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Old 18-12-2015, 10:00   #16
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Re: Stuart FL crushing ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high spee...

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"Future projections put the St. Lucie River railroad bridge impassable for 9.5 hours daily. Local property values and way of life will suffer."

I think there is much more to the story than people opposed to anything new and progressive or even not in my backyard. If above projection is true, it impacts recreational/commercial marine vessel AND automotive traffic since the road and RR bridges must be raised together (per USCG) in order to ensure marine traffic does not get trapped between the spans in a confined waterway subject to weather and tide action.
The road traffic will not be affected, they built a new 65 ft bridge over the river a few years back. The original lift bridge was kept, it has little traffic.
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Old 18-12-2015, 10:11   #17
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

The traffic WILL be affected. I sit on my sundeck and watch that bridge go up on demand for boats and the traffic backs way up. Add 32 more openings a day and they might as well close the road.

That railroad bridge will close down the Okeechobee Waterway, the route across Florida. It affects everyone.
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Old 18-12-2015, 10:13   #18
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Re: Stuart FL crushing ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high spee...

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The road traffic will not be affected, they built a new 65 ft bridge over the river a few years back. The original lift bridge was kept, it has little traffic.

Bob

FL recognizes Dixie Highway at the bridge as a "minor arterial" so that means that road traffic will be impacted. So yes, there is a ratio to consider but it is not zero. Bottom line is that If you drive on that road or pay an employee to do it, you will be affected.
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Old 18-12-2015, 10:18   #19
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Re: Stuart FL crushing ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high spee...

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FL recognizes Dixie Highway at the bridge as a "minor arterial" so that means that road traffic will be impacted. So yes, there is a ratio to consider but it is not zero. Bottom line is that If you drive on that road or pay an employee to do it, you will be affected.
Is there any reason for auto traffic to use the old bridge ? I thought either side could be accessed using the new bridge ?
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Old 18-12-2015, 10:18   #20
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

Wouldn't a 65' high railroad bridge solve most of the problem?
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Old 18-12-2015, 10:27   #21
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

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Construction already started, this billion dollar project effectively bisects this cruiser waypoint, not to mention the local marine industry and general economy. Long story short, the two bottleneck bridges are Dixie Highway and the RR bascule draw bridges. Dixie, considered a minor arterial but well used road, is closed less than the RR bridge now but in the near future the RR planned usage will drive a significant increase in train crossings. RR bridge today is in open position, closing only when freight and low speed passenger trains rumble through.

Brightline train when fully operational is projected to add 35 daily closings on top of that. USCG regulates the body of navigable water between the two bridges requiring that both be opened when marine traffic is present.

Apparently there are still active lawsuits being brought to stop this project.
This is something that will generate huge profits for several peripheral parties who are involved in planning and construction. The reality is you would be running most of the trains empty or near empty. There simply is no where near the demand for more than a couple runs a day. It is also debatable as to the conditions of the bascules to handle high speed traffic. Some experts think it's a recipe for disaster!
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Old 18-12-2015, 11:19   #22
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

Profit is the answer, of course. Personally, I don't know even ONE SINGLE PERSON who is in favor of this train, and while there are obviously people who are in favor, they are in a vast minority. Unfortunately, it is something that the developers, investors, and operators want, and our politicians are so very much for sale (I have lived 9 places in my life, and let me tell you that Florida politicians are not only incredibly corrupt, but totally amateur).

The destruction to habitat and wildlife, the disruption to local traffic (on the water and the land), and the limited demand for this service are well documented, yet this project is presently going through, and although it is technically still under legal challenge, he who finishes first will surely win. I suspect this will not be through the legal process, which isn't good or efficient anywhere, including Florida.

It's very sad, but if you follow Florida politics you see it happen over and over. What the people want doesn't matter in the context of what the money changers (oops! I mean job creators) want, with very few exceptions. Pete
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Old 18-12-2015, 11:21   #23
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

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Wouldn't a 65' high railroad bridge solve most of the problem?
"A" 65' high bridge? As in one? We're talking Miami to Orlando. There's a canal every couple of miles an a road every hundred feet!
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Old 18-12-2015, 11:24   #24
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

There's nothing wrong with wanting to take a high speed train from north/south florida to the other end but there is when you negatively impact the towns you're moving thru. Work a deal with the tracks to the west.

I can only imagine how much extra time I'll need to allow when trying to get thru the railroad bridge. And how long will they be able to leave the old Roosevelt Bridge up when a convoy of boats are waiting for that opening? What a mess this will be!
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Old 18-12-2015, 11:58   #25
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

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"A" 65' high bridge? As in one? We're talking Miami to Orlando. There's a canal every couple of miles an a road every hundred feet!

Don't they already have freight tracks there? If I'm reading this right, this is one more train per hour.
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Old 18-12-2015, 16:26   #26
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

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Don't they already have freight tracks there? If I'm reading this right, this is one more train per hour.

Yes, freight rail crosses now about ten times a day I am told. Added burden is 16 ROUND TRIPS, or 32 high speed crossings daily. So round that off to 40 and you can better understand the statement about "Future projections put the St. Lucie River railroad bridge impassable for 9.5 hours daily. Local property values and way of life will suffer." I don't know if 9.5 is accurate but whatever it is will be a significantly higher frequency.
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Old 18-12-2015, 17:09   #27
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

Stuart is not the only railway crossing affecting boats. The Ft. Lauderdale New River train bridge is also on the plans. That will be very interesting when their towing those 130 footers up and down the River with very limited manoeuvrability and the tourists boats such as the Jungle Queen going through at the same time!!! Not to mention the ton of boats that transit from above that bridge daily! That's a very narrow piece of river with a lot of current! We store above the bridge, luckily it will only affect me twice a year, when we leave for the Bahamas in January and return in April, but this will be huge for others!
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Old 19-12-2015, 06:51   #28
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

This will probably pi** a lot of you off, but as a taxpayer and permanent resident in this state I am way more likely to use the train (actually looking forward to it) than to go under that bridge in my sail boat any time soon.

These are all the same tired arguments that were used against Sun Rail here in Orlando. Everyone whines about lines at the airport and lines of traffic on the highways, but whenever ANY project comes along that might help either one, there are tons of special interest groups against it.

It sure would be great to have another option to get to Miami without driving down 95 or the turnpike (both fatality prone highways between Daytona and Ft. Lauderdale) or spending 3 hrs at the airport for a 45 minute flight.

Y'all might not remember, but a few years ago, the people of this state passed an amendment to actually require the building of high speed rail.
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Old 19-12-2015, 10:08   #29
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

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This will probably pi** a lot of you off, but as a taxpayer and permanent resident in this state I am way more likely to use the train (actually looking forward to it) than to go under that bridge in my sail boat any time soon.
Great, but what about those who benefit from waterborne transit, counted as EVERYONE in any community with a marine orientation. Money spent on each boat is distributed locally to a far greater number than just the boat owner. By the way, this is not just the cruising public. Stuart, Ft Lauderdale, and Jupiter economies are based in large part on multiple marine industries. Ft Lauderdale is the megayacht capital of the world.

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These are all the same tired arguments that were used against Sun Rail here in Orlando. Everyone whines about lines at the airport and lines of traffic on the highways, but whenever ANY project comes along that might help either one, there are tons of special interest groups against it.
Welcome to Florida. SIGs? It is far wider than a few groups when you look into the facts, you may change your view about small groups with same old arguments. There's brand new ones connected all the way to the expansion of the Panama Canal and expected increases in freight shipping north from Miami. There is the issue about asking taxpayers to fund a project that was slated to use private funding. There is the conflict of pending lawsuits due to incomplete or misrepresented impact studies. SIGs are not at play here. Not when this change will negatively impact the majority of people in these cities.

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It sure would be great to have another option to get to Miami without driving down 95 or the turnpike (both fatality prone highways between Daytona and Ft. Lauderdale) or spending 3 hrs at the airport for a 45 minute flight.

Y'all might not remember, but a few years ago, the people of this state passed an amendment to actually require the building of high speed rail.
I will estimate that I have done that trip far more times than you have and I agree with you. From my understanding there is a north-south rail corridor west of the heavily populated coastal areas that should be considered plan A. We need due diligence on behalf of our elected officials to ensure this is not a boondoggle which FL taxpayers will be saddled with.
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Old 19-12-2015, 15:24   #30
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Re: Stuart FL cruising ground impacted by All Aboard FL, aka Brightline high speed tr

I keep my boat at Sunset marina and I am hoping that all those empty docks on the east side of the bridges in downtown Stuart will become available for short stays to accommodate transiting boats.

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