Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 18-07-2013, 19:26   #61
Registered User
 
jeanathon's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: WNC mountains U.S.
Boat: 1968 Hinterhoel Redwing
Posts: 513
Tanks,
Cut the cable with a grinder or sawsaw. If the Tow company sues for salvage you will find out if it is salvage or a simple tow, or mail a check for 200 with paid in full written on it. If they cash it you got a contract.
__________________

__________________
Let's ban together to ban sillycone....
jeanathon is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 19:32   #62
Registered User
 
sabray's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Wash DC
Boat: PETERSON 44
Posts: 3,169
Very well said. I think you had to much trust and got ripped off. As such you fed the bad wolf.
__________________

__________________
sabray is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 19:39   #63
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Endeavour 42CC
Posts: 1,182
'Stupid' 'cry baby'

What a bunch of @holes!

The guy does have a legit question as to whether this was a salvage or a tow. I think $100 is way too low for the tow plus the mooring as well. Maybe the bill for TOWING plus a mooring would be $650. But there is a distinct legal difference between salvage and tow. So all the smart@sses tell him to hire a lawyer...for $2000 or more. F-ing brilliant.

So much for cruisers helping cruisers.
__________________
gettinthere is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 19:42   #64
Registered User
 
sabray's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Wash DC
Boat: PETERSON 44
Posts: 3,169
I think he got a tow bill. Salvage would have some negotiation and been much more.
__________________
sabray is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 20:02   #65
Registered User
 
transmitterdan's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: Valiant 42
Posts: 4,018
Quote:
Originally Posted by sabray View Post
I think he got a tow bill. Salvage would have some negotiation and been much more.
Exactly right. $675 is not a salvage bill. It's reasonable for a tow in that area. Actually it's not unreasonable for most anywhere in the US.
__________________
transmitterdan is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 20:54   #66
Registered User
 
JK n Smitty's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Hingham, MA
Boat: Catalina 310
Posts: 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by gettinthere View Post
'Stupid' 'cry baby'

What a bunch of @holes!

The guy does have a legit question as to whether this was a salvage or a tow. I think $100 is way too low for the tow plus the mooring as well. Maybe the bill for TOWING plus a mooring would be $650. But there is a distinct legal difference between salvage and tow. So all the smart@sses tell him to hire a lawyer...for $2000 or more. F-ing brilliant.

So much for cruisers helping cruisers.
Who's the cruiser not offering help?

The guy who tied the boat to his stern? He saved the boat from going on the hard. Should he risk his anchor dragging due to the
__________________
http://svsmitty.wordpress.com/
JK n Smitty is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 21:04   #67
Registered User
 
sabray's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Wash DC
Boat: PETERSON 44
Posts: 3,169
Cruiser saved the boat tow guys towed it and stuck it on a mooring. This is not salvage. I don't think anyone was creepy or had cause for using .^^%}]{{=stuff. What's a mooring on the block on the 4th 200 bucks? tow was probably 400 bucks at most. Now your near the charge. Jeez. Sucks but then op knew he didn't anchor well but that's okay cause it was best he could do. Puzzled.
__________________
sabray is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 21:40   #68
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,413
Re: Block Island Anchor Drag/Tow $$$

There are a lot of pirates out there and tow boats are right there with them. I know BI's Great salt pond and the holding is pretty lousy in the NE region for sure. The fee charged is a rip off... no if's and's or but's. Everyone is all concerned with liability and so forth... instead of trying to help out another sailor. Depending on the wind conditions and the ground tackle it may have been possible to re anchor the guy's boat for him and not call the tow guys who would then collect an exorbitant fee. This story stinks.
__________________
Sandero is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 21:59   #69
Registered User
 
Teknav's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Texas - USA
Boat: Twin Otter de Havilland Floatplane
Posts: 1,838
Re: Block Island Anchor Drag/Tow $$$

Hi Defjef! You are a do-gooder sailor! Liability issues are costly, even under Good Samaritan laws. Let's say, I help a woman in the middle of nowhere deliver her baby. Under Good Samaritan laws, I should not be punished for helping out and for using good judgement if something goes wrong. If a complication developed during the delivery, make no mistake about it that I'd be dragged to court. Who's going to pay for my defense lawyer and my time off work? That's why most health care professionals when traveling, like to remain incognito. We live in a sue-crazy society.

In the above example, what if the anchor fell off while re-positioning it because of poor tackle attachment? How are you going to explain it? The old adage...nice people finish last...is very much alive, unfortunately.

Mauritz
__________________
Retired - Don't Ask Me To Do A Damn Thing!
Teknav is offline  
Old 18-07-2013, 23:25   #70
Registered User
 
svmariane's Avatar

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Currently in South Pacific. Home Port: Vienna, Austria
Boat: Celestial, Stay'sl-Rigged Sloop, 48 ft
Posts: 1,163
Re: Block Island Anchor Drag/Tow $$$

Would the OP be willing to post on the forum a copy of the tow company invoice? Just to clarify the situation. (Names can be blocked to protect... etc.)

OP claims it's a "salvage" charge; lotta talk on here about a towing charge.

Laws are funny things in that they mean exactly what they say. Regardless of the shoulda/woulda/coulda(s) concerning the pre-incident anchoring maneuver, the OP might very well have a valid point that the tow company was not actually involved in a salvage. They might merely have towed a boat from the Kind Cruiser's stern to a safe mooring - without owner's permission nor legal right to so do. Merely because the Kind Cruiser requested the tow may place no legal liability upon the owner. In effect, it might be legally only a courtesy tow and docking, since there was - at the time the tow company became involved - no hazard to navigation. It may prove out that Kind Cruiser bears the only legal liability to pay for that tow, and OP would have grounds to recover his vessel - sans payment - because of that allocation of liability. Up to tow company to chase down Kind Cruiser.

Word of warning: The tow operator might know the laws and have mentioned to the Kind Cruiser that he - the tow operator - could do nothing unless Kind Cruiser cast adrift the vessel in question. If Kind Cruiser dropped the line, then tow man now had a hazard to navigation in front of his eyes, and indeed an abandoned and drifting vessel worthy of salvage and/or tow & tie up for safety reasons.

Got witnesses?
__________________
"Being offended is not the same thing as being right." Dave Barry.
Note: Offense is always taken, never given.
When life hands you lemons..... add gin & tonic!
svmariane is offline  
Old 19-07-2013, 01:00   #71
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Geelong Australia
Boat: Beneteau First 44.7
Posts: 63
Re: Block Island Anchor Drag/Tow $$$

I think that the OP has gotten off pretty lightly for his negligent action. Pay the $650 and HTFE would be my advice. Nothing stopping the original salvage party from giving the abandoned vessel to another party which seems to be the case here.
__________________
frant is offline  
Old 19-07-2013, 02:21   #72
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 92
If I had a question of whether a bill was a salvage or a tow bill, I would call my insurance company. They are the other party that has a vested interest in the outcome. Even if you don't have towing insurance, I think the insurance company would want to be clear there is not a salvage claim and the exposure is limited. Personally I would be grateful to pay $600 bucks as an anchoring lesson, and happy my boat was safe and didn't cause any injuries or damage to other property. I would want to verify there was no option for future claims to be made.

I would guess the Good Samaritan didn't specifically call the towing company, If I was the person who tied up your boat I would have called the harbor master. In fact if a boat starts dragging in BI my experience is several people would call the harbor master well before it was secure to another boat. I would guess the towing company monitors this traffic and responds.

It is interesting to hear comments like everyone knows the holding is poor in BI. We anchor there several times a summer never near 4th of July. Our experience has always been the holding was amazing. However we typically anchor in the deeper parts of the pond. We have been in a squall that immediately switched the wind 180 degrees at 30 knots and didn't budge an inch on the anchor. We did see several boats drag and go sailing though the pond, but those where clearly not a holding ground issue as they were anchored next to us in the deep mud.

This past weekend was the first we anchored in the north east section that is shallower. It did take a while to get the anchor to set properly, something that is usually immediate. While boats look close we had the proper amount of scope out, and swung comfortably with our neighbors throughout the night.

I do appreciate the conversation on anchoring in BI, it has been helpful for me to listen to others experience and apply it to my own. It has added an extra degree of caution to anchoring on the east side and biased my preferred spot to other parts of the pond.
__________________
Whaubner is offline  
Old 19-07-2013, 02:55   #73
Moderator
 
noelex 77's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Living on dirt waiting for our new yacht to be built.
Boat: Half built Bestevaer.
Posts: 10,618
Re: Block Island Anchor Drag/Tow $$$

I think we should lighten up on the OP about dragging. If you anchor long enough you are going to drag, probably on many occasions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tanksalot View Post
2. Anchoring with a 7:1 or even 5:1 scope that week would have been impossible without endangering other boats. From seeing their anchor rode, none had that scope. Boats were evenly spaced in 25 - 45 ft. of water, distributed 100 ft. apart. The best anchor would have been a couple of engine blocks, chained together.
.
However, there are always some lessons to learned. I would point a couple of things about the above statement that is incorrect.
1. Unless you are in strong wind (say 35 knots +) you cannot judge the scope another boat has out by the angle of the rode. In light/moderate winds the rode angle visible at the bow will be much the same if the scope is 2:1, or 20:1.
If you have a similar scope, rode and boat type to your neighbours boats can anchor close together on long scopes without any risk of collision.

The only way to know what scope you neighbours have out is too ask (or in nice clear water look).
__________________
noelex 77 is offline  
Old 19-07-2013, 04:47   #74
Registered User
 
Delancey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Miami, FL
Boat: sunk by irma
Posts: 3,462
Re: Block Island Anchor Drag/Tow $$$

Crying about how expensive a tow for your boat on Block Island is on a holiday weekend is like complaining about how expensive it is to buy new shoes for your polo pony, not very classy.

Thinking $100 is a reasonable fee is like paying the neighbor kid $5 to clean the gutters on a 5,000 square foot house and feeling altruistic about it.

I would be curious to know how the OP earns a living and can afford to spend a Block Island weekend on his yot. Whether or not he routinely offers a special "carelessness" discount for people who make mistakes in his own business. Not likely.
__________________
Delancey is offline  
Old 19-07-2013, 05:26   #75
Don't ask if you can't handle it
 
sailorboy1's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: On the boat somewhere
Boat: Hunter 410
Posts: 12,307
Re: Block Island Anchor Drag/Tow $$$

I wonder what the OP wants us to tell him, so we could be done with it.
__________________

__________________
jobless, houseless, clueless, living on a boat and cruising around somewhere
sailorboy1 is offline  
Closed Thread

Tags
anchor

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 15:47.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.