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Old 14-09-2012, 12:49   #16
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Auspicious View Post
You are fortunate. I lost two good friends due to issues during a passage.

On the other hand I have made some tremendous friends - five or six - during passage with crew found on sailing fora and crewing services.

I guess I'm ahead, but I still regret losing my friends.

That's unfortunate. In my case, the owner expressed reservations about the reliability of a crew member who had no-showed on a prep day. I had no argument to present in his defense --- the owner had valid concerns. So, my discussion with the future ex-crew member was pretty straight forward. He was disappointed, but he got over it.

Crew issues which arise due to personality conflicts are more difficult to resolve. And, as has been suggested here already, compatible personalities may be more important than skill set when heading offshore on a long passage.
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Old 14-09-2012, 14:45   #17
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

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Originally Posted by casual View Post
I, am 66 in good general health with a few ortopedic related conditions.

Now do I, seek a different crew my concern is the compatability factor and, the health of the person, how does one assure them self that the person selected is in good health mentally and phisically, not to be offensive is asking for a doctors bill of health going over board?
Not to be offensive - but as potential crew I would be concerned about an elderly skipper who was shaky on his pins / was over-estimating own capabilities.

That's even before we get to the condition and capabilitity of the boat...........

That out of the way I think you have to start from the position of deciding what you actually need and also want from crew. Or indeed do you need / want more than crew? and actually want 2 or 3 potential skippers onboard. IMO plusses and minuses to each approach (with the latter the risk being too many chiefs ).

Given you were originally comfortable with the idea of 3 people onboard, and from the sounds of it none were in spring chicken category perhaps no actual need to now start requiring the fittest and most able crew. If not sure, take a spare .

Whilst perhaps not prudent to take those unable to perform the usual tasks onboard, the fact that someone may have conditions that either mean they simply require more pills than the average drug store has or can't stand a 27 hour watch and then free climb the mast - doesn't mean that they can't perform adequately as part of a well stocked and well trained crew.

Personally I would not bother with a medical for each crew member, but I would insist on full disclosure of the prescription Meds they were taking (for customs reasons) an idea of the reasons and how to deal with anything that goes wrong - could be that the answer to that is a stay in ICU and then a heart transplant , but if:-

a) the crew is cool on taking that risk (given that the first aid kit probably won't cover all that)

and

b) if that happened it would not be the end of the world (well, at least not for everyone else )

.........then why not take them?

In practice if you say you are cool on folks with the odd health issue will keep your options open and will also likely give you more open answers initially - from which you can still pick the fittest of the bunch .

My focus would be far less on the health of the crew but on competency and compatibility. For that you have time to play with by taking folks out for a few sails and ideally even a week onboard.........even at the dock mostly will soon find out if someone is too much of an annoying twat to be stuck less than 10 feet away from 24/7.....despite not being an actual medical condition!. Of course your annoying twat may be my ideal crewmate - and vice verce!

The mental health thing is a tad more tricky, I probably would not take anyone on meds for that. But given that most folks with mental issues won't be diagnosed a clean bill of health from a Doc is not much use. Besides, can never really tell how folks react to stress / being under pressure (especially when cold and wet - and scared?).......and I doubt if many folks would sign up to some serious pre-voyage testing of that. Well, not the ones actually without any mental health issues .

As always, gonna be more likely to get more choice of crew the deeper the Skipper puts hand in pocket and the more time and effort puts in to selection and then building the crew (into a team).

Scratch that itch .
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Old 14-09-2012, 15:26   #18
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

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Originally Posted by xdeeman View Post
Casual - I promise I am not trying to be the grammar Nazi, but your posts are really hard to understand with all the commas - drop the commas and add some periods when you finish a thought and the messages will be much easier for us readers to understand.

I wish you the best of luck finding some healthy crew to join you. I would discourage you from going solo.
I,really beleive the word Nazi has NO place anywhere on this or any other forum.My father spent 30 months of his life eradicating this beleife.Perhaps if my comma's are offensive to youd don't read the post,after all 10 other people responded to the subject comma's and all.
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Old 14-09-2012, 16:04   #19
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

Sorry if I offended you. That was not the intent. It was just a suggestion to make your posts more understandable. Again, sorry if it offended you.
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Old 14-09-2012, 16:08   #20
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

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Originally Posted by belizesailor View Post
And, as has been suggested here already, compatible personalities may be more important than skill set when heading offshore on a long passage.
Darn tootin'.

I'll take good judgment, decent people, and care for the boat over a sailing rock star ever time.
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Old 14-09-2012, 16:46   #21
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

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Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
....

The mental health thing is a tad more tricky, I probably would not take anyone on meds for that. ....

Good point. Psychoactive meds definitely = "NO GO".

I used to know a very competent charter captain, who had a little drug problem that would surface form time-to-time. He was a great guy when he was straight, but a few chemicals in his system and he would go full blown paranoid delusional -- not someone you want aboard on a long offshore run.
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Old 14-09-2012, 17:19   #22
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

I have read some very good points being brought up in this thread. I was wondering how do you tell how someone is going to react to, let's say, 20ft seas and 30-50MPH wind without ever being in that situation before.

With that being said what could you expect to be a worse case situation on an Alantic crossing in the spring? I would want someone on the boat that has been there and done that. I have been through rough sea's before but not exteme's and I have never been on an Atlantic crossing. Just wondering from those that know.
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Old 14-09-2012, 17:37   #23
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
Not to be offensive - but as potential crew I would be concerned about an elderly skipper who was shaky on his pins / was over-estimating own capabilities.

That's even before we get to the condition and capabilitity of the boat...........

That out of the way I think you have to start from the position of deciding what you actually need and also want from crew. Or indeed do you need / want more than crew? and actually want 2 or 3 potential skippers onboard. IMO plusses and minuses to each approach (with the latter the risk being too many chiefs ).

Given you were originally comfortable with the idea of 3 people onboard, and from the sounds of it none were in spring chicken category perhaps no actual need to now start requiring the fittest and most able crew. If not sure, take a spare .

Whilst perhaps not prudent to take those unable to perform the usual tasks onboard, the fact that someone may have conditions that either mean they simply require more pills than the average drug store has or can't stand a 27 hour watch and then free climb the mast - doesn't mean that they can't perform adequately as part of a well stocked and well trained crew.

Personally I would not bother with a medical for each crew member, but I would insist on full disclosure of the prescription Meds they were taking (for customs reasons) an idea of the reasons and how to deal with anything that goes wrong - could be that the answer to that is a stay in ICU and then a heart transplant , but if:-

a) the crew is cool on taking that risk (given that the first aid kit probably won't cover all that)

and

b) if that happened it would not be the end of the world (well, at least not for everyone else )

.........then why not take them?

In practice if you say you are cool on folks with the odd health issue will keep your options open and will also likely give you more open answers initially - from which you can still pick the fittest of the bunch .

My focus would be far less on the health of the crew but on competency and compatibility. For that you have time to play with by taking folks out for a few sails and ideally even a week onboard.........even at the dock mostly will soon find out if someone is too much of an annoying twat to be stuck less than 10 feet away from 24/7.....despite not being an actual medical condition!. Of course your annoying twat may be my ideal crewmate - and vice verce!

The mental health thing is a tad more tricky, I probably would not take anyone on meds for that. But given that most folks with mental issues won't be diagnosed a clean bill of health from a Doc is not much use. Besides, can never really tell how folks react to stress / being under pressure (especially when cold and wet - and scared?).......and I doubt if many folks would sign up to some serious pre-voyage testing of that. Well, not the ones actually without any mental health issues .

As always, gonna be more likely to get more choice of crew the deeper the Skipper puts hand in pocket and the more time and effort puts in to selection and then building the crew (into a team).

Scratch that itch .
I.totally aggre with your reference to a healthy Capatian.That is the main reason I,have not posted for crew.I,just got a 100% clean bill of health had to I,undrwent back surgery Wed,Doc say's a complete success as I,left the hosptial the same day,I,wiil however wait 4 or so week's just to make sure.Few of us get to 66 without some kind of ailment.Thus the Big question regarding health.
Thank's all for your time.
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Old 14-09-2012, 17:53   #24
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

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First off you need to determine what makes the perfect crew for you. For some it maybe experiance, youth, age, personality, others it might me health. Only you know what you are looking for so when you post your "Crew wanted" Post be very specific on what you are looking for.
I'm not sure I've ever found perfect crew. Most of the time I'm willing to settle for someone who doesn't get seasick the moment a swell picks up. Bonus points if it's someone who actually reads books while underway.
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Old 14-09-2012, 18:09   #25
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

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I'm not sure I've ever found perfect crew. Most of the time I'm willing to settle for someone who doesn't get seasick the moment a swell picks up. Bonus points if it's someone who actually reads books while underway.
This is what I look for in a good ride along. Not sure if I could call them crew.
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Old 14-09-2012, 18:38   #26
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

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This is what I look for in a good ride along. Not sure if I could call them crew.
Well, yeah. But sometimes the only difference between "crew" and "a good ride along" is that the crew stay behind to help you fold up sails once you've made port.
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Old 14-09-2012, 18:49   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by belizesailor

That's unfortunate. In my case, the owner expressed reservations about the reliability of a crew member who had no-showed on a prep day. I had no argument to present in his defense --- the owner had valid concerns. So, my discussion with the future ex-crew member was pretty straight forward. He was disappointed, but he got over it.

Crew issues which arise due to personality conflicts are more difficult to resolve. And, as has been suggested here already, compatible personalities may be more important than skill set when heading offshore on a long passage.
I totally agree, personality conflicts can and will ruin a passage. I have offered flights to crew just to get rid of them, of course I had the option of stopping off! A good captain can train his crew as need arises but a great trip includes great attitudes and harmony among crew.IMHO
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Old 14-09-2012, 19:46   #28
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

Good crew dont read books? Oh come on. Do you really expect people to never ever have down time on a long passage? I think mental health requires it and if some people get that by reading a book then that is fine with me. As for me, I always read a book before falling asleep whether on land or at sea. Sometimes I dont read more than a paragraph but I always do it. Does that make me bad crew?
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Old 14-09-2012, 20:02   #29
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by casual View Post
I,really beleive the word Nazi has NO place anywhere on this or any other forum.My father spent 30 months of his life eradicating this beleife.Perhaps if my comma's are offensive to youd don't read the post,after all 10 other people responded to the subject comma's and all.
Yikes. Xdeeman was just trying to be helpful and I thought he was very nice about it, and I happen to agree with him -- but more to the point of this thread, that's the kind of hotheaded, easily offended response (to just a casual comment on a cruising forum) that would give me serious misgivings about crossing the Atlantic with a skipper with such fragile sensibilities. What happens at 3:00 a.m. in a squall if I'm not fast enough on the winch?
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Old 14-09-2012, 21:12   #30
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Re: Atlantic Crossing.

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Good crew dont read books? Oh come on. Do you really expect people to never ever have down time on a long passage? I think mental health requires it and if some people get that by reading a book then that is fine with me. As for me, I always read a book before falling asleep whether on land or at sea. Sometimes I dont read more than a paragraph but I always do it. Does that make me bad crew?
I think the comment was that it is a positive if the crew opens a book.
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