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Old 06-06-2010, 08:27   #31
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Having had a front row seat to the disaster in '89 with the Exxon Valdez, I have seen first hand the impact on the environment and the people that live in an area that has been oiled. It is devastating, when I first heard what had happened in '89, I didn't know whether to cry or throw up or both, but I went down to help with an impossible mess to try to make a difference. At the end of it all Exxon spent billions and recovered less than 10 % of what was spilled and the rest went on the beach or submerged. 5 years after the spill I was involved with the beach surveys to determine the impact of what got left, and one only had to dig down a couple of feet and there was plenty of oil left, we took over (100), thousand pound bags of oiled sand off of just one small part of one beach and had hardly scratched the surface of what was left, and the oil had spread to almost every where on the coast of Alaska. What they didn't do was burn the Exxon Valdez to the water line and leave it on Bligh reef as a warning to other tankers about what would happen if they got careless or complacent. Some of the things they did do was try many different methods of clean up, none of them worked very well, the one that showed the most promise was the bio-remediation, which involved microbes that would consume the oil, I think this method might work better in a warm water environment than it worked in Alaska. Many people joined in a class action suit, to make Exxon pay for what had happened and the end result was Exxon lost the suit, they delayed through various legal tactics until 20 years had passed, by that time 30% of the claimants had died, and when the time came for Exxon to pay up, a judge set aside 80% of the judgment, so for all intents and purposes Exxon got a walk.
There is no easy way to clean this mess up, and things will never be the same again, as long as we bring crude oil out of the ground there is a certainty that some of it will end up in the water. I don't like it, but that doesn't change the reality.
My heart goes out to all who live on the Gulf of Mexico.
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Old 06-06-2010, 08:44   #32
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Finger Pointing

PErsonally I think finger pointing is an important part of this cleanup, but only if it is folowed by serious consequences. Yes, we all need to take responsibility for our consumption but getting to the place where we all do that is unlikely to occur. We require our governments to act as enforcement agencies for the simple reason that corporations place shareholders above citizenry.

We all consume water but if a resevoir dam breaks and takes life someone will be held responsible. We all want to be making a living but that doesn't supercede the responsibility for the way in which we make our living by any logic other then Conservative (big C) politics.

Where possible cut your consumption of fuels oils, buy natural fibre clothing, choose local manufacturing, glass over plastic ...

It's still not going to do it because you're one person. Proseletize your friends and family? It will help, maybe attitudes will begin to turn. In the end and in my opinion, unless there is a move away from a belief system that market forces possess some magic means to right all wrongs and move to one that prizes an educated world population and rewards the kind of thinking that considers the health of the whole world in decision making we are going to continue to have large disasters to deal with.
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Old 07-06-2010, 19:43   #33
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If this has already been covered, Sorry. Only makes sense to me that if you send a contolled explosive charge via a mechanical snake of some
kind as far down that bore as possible to the reservoir...kaboom and collapse the casing and the bore. Presto! No more oil leak. But then,... that might ruin the well. Could'nt have that, now could we?
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Old 07-06-2010, 19:47   #34
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Gordmay is one of the sharpest dudes on here.. What do ya think Gord will it work??
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Old 07-06-2010, 19:48   #35
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Proseletize your friends and family? It will help, maybe attitudes will begin to turn.
Yeah, then they will really start to hate you.
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Old 07-06-2010, 20:54   #36
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Sailing over boom?

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The oil has arrived on the beaches here. There are plans to put oil booms out across many of the local harbors and bayous that will restrict boat traffic. If you are planning to be in the area, be sure to check to make sure you will be able to get in and out.

Thanks British Petroleum #%@#&!!

I was sailing this weekend and found no traces of oil. If the harbor gets boomed off, my boat has a centerboard, kick up rudder, and if I remove the prop...the boat should be able to sail over booms. I intend to sail out of Panama City in the fall, but now I am considering an earlier departure

I noticed booms near Shell Is. but I don't think they can completely boom (close) St. Andrews Pass due to the current.
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Old 07-06-2010, 20:57   #37
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The Wall Street Journal has a very detailed on-going investigative report on the matter and there is absolutely no doubt about this. Common sense and common safety were sacrificed for expedience under pressure to "stop wasting money". The Well was beyond schedule and vastly over budget so corners were cut. What is most frustrating is that those in charge of the operation had relatively little experience and ignored warnings by more experienced men who had less authority. There is simply no excuse for this disaster.

FWIW...
A mouth full to be sure...

The day I walked off the rig floor as a driller for the last time... I took my gloves off and slapped them hard against the chest of our Company hand..( Up from Louisiana ironically ) and told him in no nonsense oil field terms... that if he wanted it done his way he could do it himself.

Later that day right before I was catching my flight off the slope he tracked me down and asked if I had cooled off and if I would stay or if I was comming back...I looked him in the eye and asked him if he would be here if I did...when he told me "well yes of course"..I said then you know my answer.

Young bucks with collage degrees but little common sense or hands on experience, wanting to prove something.. This was for ARCO...same problem everywhere.
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Old 07-06-2010, 20:57   #38
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At noon today spotters reported a large oil slick 9 miles off shore due south of the state line.
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Old 07-06-2010, 21:55   #39
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The BP Story

BP began in ignomy and appear to be ending in it. There's been a few books written on this story but to summarize, no doubt inaccurately (sorry), colonial Britian had bribed a few influencial Iranian leaders to sign the rights to their oil to Britian. They built a refinery and Anlgo Persian and later Anglo Iranian oil was operating what was at the time the largest refinery in the world. All staffed by British expertise.

After WW2 democracy took hold in Iran and a fellow named Mossadegh took power and began the process of nationalizing the oil. At the time Anglo Iranian was taking 86% of the profit and giving 14 to the people of Iran. A 50-50 split was siggested but refused out of hand by the British. When nationalization took place the British pulled all their experts out, blockaded the harbours, and embargoed essential goods. It didn't work.

The next step was to begin funneling cash and fomenting dissent, however, Iran responded by kicking all British diplomats out of the country which removed the means of funneling cash to those who would attempt the coup. They next approached FDR and asked him to use the CIA to create a coup. This was in 1951. FDR refused, at that point the CIA hadn't done anything like that. In 1953 Eisenhower was president and things were different. He agreed to send in the CIA, the coup suceeded and the Shah began his long regime. This of course led to the current environment of radical Islam in Iran but in the meantime British Petroleum was formed and the good times were rolling.

Ultimately this also led to the invasion of Afghanistan by the Russians.

You know, the oil in the gulf is a mess but it might be even a stickier mess in the halls of power.
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Old 07-06-2010, 22:07   #40
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Your timeline is slightly off. FDR died in 1945.
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Old 07-06-2010, 22:18   #41
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... Only makes sense to me that if you send a contolled explosive charge via a mechanical snake of some
kind as far down that bore as possible to the reservoir...kaboom and collapse the casing and the bore.
If it were possible to actually send anything down the well string at this point, then getting the flow shut off would be a much simpler action, and would be done already. The concept of the relief wells is to get near enough to the well bore, above the production zone, and do just what you suggest.

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Old 07-06-2010, 23:45   #42
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Your timeline is slightly off. FDR died in 1945.
How about Truman? Well, I got Eisenhower right anyway. Thanks.
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