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Old 23-01-2014, 15:41   #226
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Re: St Lucia murder

I wasn't really serious (well maybe a little).

But I believe there may be a big difference between an execution by lethal injection carried out at 1 am in a dark room away from the public, and a public hanging or beheading carried out in the public square at noon.
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Old 23-01-2014, 15:47   #227
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Re: St Lucia murder

Perhaps you can be part of a guillotine revival?
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Old 23-01-2014, 15:49   #228
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Originally Posted by sailorboy1 View Post
I wasn't really serious (well maybe a little).

But I believe there may be a big difference between an execution by lethal injection carried out at 1 am in a dark room away from the public, and a public hanging or beheading carried out in the public square at noon.
Yup.. big differences...
The public square drew much bigger crowds and the street vendors did great trade..
The 'Hippy Floggings' in the NWFP were very popular.. usually drew a coupla thousand..
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Old 23-01-2014, 16:17   #229
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Re: St Lucia murder

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Yeah, we here in the good ol' USA execute more people and throw more in jail then anywhere in the world, and yet we still have high crime rates and very violent crimes.
Yes and the violent crime rate in Europe is double, two times, the USA.
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Old 23-01-2014, 16:19   #230
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Re: St Lucia murder

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Yes and the violent crime rate in Europe is double, two times, the USA.
I love statistics - you can prove almost anything. Violent crime - yes, more total. Murder? not even close.

Greg
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Old 23-01-2014, 16:24   #231
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Re: St Lucia murder

Yes, a little pyrotechnics display and maybe a fishing net just below the surface. Some weight for express delivery to Davy Jones's Locker...;-)
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Old 23-01-2014, 16:30   #232
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Re: St Lucia murder

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I love statistics - you can prove almost anything. Violent crime - yes, more total. Murder? not even close.

Greg
Violent crime is double per capita in Europe. Yes, murder... 2 to 3 times higher in the US.
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Old 23-01-2014, 16:36   #233
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Re: St Lucia murder

Also property crime can be high in Europe, as well as pickpocketing and pursesnatching. Americans in Europe who (rarely) catch a pickpocket in the act often go after them physically - this is not so acceptable in Europe, which explains some of the difference.

I used to work with English and German colleagues (who lived there) and they would occasionally show up at work with black eyes. It seems they would get into bar brawls. This is pretty rare in the US - no one wants to throw a punch and get back a bullet.

Greg
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Old 23-01-2014, 16:48   #234
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Re: St Lucia murder

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Yes, that is a common belief in the US and feels right to many. The problem is that it has precious little facts to support it. I go with facts to the extent that I can, and the facts aren't there in this case. Admittedly it is devilishly difficult to collect solid data, and cross-national data don't work well here because the US is such an outlier in gun ownership and other things that affect the murder rate. But I challenge you to provide evidence for your belief.

Greg
Wait...let me think about this for a minute...a death in St. Lucia is dissuading folks from visiting because of a perceived increased risk of death...but execution of a killer - according to the "facts"- will do nothing to dissuade perps because of perceived increased risk of execution.

Hmmm...doesn't feel right to me.

An explanation of why human nature differs in the two circumstances is my challenge to you.

Surprised no one has made the often used and obvious argument that at least the murderer being executed won't kill again.
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Old 23-01-2014, 16:49   #235
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Re: St Lucia murder

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There are many good point made on this thread,however, the reality is that St Lucia needs to send out a message to cruisers to reassure them that thier Island is a safe place to visit....its not a quesion of ¨this could happen anywhere¨...the truth i it has just happened there....a boost of all round confidence is seriously needed and thier top marketing people need to step forward now........

The "Message" would be better coming from Cruisers who Sail PAST St Lucia... and Avoid it... If you cut off ALL their Cruiser $$$ - the Police/Gov't might be much more proactive BEFORE an attack!

Just Sayin'...
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Old 23-01-2014, 16:57   #236
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Re: St Lucia murder

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I can be no worse than visiting any large city, such as New Orleans, Miami, or Rio Di Janeiro. The place has many desperate poor, some of which are drug addicts. Its also filled with many fine upstanding citizens.
I may be wrong and you right… but just to make sure, please provide pointers to the cases of murdered cruisers in New Orleans, Miami and Rio de Janeiro?

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Old 23-01-2014, 17:08   #237
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Re: St Lucia murder

St Lucia and much of the Caribbean no longer cater to the small privately owned sailboat trade. They realize that there is more revenue in resorts. large mega-yacht marinas, and the bareboat charter trade. Cruise ships that pay a fee to visit are also favored.
St Lucia is an example and has created a huge disparity between the haves and the have-nots. Hence the higher crime rate..
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Old 23-01-2014, 17:16   #238
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Re: St Lucia murder

The behavior of honest folks calmly making legal choices in advance doesn't relate to robbers on adrenaline (and possibly more) overdoing a beating intended to extort money.

I note that throwing them in jail for life without possibility of parole equally prevents them killing again.

I do not want this to devolve into an argument about capital punishment. The real point is to protect yourself against such things and not just rail at the ineffectiveness of the local police. Believe me they would like the killing to stop for their own benefit, contrary to some of the nonsense here. The one issue that is actually able to threaten the Venezuelan regime is the high crime rate - the voters are fed up. It is no different in the islands - stopping crime is a vote-getter. Just easier said than done.

Greg
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Old 23-01-2014, 17:40   #239
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Re: St Lucia murder

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St Lucia and much of the Caribbean no longer cater to the small privately owned sailboat trade. They realize that there is more revenue in resorts. large mega-yacht marinas, and the bareboat charter trade. Cruise ships that pay a fee to visit are also favored.
St Lucia is an example and has created a huge disparity between the haves and the have-nots. Hence the higher crime rate..
I wouldn't exactly say "hence" but whatever you feel the reason for poor behavior is, I wouldn't go to St. Lucia by boat or to a resort. 2 years ago my wife and I went to Sandals all inclusive in St Lucia for our honeymoon and it was a total ripoff. Terrible attitude by the staff and the food was mediocre at best. They had our money already so why even try to please us? Contrast that with the all inclusive Iberostar at Cozumel where we went last year where the food was plentiful and amazing and all of the staff couldn't do enough for all of the guests. There are lots of nicer places than St.Lucia and many of them actually want you to come visit them and have a friendly attitude.
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Old 23-01-2014, 17:54   #240
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Re: St Lucia murder

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