Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 28-06-2007, 05:34   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: cairns australia
Boat: now floating easy37
Posts: 636
Images: 41
americas cup

for the moment i have reverted back to my kiwi citizenship, go the kiwis
sean
__________________

__________________
northerncat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-06-2007, 06:34   #2
Moderator Emeritus
 
Ex-Calif's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Singapore
Boat: Maxi 77 - Relax Lah!
Posts: 11,514
Images: 4
Dang - It's 2-2. Switch back, hurry...

BTW - Race 3 had an awesome MOB self recovery by the bowman.

Highlights of race 4 are on in 5 minutes!
__________________

__________________
Relax Lah! is For Sale <--- Click
Click--> Custom CF Google Search or CF Rules
You're gonna need a bigger boat... - Martin Brody
Ex-Calif is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-06-2007, 07:48   #3
Registered User
 
markpj23's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Black Hills, SD
Boat: Now Boatless
Posts: 1,148
Images: 47
Race 3 was the best race I've ever watched.... what a series!!

__________________
Mark
markpj23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-06-2007, 08:09   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 62
what a series indeeeed! If anyone's interested....they have video coverage of the races here:

AmericasCupAnywhere by Alcatel-Lucent - Live Sailing (Internet)
__________________
We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things. ~ Blaise Pascal
merlin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-06-2007, 13:29   #5
Senior Cruiser
 
Alan Wheeler's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Marlborough Sounds. New Zealand
Boat: Hartley Tahitian 45ft. Leisure Lady
Posts: 8,038
Images: 102
The verdict on the "mainsail" release has come through. It's in favour of Alingi. It will be interesting to see if it rattled their cage or not.
__________________
Wheels

For God so loved the world..........He didn't send a committee.
Alan Wheeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-06-2007, 15:32   #6
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Tasmania
Boat: VandeStadt IOR 40' - Insatiable
Posts: 2,317
Images: 91
Are you talking about the Swiss Kiwis or the Arab Kiwis?

It is, to my mind, a little bit sad that the commercial reality of the Americas Cup is such that sailors basically prostitute themselves to the highest bidder. The Swiss team is mostly Kiwis sailing under a flag of convenience. The "Kiwi" team is funded by the United Arab Emirates, were based in the UAE for their training and preparation, and, should they win, you can almost bet that they will defend from Dubai next time.

As to the likely result: At first glance, with a 2:2 scoreline, it looks like a close competition. However, anyone who has been watching will tell you that the Swiss Kiwis have a sinificantly faster boat than the Arab Kiwis. The Arabs have won 2 races because of (a) shifting breezes and (b) Brad Butterworth (good Swiss name that!) the Swiss Kiwi helmsman fell asleep a couple of times at crucial stages. But you only have to watch Alinghi off the start line, sheet on and take off to know who is going to win: They sail faster and higher than the Arab Kiwis to windward and are at least as quick downwind too.

I actually hope that the Arab Kiwis can pinch a couple more races and even, by some miracle, go on to win. The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong (but that is the way to bet).
__________________
Weyalan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-06-2007, 22:39   #7
Senior Cruiser
 
Alan Wheeler's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Marlborough Sounds. New Zealand
Boat: Hartley Tahitian 45ft. Leisure Lady
Posts: 8,038
Images: 102
Quote:
and, should they win, you can almost bet that they will defend from Dubai next time.
Absolutley not the case. The Cup will be held here in NZ....should we win it that is.
UAE is an Airline that flies out of NZ. They are one of the major sponsers and we most likely would not be challenging the cup without them. That is the only tie to the Arab's.
The training was done in Valencia, so as they are used to wind conditions etc.
Please note: this is not a cup raced between countries. The reason it is called "Americas's" cup has nothing to do with the USA. It was the name of the boat that first raced for it. So why can't sailors from anywhere race for whatever team from anywhere?
I see no major difference in speed between the two boats. They each have very different strengths and we will see that show through in tackticks due to different weather conditions.
__________________
Wheels

For God so loved the world..........He didn't send a committee.
Alan Wheeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2007, 00:07   #8
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Tasmania
Boat: VandeStadt IOR 40' - Insatiable
Posts: 2,317
Images: 91
Leaving aside the issue that my tongue was, and remains, reasonably firmly in my cheek...

I will take your claims as to the location of the next AC under advisement. Nevertheless, if the Arab Kiwis do manage to pull off what will be an against the odds victory, then, shortly thereafter, when the announcment comes that the next AC will be based out of Dubai, just remember where you read it first!

I don't know why the rules are as they are Wheels (strangely enough, they didn't invite me to sit on the Rules Committee). Nevetheless, the rules say (and have always said, as far as I know) that the sailor must be of the nationality of the nation of the entry. I'm sure that Brad Butterworh, Ed Baird et al. (and even Russel Coutts last time around) didn't fill in applications for Swiss citizenship because they liked the weather or the climate. Personally, I couldn't give a flying phuque at a rolling doughnut whether there are nationality restrictions, but, given that there are (and long have been), it would seem reasonable to enforce them, no? Of course, the Swiss Kiwis are obeying the strict letter of the law, but are they following the spirit of the law? In a sport that prides itself on some sort of Corinthian ethos, it is not the latter that ought to be more important? Furthermore, it was not so long ago that the rules not only restricted the crew's nationality, but also the boat's "nationality" insofar as the boat and all parts therein had to be built in the country of the challenging nation. i.e the boat, rig, fittings and all the sails had to be built in that country, although it is a rather poorly guarded secret that this rule used to get bent seven ways from sunday back in the day ... in fact the spinnaker flown by the Aussie boat on the day it lost the AC was an "illegal" one that was made in the USA (but you didn't hear that from me).

To be honest wheels, I like to stir the pot, but I don't actually have any paticular axe to grind (if you will excuse the horrible mixed metaphor). I am enjoying this particular AC because:
a) It is both relatively competitive on the water (but I still think Alinghi has an edge in speed, particularly upwind and particularly in the 10+ knots breezes), but also
b) Because it is proving to be such a "circus" off the water too

I hope that the Arab Kiwis win, but only because my boss offered me a bet of 2 bottles of good Tasmanian red wine for me if NZ wins against 1 bottle for him if the Swiss win... other than that, I just hope it is good racing.
__________________
Weyalan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2007, 00:26   #9
Senior Cruiser
 
Alan Wheeler's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Marlborough Sounds. New Zealand
Boat: Hartley Tahitian 45ft. Leisure Lady
Posts: 8,038
Images: 102
Quote:
i.e the boat, rig, fittings and all the sails had to be built in that country
I can't speak for any other team, but the NZ boats were all built here in NZ. The boats were shipped to Valencia on that big Russina Antanov Cargo plane. I don't know what rules on gear are, but I can't see how all fittings could be built in the country. Even the sails are specialised. As I understand it, both Alinghi and Team NZ have their sales built by Norths as those "3D" sails. They can be desinged here in NZ, but Norths only have one factory in the world that can make the sail and that's in the US.
As for crew, every campaign as far back as I can remember has had mixed nationality crews. Even back to the Fremantle days. I never followed the cup before then, so I don't know if it was any further back.
The only rules I know at the mo, in regards to team members, is that once the team has signed for the challenge, any member of that team can not leave and work for another within the time frame of that challenge. Hence why Russel Couts is not racing for any one. He can not join another team after his falling out with Bertaralli(spell?).
The NZ Government has ensured that the cup will be defended in NZ next time, should we be the winners. It was a struggle for the campaign to raise enough money as it was this time around. There was a rumour some time back and the people of NZ made it very plain that there would be no money if the race was not here. Grant Dalton assured the Country that any possible challenge would certainly be here.
P.S. if you are saying anything tongue in cheek, please ensure you post a "face" or captions to suggest such. It would reduce any possibility of war breaking out between NZ and Oz should you slander our Cup campaign again ;-) :-)
__________________
Wheels

For God so loved the world..........He didn't send a committee.
Alan Wheeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2007, 13:46   #10
Senior Cruiser
 
Alan Wheeler's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Marlborough Sounds. New Zealand
Boat: Hartley Tahitian 45ft. Leisure Lady
Posts: 8,038
Images: 102
I forgot to mention. We see a difference in boat performance because each boat has been designed for a particular Wind strength. It was known that the winds would normally strengthen this time of the year, so NZ's boat was designed with the higher wind strengths in mind. However, the "normal" conditions of this time have not occured and in fact, were hardly present at all last year.
I have no idea what Alinghi is thinking with their design. But I would have to say, they seem to be more competitive in the light airs as they seem to point slightly higher. But I think we see an edge with NZ when the breeze strengthens to about 15-18kts.
__________________
Wheels

For God so loved the world..........He didn't send a committee.
Alan Wheeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2007, 15:23   #11
Registered User
 
seafox's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: new zealand
Boat: Lotus 10.6
Posts: 1,270
Images: 26
Stopped waiting up at night to watch what can only described as paint drying. Now I just go online and read the result on the NZ Herald site.
I don't think we will see where the cup would have gone if NZ wins. I don't think they will win.
__________________
seafox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2007, 16:11   #12
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Whangaparaoa,NZ
Boat: 63 ft John Spencer Schooner
Posts: 956
Disagree, I fell more confident now than before, take out the kite screw up and we were all over them.
__________________
dana-tenacity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2007, 16:44   #13
Registered User

Join Date: May 2005
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Boat: 44 foot bruce farr fractional rig
Posts: 165
Images: 12
yep it will give em heaps of ammo for the next race. The team will be closer than ever! Those Man Love moments may come out at the of the next race if they win it! You have got to be facinated about what happened. What are the chances of that kite breaking up - very small indeed and yet it happened. I guess you could say "only in Americas Cup". I watched the whole race live and certainly it was the most exciting. I think ETNZ have a definite speed advantage in that wind strength - no doubt about it. Even butterballs was worried about Alingi going too slow.
__________________
Southernman
southernman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2007, 17:26   #14
Senior Cruiser
 
Alan Wheeler's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Marlborough Sounds. New Zealand
Boat: Hartley Tahitian 45ft. Leisure Lady
Posts: 8,038
Images: 102
Not meaning to be negative, but I don't know what it is with NZ and sport. Whatever we compeate for, we always seem to be going great, but we just never seem to pull it off. And it's not because we can't, it just seems like we are always in a derby that the cart is streaking out infront and suddenly all the wheels wobble and fall off.
But yeah, I do think we have a chance to win, I think we have a good boat and a great team. Lets hope they can nail the wheels back on quickly.
__________________
Wheels

For God so loved the world..........He didn't send a committee.
Alan Wheeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2007, 17:51   #15
Registered User
 
seafox's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: new zealand
Boat: Lotus 10.6
Posts: 1,270
Images: 26
That's just sport Alan. You would think that whatever team or Country in any sport you follow. Only one team can ever win and that team can never stay at the top forever. NZ did win and defend it once. We can't have it all our own way all the time. Well, ........as long as I can
__________________

__________________
seafox is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
China Aims to Make Run for America's Cup sneuman Monohull Sailboats 11 11-10-2007 23:21
Americas Cup televised? Razman23 General Sailing Forum 6 04-05-2007 04:00
My life begins in July cruiseallure Meets & Greets 7 02-04-2007 13:25
Americas Cup - Valencia swagman Europe & Mediterranean 4 09-02-2007 02:13
BONANZA CaptainK Monohull Sailboats 2 13-04-2006 17:05



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:11.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.