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Old 29-07-2016, 07:22   #76
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Re: carribean vs the other side

It's ironic the OP understands so little of economics in various cultures that he equates working for a living with slavery. The alternative for most of these so called "slaves" making good money is the alternative before tourism was long days I the sugar cane fields for far less money.


At the same time he abuses the economic system of the south pacific which is historically based on gift giving. In much of the south pacific historically, instead of working for money, you gained power and prestige from gift giving and this carried over into normal day to day interaction, there was an unspoken assumption that gift giving was a two way street. Someone would never demand a gift in return and would be horrified to say no to a request. Sounds like the OP is playing the dumb white guy taking gift after gift without reciprocating in kind. He's probably put many of the friendly locals in a financial bind abusing their kindness. At the same time he denigrates those who may misunderstand the gift giving culture but understand they can't continuously take without giving back so they offer to pay, which may not be consistent with the culture but at least doesn't leave the local impoverished by the visit.
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Old 29-07-2016, 07:42   #77
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Re: carribean vs the other side

Gee guys...keep digging deeper...you'll find he is a Nazi Capitalist seeking to destroy nation by nation under the cloak of keep it simple sailing. He's a genius I say!
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Old 29-07-2016, 09:07   #78
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Re: carribean vs the other side

I wonder what Rimas would say?
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Old 29-07-2016, 10:28   #79
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Re: carribean vs the other side

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I wonder what Rimas would say?
I have no idea but the mod team say: keep it nice...

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Old 29-07-2016, 12:14   #80
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Re: carribean vs the other side

Maybe a little OT but I have been considering heading West through the Panama Canal. One worry I have is the cost of the transit. I have seen claims that for a 36 foot boat like my Seawind it would run between $US5,000 and $US3,000. Not saying that is unreasonable, just that it is equal to probably 6 month (a full season) of cruising in the Bahamas for me.

Can some of you guys who have transited the Panama Canal share their costs.
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Old 29-07-2016, 12:38   #81
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Re: carribean vs the other side

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Maybe a little OT but I have been considering heading West through the Panama Canal. One worry I have is the cost of the transit. I have seen claims that for a 36 foot boat like my Seawind it would run between $US5,000 and $US3,000. Not saying that is unreasonable, just that it is equal to probably 6 month (a full season) of cruising in the Bahamas for me.

Can some of you guys who have transited the Panama Canal share their costs.
Yes OT. Your numbers are high . The Canal is deal. Try the search on CF for details.
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Old 29-07-2016, 21:13   #82
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Re: carribean vs the other side

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It's ironic the OP understands so little of economics in various cultures that he equates working for a living with slavery. The alternative for most of these so called "slaves" making good money is the alternative before tourism was long days I the sugar cane fields for far less money.


At the same time he abuses the economic system of the south pacific which is historically based on gift giving. In much of the south pacific historically, instead of working for money, you gained power and prestige from gift giving and this carried over into normal day to day interaction, there was an unspoken assumption that gift giving was a two way street. Someone would never demand a gift in return and would be horrified to say no to a request. Sounds like the OP is playing the dumb white guy taking gift after gift without reciprocating in kind. He's probably put many of the friendly locals in a financial bind abusing their kindness. At the same time he denigrates those who may misunderstand the gift giving culture but understand they can't continuously take without giving back so they offer to pay, which may not be consistent with the culture but at least doesn't leave the local impoverished by the visit.
I believe he said he traded

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Old 30-07-2016, 00:02   #83
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Re: carribean vs the other side

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I believe he said he traded

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Not buying it. He's on a 20some foot boat that is by his own accounts stripped down and minimalist...yet he's trading?
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Old 30-07-2016, 03:25   #84
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Re: carribean vs the other side

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Not buying it. He's on a 20some foot boat that is by his own accounts stripped down and minimalist...yet he's trading?
Well he did write: "I gave some locals in vanuatu my bicycle, a solar panel and battery, teach their kids how to use a soldering iron and how to wire it to play music etc... They take me to their garden and dig up 2 months of food so I sail to philippines."

So I guess you've got a point, they gave him food and all he gave them in return was his trash....

I'm glad to see CF has replaced the "Go small and go now" ethos with "Go big or go home"

Now thats what I call progress...
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Old 30-07-2016, 08:58   #85
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Re: carribean vs the other side

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SNIP

I'm glad to see CF has replaced the "Go small and go now" ethos with "Go big or go home"

Now thats what I call progress...
There is a difference between "Go small and go now" and go expecting to live off the land/sea with inadequate prep. There have been endless threads at CF about folks who thought they could make a living while cruising by working. The truth is it does take serious prep to cruise and part of that includes adequate resources to buy food, maintain your boat, and deal with customs (including fees) to enter foreign countries.

The sad truth is in years past there were far fewer cruisers who put far less burden on countries and populations they cruised to. Now there is a much burden on those countries cruisers visit. Not to mention the change in expectations. How many threads have we seen about places being ruined because cruisers started paying much higher than expected rates to locals.

Time to stop living in the past and except the reality that there are a lot more cruisers than there use to be and that has changed cruising.
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Old 30-07-2016, 09:01   #86
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Re: carribean vs the other side

At the lower end of that scale are the parasitic cruisers who get by taking advantage of locals, tourists, and other cruisers. Fortunately they are relatively few, but Ive had the distasteful experience of encountering them.
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Old 30-07-2016, 09:44   #87
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Re: carribean vs the other side

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Originally Posted by tomfl View Post
There is a difference between "Go small and go now" and go expecting to live off the land/sea with inadequate prep. There have been endless threads at CF about folks who thought they could make a living while cruising by working. The truth is it does take serious prep to cruise and part of that includes adequate resources to buy food, maintain your boat, and deal with customs (including fees) to enter foreign countries.

The sad truth is in years past there were far fewer cruisers who put far less burden on countries and populations they cruised to. Now there is a much burden on those countries cruisers visit. Not to mention the change in expectations. How many threads have we seen about places being ruined because cruisers started paying much higher than expected rates to locals.

Time to stop living in the past and except the reality that there are a lot more cruisers than there use to be and that has changed cruising.

Computer guys are one segment of the working class that can be productive even without an Internet connection. While I do not use OpenCPN, it seems quite a few people do. I hope none of those are part of the group that feel the need to bash BA for quirky posts. I know nothing of the development team except that BA seems a productive member.

And while it is possible that he has been sitting on a couch in Kansas, his posts indicate that he has put quite a few miles under the keel of a little Bristol alone. That would require a bit of adequate prep and cojones. Not to mention giving him an excuse for being a bit quirky.
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Old 30-07-2016, 11:20   #88
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Re: carribean vs the other side

Naah mate.. I support another cruiser and full time liveaboard.. Mike aka Quinn and his Nimble Navigator program.. taken me 2/3rds of the way round the world with no probs..
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Old 30-07-2016, 11:21   #89
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Re: carribean vs the other side

Well, rhum cigars and music are better in the Carib. More expensive sure, not a good place for freeloaders...
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Old 30-07-2016, 12:39   #90
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Re: carribean vs the other side

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At the lower end of that scale are the parasitic cruisers who get by taking advantage of locals, tourists, and other cruisers. Fortunately they are relatively few, but Ive had the distasteful experience of encountering them.
I didn't know there was a hierarchy in the cruising world. So if you go small, trade food for bicycles or what ever else the OP uses, he is a parasite. And because he is not going around flaunting money to the locals, he is taking advantage of them. I'll try to avoid you as to not upset you as I have been know to trade C and D batteries to a fisherman for his flashlight for a fish or two.
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