Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 18-02-2015, 21:35   #46
Registered User
 
Group9's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,599
Images: 7
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Every country has good parts and bad, I imagine. The trick is knowing where each is. I live in a really quiet little town 70 miles from New Orleans, that almost doesn't even have crime. But, you can head into New Orleans, and get robbed and/or get shot just about any time you feel like it by going to the wrong neighborhood.
__________________

__________________
Cruising again!
Group9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 14:30   #47
Senior Cruiser
 
Therapy's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: W Florida
Boat: The Jon boat still, plus a 2007 SeaCat.
Posts: 6,894
Images: 4
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Going Walkabout View Post
OK Therapy. I've just read a log of the posts. My thoughts on the subject now are....... No guns. Issues with customs. So no guns. I did however read this. Very interesting.

"A 25mm flare gun has a much higher muzzle velocity and 4 times the energy of a 12 gauge.*

A jar of gasoline followed by a flare I would imagine would have some effect on a vessel attempting to come alongside. At least they would be distracted for a while.

Then there is the usual assortment of spear*guns*or Bahama slings for close in work if you do not want to torch your own vessel.

If you are travelling through an area filled with pirates it may be an idea to pick up a one of those high pressure* water* sprayers, 3000 PSI sounds about right. You probably could reach out to 200-300 feet or so with the right nozzle with a stream of gasoline.

It would be unfortunate if someone was smoking or fired a gun on the approaching vessel."

Now I'm not saying I'm even thinking of using any these options but there are options.
<iframe width="640" height="390" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/bPTjTChQRfc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

And throwing gasoline about is just silly. Do you believe in practicing things before hand? Try some of that gasoline stuff in a rocking/sailing/heeling (or what ever) boat.

One guy said he was going to have armor. The real steel stuff.

edit: I don't know how to put the youtube in here. I tried upload on two things I copied from the video. URL something or other. Shizzzlefugs.


And there are more. Flare guns are useless.

If I had a gun in a boat nest to yours and you threw a glass of gas I would shoot you before you could do anything else.

See, bad guys don't stand and wait for you to do the next thing. It ain't checkers.
__________________

__________________
Who knows what is next.
Therapy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 14:53   #48
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 20,226
Images: 2
pirate Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingWalkabout View Post
On the two occasions I have had guns pointed at me. Once by Muslims in the Mid East and Once in Buenos Aires, Argentina by car jackers .
Did the fact they were Muslim make them extra dangerous..
__________________


Born To Be Wild
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 15:21   #49
Registered User
 
Steady Hand's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Crewing All of 2017 Available Globally
Boat: OPB = Crewing in 2017
Posts: 4,851
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Therapy View Post
<iframe width="640" height="390" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/bPTjTChQRfc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

And throwing gasoline about is just silly. Do you believe in practicing things before hand? Try some of that gasoline stuff in a rocking/sailing/heeling (or what ever) boat.

One guy said he was going to have armor. The real steel stuff.

And there are more. Flare guns are useless.
I agree with most of your points above.

But I question why you think a flare gun is "useless."

Given some circumstances, I think it would be more useful than nothing (e.g. in a confrontation with someone armed with something less than a gun).

And it certainly has a real "use" (its intended purpose, as a signaling device).
__________________
Ahoy All Sailors! Need experienced crew for a passage or delivery in Atlantic, Pacific, Caribbean, Med, PNW, ICW, coastal or across an ocean anytime in 2017? I am available on 24hr notice. See my CF Profile "About Me" page for details. Happy to lend a hand!
Steady Hand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 16:03   #50
Marine Service Provider

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Marmaris
Boat: FP Orana 2010, Lipari 2011, Hélia 2013, Catana C 47 2013
Posts: 1,033
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
Did the fact they were Muslim make them extra dangerous..
__________________
yeloya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 16:10   #51
Don't ask if you can't handle it
 
sailorboy1's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: On the boat somewhere
Boat: Hunter 410
Posts: 12,336
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

cruisers are scary, if thieves were to start reading internet forums I bet they would never mess with them
__________________
jobless, houseless, clueless, living on a boat and cruising around somewhere
sailorboy1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 16:14   #52
Registered User
 
GoingWalkabout's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: USA & Argentina
Boat: In the market for a Lagoon 56 (seems like the perfect fit)
Posts: 1,477
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
Did the fact they were Muslim make them extra dangerous..
If one was Jewish and they being the Jew killing type of Muslim... I would say so. But as our President says they are a peace loving people.
__________________
GoingWalkabout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 16:30   #53
Registered User
 
Wannabe-007's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Somewhere in the South Pacific
Boat: Leopard 40 Catamaran
Posts: 243
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

I'm curious that you managed to have a discussion about religious beliefs with them...
I suppose if they stopped, mid-ordeal, to answer the call to prayer, that could be a strong indicator.
__________________
----
Attitude is EVERYTHING!
Wannabe-007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 16:37   #54
Registered User
 
GoingWalkabout's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: USA & Argentina
Boat: In the market for a Lagoon 56 (seems like the perfect fit)
Posts: 1,477
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
I agree with most of your points above.

But I question why you think a flare gun is "useless."

Given some circumstances, I think it would be more useful than nothing (e.g. in a confrontation with someone armed with something less than a gun).

And it certainly has a real "use" (its intended purpose, as a signaling device).
I agree. A flare gun is better than nothing. But If the bad guy has a real gun and it was being pointed at me I would have no option but to smile and hope. Then its a game of having your wits about you and praying you will be one of the lucky ones. Even if you don't see a gun you must assume he has one tucked in his pants behind and within 2seconds able to be reached for and pointed at you.

Of course the first step is to be cautious and not anchor in a dangerous place. Haven read up on the gun laws in many countries and taking into account my unwillingness to kill someone just because he was drunk and stumbled onto my boat at night I am left with few options.

One defensive option I may consider is one that was suggested from a poster a few years ago that I read from one of the great links posted by Therapy. Namely rigging an electric "fence" on your boat along with a very loud alarm with a siren and auto spot lights. At least you stand a good chance of scaring off the intruder and have them move on to an easier boat to intrude. And without the need of a face to face meeting.

So I won't be packing. No point if you can only use it on the high seas. Then base ball bats and spear guns after the electric fence breach are worth considering. Meeting an aggressor with non aggression in the first few seconds maybe no choice but after quickly assessing if he has a gun or not, a Louisville Slugger may do the trick. Definitely to be kept close to the inside of the Salon door.

All in all the choices are not good.
__________________
GoingWalkabout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 16:42   #55
Registered User
 
GoingWalkabout's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: USA & Argentina
Boat: In the market for a Lagoon 56 (seems like the perfect fit)
Posts: 1,477
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wannabe-007 View Post
I'm curious that you managed to have a discussion about religious beliefs with them...
I suppose if they stopped, mid-ordeal, to answer the call to prayer, that could be a strong indicator.
No discussion needed if you have a Jewish name and they were distinctively Arab. I wouldn't assume that either were Quakers nor would I or they have to ask.
__________________
GoingWalkabout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2015, 17:04   #56
Senior Cruiser
 
Therapy's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: W Florida
Boat: The Jon boat still, plus a 2007 SeaCat.
Posts: 6,894
Images: 4
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
I agree with most of your points above.

But I question why you think a flare gun is "useless."

Given some circumstances, I think it would be more useful than nothing (e.g. in a confrontation with someone armed with something less than a gun).

And it certainly has a real "use" (its intended purpose, as a signaling device).
Context in communication.

a defense weapon similar to a pistol = useless.
__________________
Who knows what is next.
Therapy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-02-2015, 06:29   #57
Registered User
 
Group9's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,599
Images: 7
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

""A 25mm flare gun has a much higher muzzle velocity and 4 times the energy of a 12 gauge."

Here you go. Everything you ever wanted to know about the ballistics and lethality of a flare gun.

http://www.noedelscientific.com/user/Flaregun1.pdf
__________________
Cruising again!
Group9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-02-2015, 07:01   #58
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Land locked Leics UK
Posts: 249
Images: 1
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
Sad story. Evidently the use of an alarm was not enough to cause the perps to flee.
Maybe this would have helped? https://www.youtube.com/user/fogband...e=results_main

I quite like the idea that at least for the next ten mins they'll struggle to see anything to take.... buys some time to make even more noise too perhaps?

Sad story
__________________
Heath68 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-02-2015, 07:11   #59
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Land locked Leics UK
Posts: 249
Images: 1
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

That's a funny but quite useful idea :-)
__________________
Heath68 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-02-2015, 08:06   #60
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Land locked Leics UK
Posts: 249
Images: 1
Re: Dutch sailor shot dead in Brazil-(Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Going Walkabout View Post
OK Therapy. I've just read a log of the posts. My thoughts on the subject now are....... No guns. Issues with customs. So no guns. I did however read this. Very interesting.

"A 25mm flare gun has a much higher muzzle velocity and 4 times the energy of a 12 gauge.*

A jar of gasoline followed by a flare I would imagine would have some effect on a vessel attempting to come alongside. At least they would be distracted for a while.

Then there is the usual assortment of spear*guns*or Bahama slings for close in work if you do not want to torch your own vessel.

If you are travelling through an area filled with pirates it may be an idea to pick up a one of those high pressure* water* sprayers, 3000 PSI sounds about right. You probably could reach out to 200-300 feet or so with the right nozzle with a stream of gasoline.

It would be unfortunate if someone was smoking or fired a gun on the approaching vessel."

Now I'm not saying I'm even thinking of using any these options but there are options.
If you're really interested in "something".. my son is into Crossbows... he says (you'll maybe have to verify this) that whilst many countries have laws about guns, hardly any have any laws about crossbows.. yet they can be equally deadly and just as accurate... I'm still not sure myself either.
__________________

__________________
Heath68 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
Brazil, sail

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Dutch Sailor Missing in the Atlantic ilCigno Our Community 80 09-04-2014 17:59
Bequia: Sailor shot and wounded neilpride General Sailing Forum 0 30-07-2012 08:11
Dutch Teenage Sailor Laura Dekker 'Missing' clausont Cruising News & Events 56 31-03-2010 21:00



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 16:00.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.