Route Timing

Bill Balme · 21-09-2005, 09:53

Late Spring 2007 is kick-off time. Destination: Europe.

Plans being what plans are -flexible and changeable- but a plan is required none-the-less. I'd appreciate any comments about the following - especially with regards passage times from anyone who has travelled the same routes.

I've tried to follow Jimmy Cornell's routes and timing - but have had to squeeze in places...

These are the major passages:

Date - - Depart - - Date - - - Arrive - - Passage

5/20/07 Newport, RI 5/23/07 Halifax, NS 4 Days
5/24/07 Halifax, NS 5/29/07 St. John, NFLD 6 Days
6/2/07 St. John 6/16/07 Reykjavik 15 Days
7/7/07 Reykjavik 7/11/07 Scotland 5 Days

8/25/07 Cork, IRE 9/3/07 Algarve, Portugal 10 Days

5/24/08 Gibraltar 6/7/08 Azores 15 Days
6/20/08 Azores 7/4/08 Newport 15 Days

We'll be sailing a Pacific Seacraft 37...

Appreciate your comments,

swagman · 22-09-2005, 01:02

IMHO I'd allow 5 days for Biscay just in case it turns bad, and a further 5 to Lagos would be a bit of a slog down the coast of Portugal - but not an issue. (Apart from the lovely places you will miss by rushing past).
Cheers
JOHN

Talbot · 22-09-2005, 01:14

Best tool I know for doing this is Visual Passage Planner Not only can you do what ifs, but it also has an optimise tool for prevailing wind and current. Once you have input your own boat's performance it will do all the work for you.

Bill Balme · 29-09-2005, 06:15

My wife and I ar taking advantage of circumstances and moving up our trip to Eruope by a year. There's lots to do - little time to do it, but we're in good shape to be properly ready.

As a consequence of the changed departure date, I'm looking to change my itinerary a little - leaving just a couple or 3 weeks later - allowing more time for final assessment of the boat before leaving. This leaves me with a crunch point - getting to the Med before Christmas - but as late as possible in the year so I don't have to rush the previous itinerary.

Big question: How late can I leave southern Ireland for a reasonable passage to Gibraltar - I am intending to sail well to the west of the Bay of Biscay.

Would appreciate any comments...

Bill Balme · 02-10-2005, 17:17

My wife is hooked on the idea - to sail (ok motor) right through the center of France - including Paris - and I like the timing possibilities - go through locks rather than nasty seas as winter approaches.

So, who's travelled the French canal system in a boat with a 5ft draft? How many times am I likely to get myself stuck in the mud? The canals supposedly have a 1.8 mter (5'9") depth to them - do we know if they realy do?

Supposing they dont - and I get stuck - what then? Presumably there'll be canal traffic to help push me out/off - but will I face the prospect of having to turn around??

What's the deepest draft to have navigated these waterways?

swagman · 03-10-2005, 03:32

I retrieved this from the YBW site from a sailor who did this trip this year. Sorry his direct email address was not present to also pass onward:-

"We travelled through the french canals last year to the med and for 2 weeks travelled with a sailing yacht with 1.8 m keel.they had a sign up saying 1.8m keel on the front of the boat.
often they found it difficult to moor close to the bank because of the shallow depth so the moored along side us .on 2-3 occasions they stopped dead in the middle of the channell and we gave them a tow off the mud and they said they could feel the boat dragging a bit on the odd occasion.
Once we hit the Rhone they had no problem I would say the most tricky bit was through the canal du loing,the canal du braire,the canal du centre
If you do get stuck there will be another boat along soon enough to get a tow from
We went through in August and hardly saw any commercial traffic on the canals mostly on the big rivers which are pretty wide and deep."

Another visitor to the YBW site suggested routing east from Paris to the Canal D'est - saying that was used by small freighters drawing 2 M draft - and accordingly mininimising the chance of hitting the bottom.

Hope all this helps and if it were me and wife and Biscay in December - think you're looking to make the right decision.....

Cheers
JOHN

Ram · 03-10-2005, 05:12

how wide of beam can go through the cannels, would my cat go through 21'beam
Ram

Talbot · 03-10-2005, 05:33

You would need to check the dimensions of all the locks as I think 21 ft is too wide. Prout built the Snowgoose elite as wide as possible while still allowing it to pass through the main canals, and it is narrower than 21 ft. The smaller canals are narrower still, and even a catalac has some difficulty in negotiating them.

21-09-2005, 09:53	#1
Bill Balme Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Rehoboth, MA Boat: Pacific Seacraft 37 Posts: 35	Route Timing Late Spring 2007 is kick-off time. Destination: Europe. Plans being what plans are -flexible and changeable- but a plan is required none-the-less. I'd appreciate any comments about the following - especially with regards passage times from anyone who has travelled the same routes. I've tried to follow Jimmy Cornell's routes and timing - but have had to squeeze in places... These are the major passages: Date - - Depart - - Date - - - Arrive - - Passage 5/20/07 Newport, RI 5/23/07 Halifax, NS 4 Days 5/24/07 Halifax, NS 5/29/07 St. John, NFLD 6 Days 6/2/07 St. John 6/16/07 Reykjavik 15 Days 7/7/07 Reykjavik 7/11/07 Scotland 5 Days 8/25/07 Cork, IRE 9/3/07 Algarve, Portugal 10 Days 5/24/08 Gibraltar 6/7/08 Azores 15 Days 6/20/08 Azores 7/4/08 Newport 15 Days We'll be sailing a Pacific Seacraft 37... Appreciate your comments, __________________ Bill Balme s/v Toodle-oo!

22-09-2005, 01:02	#2
swagman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: On the yacht half the year - in the New Forest UK the other half. Boat: Hanse 461 Swagman Posts: 1,051 Images: 5	Ireland to Algave in 10 Days? IMHO I'd allow 5 days for Biscay just in case it turns bad, and a further 5 to Lagos would be a bit of a slog down the coast of Portugal - but not an issue. (Apart from the lovely places you will miss by rushing past). Cheers JOHN

22-09-2005, 01:14	#3
Talbot Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Stavanger, Norway Boat: Last boat was a Catalac 9m Hi-Jude Posts: 1,915 Images: 23	Best tool I know for doing this is Visual Passage Planner Not only can you do what ifs, but it also has an optimise tool for prevailing wind and current. Once you have input your own boat's performance it will do all the work for you. __________________ "Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss." Robert A Heinlein

29-09-2005, 06:15	#4
Bill Balme Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Rehoboth, MA Boat: Pacific Seacraft 37 Posts: 35	Ireland to Mediteranean My wife and I ar taking advantage of circumstances and moving up our trip to Eruope by a year. There's lots to do - little time to do it, but we're in good shape to be properly ready. As a consequence of the changed departure date, I'm looking to change my itinerary a little - leaving just a couple or 3 weeks later - allowing more time for final assessment of the boat before leaving. This leaves me with a crunch point - getting to the Med before Christmas - but as late as possible in the year so I don't have to rush the previous itinerary. Big question: How late can I leave southern Ireland for a reasonable passage to Gibraltar - I am intending to sail well to the west of the Bay of Biscay. Would appreciate any comments... __________________ Bill Balme s/v Toodle-oo!

02-10-2005, 17:17	#5
Bill Balme Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Rehoboth, MA Boat: Pacific Seacraft 37 Posts: 35	Ireland to Mediterranean via French Canals My wife is hooked on the idea - to sail (ok motor) right through the center of France - including Paris - and I like the timing possibilities - go through locks rather than nasty seas as winter approaches. So, who's travelled the French canal system in a boat with a 5ft draft? How many times am I likely to get myself stuck in the mud? The canals supposedly have a 1.8 mter (5'9") depth to them - do we know if they realy do? Supposing they dont - and I get stuck - what then? Presumably there'll be canal traffic to help push me out/off - but will I face the prospect of having to turn around?? What's the deepest draft to have navigated these waterways? __________________ Bill Balme s/v Toodle-oo!

03-10-2005, 03:32	#6
swagman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: On the yacht half the year - in the New Forest UK the other half. Boat: Hanse 461 Swagman Posts: 1,051 Images: 5	Hi Bill - Here's one view..... I retrieved this from the YBW site from a sailor who did this trip this year. Sorry his direct email address was not present to also pass onward:- "We travelled through the french canals last year to the med and for 2 weeks travelled with a sailing yacht with 1.8 m keel.they had a sign up saying 1.8m keel on the front of the boat. often they found it difficult to moor close to the bank because of the shallow depth so the moored along side us .on 2-3 occasions they stopped dead in the middle of the channell and we gave them a tow off the mud and they said they could feel the boat dragging a bit on the odd occasion. Once we hit the Rhone they had no problem I would say the most tricky bit was through the canal du loing,the canal du braire,the canal du centre If you do get stuck there will be another boat along soon enough to get a tow from We went through in August and hardly saw any commercial traffic on the canals mostly on the big rivers which are pretty wide and deep." Another visitor to the YBW site suggested routing east from Paris to the Canal D'est - saying that was used by small freighters drawing 2 M draft - and accordingly mininimising the chance of hitting the bottom. Hope all this helps and if it were me and wife and Biscay in December - think you're looking to make the right decision..... Cheers JOHN

03-10-2005, 05:12	#7
Ram Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Cruising Greece Posts: 294 Images: 21	how wide of beam can go through the cannels, would my cat go through 21'beam Ram __________________ Ram http://www.sailing-charters.org

03-10-2005, 05:33	#8
Talbot Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Stavanger, Norway Boat: Last boat was a Catalac 9m Hi-Jude Posts: 1,915 Images: 23	You would need to check the dimensions of all the locks as I think 21 ft is too wide. Prout built the Snowgoose elite as wide as possible while still allowing it to pass through the main canals, and it is narrower than 21 ft. The smaller canals are narrower still, and even a catalac has some difficulty in negotiating them. __________________ "Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss." Robert A Heinlein

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