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Old 09-02-2013, 04:33   #16
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pirate Re: Need some advice please?

Apart from the Sadler 32... take a look at some of the Westerly's...
Strong capable boats.. Gibsea's of that era were good as well..
I'm about halfway between Porto & Lisbon... boats on the hard at Figuerra da Foz..
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Old 09-02-2013, 06:21   #17
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Re: Need some advice please?

Haha That's cool. How are you getting data?


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Apart from the Sadler 32... take a look at some of the Westerly's...
Strong capable boats.. Gibsea's of that era were good as well..
I'm about halfway between Porto & Lisbon... boats on the hard at Figuerra da Foz..
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Old 09-02-2013, 06:47   #18
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pirate Re: Need some advice please?

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Haha That's cool. How are you getting data?
Nao entender... ????
What data...??
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Old 09-02-2013, 07:58   #19
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Re: Need some advice please?

Sorry I misread the post completely. Just ignore my last message.


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Nao entender... ????
What data...??
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Old 09-02-2013, 08:03   #20
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Re: Need some advice please?

I think you'll have a lot more fun if you buy a boat that's already in the Caribbean. We started out up north and had a rough trip half of the way down to where the sailing started getting good. It would have been nice to not begin our trip freezing and scared shitless.
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Old 09-02-2013, 08:12   #21
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Re: Need some advice please?

I do agree. The Biscay is the real concern but I'm not put off by the cold or bad weather. It's just easier to get all my gear aboard here and then sail away. I haven't even checked out prices to have my stuff flown out. I did see a few boats listed I was interested in BVI. Just the cost of flying out there and then back and what if the boat wasn't right and paying for a surveyor etc. I can get a boat here surveyed quite cheap and viewing isn't necessarily a problem.


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I think you'll have a lot more fun if you buy a boat that's already in the Caribbean. We started out up north and had a rough trip half of the way down to where the sailing started getting good. It would have been nice to not begin our trip freezing and scared shitless.
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:34   #22
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Re: Need some advice please?

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I did see a few boats listed I was interested in BVI. Just the cost of flying out there and then back and what if the boat wasn't right and paying for a surveyor etc. I can get a boat here surveyed quite cheap and viewing isn't necessarily a problem.
Always a trade off between buying locally vs long distance - personally I would stick with locally (by local I mean an easy delivery trip to home port)....especially given your present limited hands on knowledge of what you are looking at and that you will be looking in the boat category marked "older" (and there lie Demons as well as Mermaids!).........life is so much easier in getting a boat sorted / to your requirements when your tools are all nearby in a warm dry workshop / garage and the boat an easy commute away (and back!) to work on as and when you can without every trip being a major expedition........plus boat buying does include kissing a lot of frogs!

In regard to the Boat, Phil (Boatman61) makes a good point about the Westerlys (the Pentland and her Sisters sail a lot better than they look!), personally I would not be uber wedded to any boat make or model - the "best" boat being the one you could find in the best overall condition at the right price, in the right location at the time you want one.....those will all provide own challenges without getting too fussy on boat model!, and also (given your plans) you will have to keep at least one eye on resale, so I would try and stick with the mainstream builders as a known quantity who have a decent enough reputation (useful for self as well when it comes to common problems and fixes - all boats have them!....as will be plenty on Google, whether current or past owners and via an Owners Association or not).....that might be a Sadler 32, but it might not.
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Old 11-02-2013, 03:45   #23
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Re: Need some advice please?

I agree but my friend and I had a conversation and he completely put me off of all mass production boats. I have looked at Westerly's too. My initial budget was about 20-30,000 for the boat. But it may hold me back from leaving for quite sometime longer. As I think everyone knows planning these things is a long haul project. After reading the Liveaboard forum last night it has inspired me in a lot of ways to look for a smaller cheaper boat. Especially considering how many people lived on small boats for such long periods. I looked at a Sabre 27 quite sometime ago. It's small and cheap. I think I could pull it off in this boat and it'll leave a lot more money in the bank as a backup. The other was and ex charter boat in Greece a Dufour 323. Reading some of the threads on here is inspiring as so many different options and ideas become viable when you read of other people that have been there and done that. Finding the right boat is probably gonna be the real challenge for me. The Sabre 27 is listed on ebay at the moment. It's got a survey and no signs of osmosis. Thanks for all your input so far btw


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In regard to the Boat, Phil (Boatman61) makes a good point about the Westerlys (the Pentland and her Sisters sail a lot better than they look!), personally I would not be uber wedded to any boat make or model - the "best" boat being the one you could find in the best overall condition at the right price, in the right location at the time you want one.....those will all provide own challenges without getting too fussy on boat model!, and also (given your plans) you will have to keep at least one eye on resale, so I would try and stick with the mainstream builders as a known quantity who have a decent enough reputation (useful for self as well when it comes to common problems and fixes - all boats have them!....as will be plenty on Google, whether current or past owners and via an Owners Association or not).....that might be a Sadler 32, but it might not.
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Old 11-02-2013, 07:08   #24
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Re: Need some advice please?

Just a few cents worth... If you want to cross with four people, I think a 27 would be a little small. Definitely do some serious sailing with the crew or make sure you know them very well before setting out. I've had some less than ideal experiences along those lines.

I found that we had to put a lot of money and effort into getting our boat ready for a long trip even though it was "ready to go" when we bought her.

things to think about: Condition of sails, a second set of sails. Our genoa was way too big for the strong winds we encountered when we got into the trades. Sat phones look pretty nice but expensive to use. What about SSB? It took me a while to get used to and comfortable with my SSB but now I wouldn't trade it! Actually, I would, I'd like a better one. They have a pretty high initial price tag and installation (grounding) is a major pita but they work and you can get lots of good weather information. We have friends who used Herb's weather service crossing the Atlantic and it saved them a lot of time in the doldrums. Also, once you get to the Caribbean, Chris can be very helpful.

What about electrical generators? We ended up with three pretty good solar panels (not that cheap) and I'd even like a wind generator to supplement them. You'd be surprised how many electrons your nav equipment, lights, etc will eat. To say nothing of refrigeration.

I'm sure I'll think of more things later.

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Old 11-02-2013, 07:18   #25
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Re: Need some advice please?

Thanks Bill. Sorry I forgot to say. If I did buy a smaller boat it would only be myself and another crew member. I wouldn't even like to imagine what it would be like with four haha. That's why I've looked at robust autopilots as I've seen them fail before. Thanks for the advice about the SSB it was my next question. I've been trying to research a good cheap source of weather feeds to the boat and so far only found the Navtex. Which some people say is unreliable. It's hard to tell with anything that gets reviewed whether it's unbiased or not though. I'll look into the SSB now. Is that the module that you can connect to the pc and download grib files or am I way off the mark?

PS Yes I have been trying to find boats with spare sails as well just in case one fails but it does narrow your selection. They're not cheap. As for sat phone I've decided on the Iridium 9555 with 100 minutes which I think lasts a year once activated but will have to check its just a backup in case of emergency.

Thanks for your input


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Just a few cents worth... If you want to cross with four people, I think a 27 would be a little small. Definitely do some serious sailing with the crew or make sure you know them very well before setting out. I've had some less than ideal experiences along those lines.

I found that we had to put a lot of money and effort into getting our boat ready for a long trip even though it was "ready to go" when we bought her.

things to think about: Condition of sails, a second set of sails. Our genoa was way too big for the strong winds we encountered when we got into the trades. Sat phones look pretty nice but expensive to use. What about SSB? It took me a while to get used to and comfortable with my SSB but now I wouldn't trade it! Actually, I would, I'd like a better one. They have a pretty high initial price tag and installation (grounding) is a major pita but they work and you can get lots of good weather information. We have friends who used Herb's weather service crossing the Atlantic and it saved them a lot of time in the doldrums. Also, once you get to the Caribbean, Chris can be very helpful.

What about electrical generators? We ended up with three pretty good solar panels (not that cheap) and I'd even like a wind generator to supplement them. You'd be surprised how many electrons your nav equipment, lights, etc will eat. To say nothing of refrigeration.

I'm sure I'll think of more things later.

Bill
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Old 11-02-2013, 08:05   #26
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Re: Need some advice please?

I think 27 foot would make the trip somewhat of a different adventure than on 32 foot, which in itself would be a tad different from 40 foot (albeit not such a big leap as from 27 to 30 plus).


In addition to the boat simply being smaller for self / crew and storage (more space is better! Not an absolute requirement, but nonetheless better) - also a smaller boat will be harder work on passage simply because the smaller the boat the more input she will require from the helm / crew as more at the mercy of (in tune with?!) the sea and wind - even in good weather. As a broad comparison like having a motorbike vs having a car - motorbike lots of fun! and even long trips are enjoyable but often enough a car does make life more pleasant, not only in bad weather 200 miles from home but simply when doing dull stuff like eating lunch........

Am not saying not possible (nor not "safe" - loads of 27 footers gone far and wide) - but IMO the smaller the boat the more seaworthy in design it needs to be (and in good condition), larger can more often get away with simply being larger).......but upsides as well, especially on the less money spent.........Everything about boats is about compromises and trade offs and sometimes those made with less than perfect information.

IMO 20-30k as a buying budget is decent enough (even at UK prices) for some decent options without needing to go down to 27 foot - albeit also enough to buy a chunk of someone else's problems!, especially as will be fishing in the boat pool marked "Older".....a wade through the Project boat thread (in my sig below) might help reinforce that you do not want to buy a project boat (aka in Broker / Vendor speak as "some TLC required"!), especially not unintentionally!

Also, if not done so already, have a look at the Cruising Equipment list in my sig below - the collected wisdom of CF! Work out what you want onboard and that may help dictate the size of boat as well as help decide what you need to buy with the boat (do some totting up of the ballpark numbers!)......also remember that Solar Panels are big - and often a struggle to fit on decks of any size, at least in places that are out of the way!
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:44   #27
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Re: Need some advice please?

This is what I was thinking!!

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Am not saying not possible (nor not "safe" - loads of 27 footers gone far and wide) - but IMO the smaller the boat the more seaworthy in design it needs to be (and in good condition), larger can more often get away with simply being larger).......but upsides as well, especially on the less money spent.........Everything about boats is about compromises and trade offs and sometimes those made with less than perfect information.
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:56   #28
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Re: Need some advice please?

Re SSB:
I bought a used (but pretty good) SSB and tuner and it was a real chore installing and grounding. I hired a marine electrical specialist to help me and that helped. But if you are handy and know a lot about rf you could easily do it yourself. I know rf but was a bit strapped for time. Still, there are lots of potential pitfalls so read all you can in fora such as this one. In the end, mine works pretty well but I do not have the option of connecting it to a modem and PC. I haven't looked into that lately but it would be really nice to do that. That is the reason that I'd upgrade mine. It would probably cost in the $3000 range for hardware.

You can get weather reports from Herb Hilgenberg, Southbound. I've listened to some of his reports but haven't really used him because my sailing has been Florida and Caribbean. But my friends who sailed from England swear by his services. Someone else can probably give you more info but I think it is free. My friends sent him some remuneration. Here's a quick link: South Bound II VAX498 - Ship routing and weather forecasting I've used Chris Parker's services. (Marine Weather Center - Bahamas & Caribbean Marine Weather Services) His SSB service is $195 and to get both SSB and email is $295 per year. But, it's well worth it to me when I'm traveling. You get personalized reports and it's really comforting to talk to someone every morning for a few minutes. I'd spend 45 minutes to an hour every day listening and getting reports. Chris also wrote a good book on weather that you can buy from him or you might find a used one. Also worth having.

That reminds me. You'll want to start accumulating books and guides as well. Here are a few suggestions: Nigel Calder's books. Almost all of them are useful. Just before you leave, an Almanac. Most of them only have data for one year so get it at the last minute but it can be very useful for tides, etc. Once you have purchased a boat...manuals for every piece of equipment that you can think of aboard. I have lots of hard copies but I have a boatload of manuals in pdf form stored on my computer. Things like a full Yanmar shop manual.

I'm sure I'll come up with more later.
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Old 11-02-2013, 10:11   #29
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Re: Need some advice please?

Books I have already

Complete Yachtmaster- Tom Cunliffe
Sailing alone around the world - Joshua Slocum
Your first Atlantic crossing - Les weatheritt (This was from before I did my first crossing haha so not very relevant)
Stormproof your boat - William M Burr
Buying your first cruiser - Malcolm Mckegg
The cruisers handbook of fishing - Scott Bannerot

On Order - Modern Marine weather by David Burch

Any other ideas on reading material just let me know. I'm just reading up the info that everyone's given me so far. Much appreciated guys
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Old 11-02-2013, 10:30   #30
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Re: Need some advice please?

Is this the type of SSB you mean?

Intek HR-5500 28Mhz 10m AM FM SSB CW Amateur Radio + USB Programming Cable & | eBay
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