiliation, the naked and bleeding tourists were put into car tires and thrown alive into a bonfire on the beach.[7] On the afternoon of October 3, 2013, the uncle Zaidou was found driving on the island. A mob of several hundred quickly lynched him by burning him alive on a public street next to a mosque.

Both events were filmed by the bystanders, publishing the murders on the internet. In spite of this mass of evidence, the local justice took two years of investigation to finally convict 4 members of the mob to lifetime imprisonment and 6 others to shorter sentences; 26 suspects in custody were released without charge as well as the two police officers.[9] A local politician, Joseph Yoland, was accused of inciting the killings on his radio station at the island, but the charges were dropped when the court allegedly was unable to retrieve any recordings of the aired shows that evening.[10] Following the events, the French authorities warned travellers for "high risk of assaults, that could be extremely violent",[11] U.S. travellers are also advised "[to] be aware of the potential for mob violence and ‘popular justice’ that is sometimes directed towards foreign nationals.".[12] The lynching in Nosy Be is a rare public murder of expatriates in Madagascar; most lynchings concern locals. However, expatriates are frequently subject to kidnapping and extortion, such as the January 2015 kidnapping of a 12-year old French child outside of his school,[13] and two separate kidnappings of French citizens of Indo-pakistani origin in April 2016 [14] that triggered the intervention of the French SWAT team in Madagascar.

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by B23iL23

If you read the post above from Sailing Seatramp (which is scary and distressing) , the time they had from hearing a noise, looking out on deck and finding a gun pointed at you - even if the crew were armed, they would have had no time to arm themselves and take any action. All happened in a matter of seconds so I doubt any defense measures would have worked.


The Seatramp experience is thankfully rare and most people that come aboard uninvited are just opportunists and want a quick in and out. Lights/sirens and other methods might just be enough to keep them away. I know someone who sails with his (very) big dog and he leaves the companion way open at night so the dog and roam. Never has any problems.

Yes absolutely. Prevention if possible is best of course.

Lights, sirens, etc, to not only deter the attacker but also give the crew what may be vital seconds to react.

Some light and siren systems can be so powerful (some even create nausea) that even an armed attacker may not want to board, or may quickly jump back off.

I think it is surprising how many opportunistic attackers would be deterred simply by the lights coming on. They are not expecting any reaction, they are expecting a dead quiet boat with everyone asleep, an easy target with no resistance, and will be quite shocked to find they are instead themselves under surveillance.

For a determined (or way high on drugs) intruder the next step of course is the hardened companionway which is a pity because I have always liked to sleep out on deck in the tropics.

But you can see other threads here, even dating back years, where people are contemplating some type of bar or grill system for compainways and hatches, either retrofitted or part of the design on a new build.

Additionally, as we learnt from the SeaTramp incident, our natural reaction of running out on deck is not the best either, possibly defeating any security arrangements that you may have in place.

So it seems for most boats, 1 or 2 security cameras are required too, in order to check what is happening first.

These need not be hugely expensive. Even something like WyzeCam https://www.wyze.com/ is only 30 USD with night vision, AI person detection, 2 way audio, Pan & Scan, etc. No doubt even cheaper variants are available too, which I'm sure a64pilot will quickly find for us