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Old 05-10-2015, 10:57   #46
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Re: Bahamas prayers

It's completely insane that ship even left port. It's truly a case of either complete corporate greed and disregard for the Mariners lives (mostly American JAX based) or irrational exuberance on the part of the captain. Maybe both.

They sailed squarely thru the cone of uncertainty and the local news reports are saying "it's very difficult to get real time forecast at sea"!
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Old 05-10-2015, 10:58   #47
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Re: Bahamas prayers

sadly , damages are always worse than expected when a cane rapidly intensifies over a location expecting only so much wind and surge.
cat 4. didnt it hit bahamas as a 2??
intensified to a strong cat 4 before taking its leave....
what is highest elevation of bahamas? between the surge, surf and winds, they were pretty much toast.
i hope rebuild is rapid for them and i hope there were minimal casualties.
ocean girl an drain dog, i am happy you guys were safe and boat is ok.. good call, kids.

as for capt not remaining in port... calculate the money to be lost by a company when the tropical storm wasnt even a cane yet and the routine deliveries to an island port are held in port accruing debt hourly as rent builds at , for that size ship, thousands of dollars hourly.
a schedule is the deadliest item on a boat. i think wasnt the captain so much as the compaany, as when they left, there was no apparent major danger. it was only a ts. maany ts remain as ts, many grow.
i think cpt is ok, but company fo rwhich he works maintained its schedule.
not all ts grow to be cat 4 in that regiion. whoda thunk.
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Old 05-10-2015, 11:29   #48
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Re: Bahamas prayers

I'm quite certain it was already a hurricane. It's only like 36 hours from JAX to where they likely foundered.
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Old 05-10-2015, 11:40   #49
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Re: Bahamas prayers

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Originally Posted by Boatguy30 View Post
It's completely insane that ship even left port. It's truly a case of either complete corporate greed and disregard for the Mariners lives (mostly American JAX based) or irrational exuberance on the part of the captain. Maybe both.

They sailed squarely thru the cone of uncertainty and the local news reports are saying "it's very difficult to get real time forecast at sea"!
Wasn't necessarily the decision to depart that's so questionable, but rather their choice of route... In hindsight, passing down thru the Florida Straits and Old Bahama Channel might have turned out to be a comparative cakewalk...





But once they passed E of the Abacos, and proceeded beyond the Atlantic entrance to the NE Providence Channel, their fate was sealed... More than anything, seems to me what the master of a ship in that circumstance would desire is sea room, running so close to a lee shore created by islands like Eleuthera and Cat Island - which have been claiming ships sine the time of Columbus - seems unfathomable to me.... I can only guess that their last reported proximity to Crooked Island suggests they might have been making for the Crooked Island Passage as an escape route, and an effort to perhaps gain the lee of Crooked and Acklins...

Of course, once they lost propulsion, all bets are off... This from a poster on gCaptain seems especially apropos...

Quote:
Yes, I want to believe there still is the chance for a miracle here but I am also old and know that a ship can capsize when not undercommand in the midst of a powerful hurricane. My own ship once in the Gulf of Alaska was (admittedly, through my own error as her too young master) caught in a wicked force 12 storm which we were forced to run before because to bring the vessel head to might well have caused her to roll over. God was with us that night because if we had lost propulsion we too would likely been lost. I did not realize the great danger then to our situation but now with age and wisdom, I see it all and realize the hand of providence in the lives of us mariners. I have been on several other vessels which also went though such weather that had we gone dead in the water or lost steering they too would have likely foundered. I believe it is God who has allowed me to be here to write all this today. I believe I have died at least six times at sea already if it wasn't for luck and fate.

Sea Star's El Faro - Page 16
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Old 05-10-2015, 11:49   #50
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Re: Bahamas prayers

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I'm quite certain it was already a hurricane. It's only like 36 hours from JAX to where they likely foundered.
According to the timelines I've seen, it was still categorized as a Tropical Storm at the time of their departure... What virtually on one expected - even the Euro forecasters, I believe - would be that it would intensify so rapidly, and build to a Cat 3 within 24 hours...

Again, why they would not have bailed out into the NE Providence Channel at that point, that's what's impossible to fathom, to me...


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Old 05-10-2015, 12:03   #51
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Re: Bahamas prayers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boatguy30 View Post
It's completely insane that ship even left port. It's truly a case of either complete corporate greed and disregard for the Mariners lives (mostly American JAX based) or irrational exuberance on the part of the captain. Maybe both.

They sailed squarely thru the cone of uncertainty and the local news reports are saying "it's very difficult to get real time forecast at sea"!
Yep, some families are going to be rich from this one.
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Old 05-10-2015, 12:42   #52
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Re: Bahamas prayers

I always look mostly had the hurricane center 1-2-3 rule chart. They went dead they the center of that chart. It would be interesting to know if other ships went thru the same area based on the available weather info.
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Old 05-10-2015, 13:20   #53
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Re: Bahamas prayers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boatguy30 View Post
It's completely insane that ship even left port. !
Actually in many cases for large vessels you're safer at sea than in port if a hurricane is coming.
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Old 05-10-2015, 13:33   #54
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Re: Bahamas prayers

Passed us ( Bermuda ) 2130 hrs yesterday, 52 miles to the west. SE quadrant gave us 100 mph gusts. Blue rode it out on her mooring in front of our house at Ferry Reach. ( for those who know the Island )
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Old 05-10-2015, 14:02   #55
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Re: Bahamas prayers

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I always look mostly had the hurricane center 1-2-3 rule chart. They went dead they the center of that chart. It would be interesting to know if other ships went thru the same area based on the available weather info.
This was just posted on gCaptain...

It is the track of another merchant vessel that departed Charleston bound for the Mona Passage and Trinidad at about the same time EL FARO left Jax port.

They altered course to the Florida Straits/Old Bahama Channel, seeing it as a viable route around JOAQUIN...

Apparently, it was...

Sea Star's El Faro - Page 32






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Old 05-10-2015, 14:24   #56
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Re: Bahamas prayers

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Actually in many cases for large vessels you're safer at sea than in port if a hurricane is coming.
I bet that's exactly what all these dead guys are thinking. Seriously?
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Old 05-10-2015, 15:34   #57
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Re: Bahamas prayers

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I bet that's exactly what all these dead guys are thinking. Seriously?
It's unfortunate that this ship foundered but what I posted is correct. If a hurricane is forecast to come close to a port most of the large vessels put out to sea. Just watch the next time a hurricane is forecast to hit the Chesapeake, the fleet in Norfolk will head out to sea. Of course they will try to avoid the hurricane when out there but sea room is your friend.
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Old 05-10-2015, 16:12   #58
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Re: Bahamas prayers

The BOAT is safer, The CREW may not be!
And a Warning: there are going t be a lot of loose containers out there now!
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Old 05-10-2015, 16:38   #59
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Re: Bahamas prayers

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And a Warning: there are going t be a lot of loose containers out there now!
With a month to make it up to the rhumbline being sailed by the Caribbean 1500 and Salty Dawg Rally fleets, or anyone else headed for the islands...

Sweet...

btw, to Raindog & Erika, VERY well done, so glad to hear you came through fine...
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Old 05-10-2015, 16:46   #60
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Re: Bahamas prayers

Ship mooring ropes and wharf bollards are not designed for hurricanes. Tidal surge and wave surge also major issues for many ports.
Ships have to go to sea and move to a safer position.

Cruise ships, for example, are always changing their schedules because ports cannot take them if weather conditions don't suit.
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