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Old 19-06-2013, 02:48   #91
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

Montenegro is outside the EU, Croatia will have joined by the time we arrive (but not part of schengen till 2015. The VAT 18 month transit period is reset when the yacht is taken out of the EU zone, which includes being offshore, but that is difficult to prove, so an entry to Montenegro would be a safer bet. Yes I've had marinas ask for Originals, I never give them, just a copy. It's their way of trying to make sure you don't do a runner. I've never had anyone refuse entry without originals yet. (you can claim your bank holds them if you like)
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Old 19-06-2013, 03:01   #92
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

I believe it only stops the clock for that duration it doesn't give you a brand new 18monther???

I reckon Cruise share could be ok.

All of Croatia want originals or court witnessed stamped and sealed copies. I had to give my originals to the Customs Agent in Split to import our Lithiums, we were wintering in Milna Marina ($120:00/week) and i had to get court copies for them to hold in the Interim. Foreign boats are treated that way.

Claiming bank holds them will be a hiccup for you......

Cheers Frank.
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Old 19-06-2013, 04:05   #93
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

Word is it resets the 18 months, with no "outside EU" time requirement, so you just need to leave for a day and you can return with another 18 months, unlike schengen.
$120/week sounds reasonable, Id prefer be hauled out somewhere if possible though.
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Old 19-06-2013, 04:33   #94
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

Don't think that's the case i'd get something in writing before relying on it. Theres many threads here with that particular discussion going on, Dave 'goboatingnow' is on top of this subject if you ask his advice i'm sure it'll be close.

We will haul out or put in bond but some require a minimum of 6 months ie Greece. Our plans are to accumulate less than 18 by the time we exit Gibralter for Canaries....

Cheers Frank
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Old 19-06-2013, 04:35   #95
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

That was a very safe Marina, ferry to Split daily $6 return, clean water, power and a lovely fishing village community, worth a visit, as you enter it's first to port side.

Starigrad is also good but further away.

Cheers
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Old 19-06-2013, 04:58   #96
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

Yep goatboating is a wealth of information when it comes to anything, heres a good post he made recently on another thread re: VAT
I think we would like to stay aboard Sephina for a month after the weather isn't condusive to sailing and anchoring out and explore Croatia inland a bit, maybe till mid November, and do the same around April next year while we wait for the weather to come good. A little fishing village on an island would be perfect!

Idiots Guide to Sailing in the EU


Quote:
Since then, I've talked to other people who say " Good God no. You need these forms filled out in triplicate, an I-something or another, a ten thousand dollar bond and a visa if you're going to stay more than 30 days."

I would love to see Europe but to be honest, I'm not even sure what's in the EU. Am I going to run into the same thing? I would think you have to contact the particular country's embassy to check in and out, is that correct or is there some central place since it is the EU?

18 months? If you wanted to see anything, I don't think you could get around Ireland and England in that amount of time, let alone Sweden, Finland and some car trips in Germany.

Where do you go to get out of the EU? How long do you have to be gone before you can come back and continue?

I know, lots of stupid questions but it's better to ask before the docklines are cast off just to make sure you have all your ducks in a row.
Theres a few people , making this out to be more difficult then it is.

Time allowances

For VAT on the Boat , nominally 18 months , requires no pre-authorisation, extenbable to 24 months on application in a particular country. VAt clocks resets on any trip outside the customs union of the EU. ( The EU directive does not state an actual time that has to be spent outside, most people seem to just show ,they went to outside the area)

Immigration Limit , 90days in 180, 180 days starts on first entry into Schengen area. UK, Ireland Croatia , Turkey etc not in Schengen

Entry requirements

Checkin Procedure, For your first entry into the Schengen Area ( and for you first entry into any other EU non Schengen country), you will need to get your passports stamped. In the Med many many marinas have no post officials, hence you may have to search around to find them, usually the marina operators will assist you. There is "technically" a requirement to go to a "port of entry" , but this only tends to be enforced in Croatia, Greece and Turkey in my experience.

Passports are not routinely stamped in the EU anymore, so you may have to ask.

There is no requirement to present at customs, this is only done if you feel you have something to declare. ( hide the AK OK). AND YOU HAVE NOTHING TO DECLARE, right , move on , nothing to see here. ( PS but a piece of plastic tape over any mouths that feel any compulsion to blabber!!) .

Once inside the Schengen Area, there is no requirement to recheck in or check out in any Schengen Area country further . There is no requirement in any European country to get exit permissions ( ie Zarpe etc).

Technically , time at sea outside the 12 mile limit is time outside the Schengen area and doesn't take from your 90 days. However technically if you go outside the Schengen area to claim that exemption, then you have to check in again !!!

Reality
OK. Thats the legalities, The realities are different. This is Europe not the US, we don't necessarily have a rule for everything and not every rule is thought through.

Furthermore EU law, must be transposed into National Law to be effective and often national law differs in tone, is more involved or less enforced (or just ignored) then the original EU Directive, leading to some confusion and variable implementation on the ground . Thers no final answer just live with it, we all do here

IN reality, for visiting yachts, official oversight is almost non-existent, partioculary in Spain, France, Italy and virtually all Northern European countries. Portugal can be a pain depending on who you meet, and as one goes east, things get more complicated ( a little more complicated). IN Ireland for example, youll have a hard time getting anyone interested in your arrival , much less stamping things, just go of and have a Guiness, Everyone knows you come fro "Amerikay" anyway, They'll find you soon enough , sort of thing, As was said , it helps when Bobs your Uncle.

OK lets deal with the myths

Quote:
Since then, I've talked to other people who say " Good God no. You need these forms filled out in triplicate, an I-something or another, a ten thousand dollar bond and a visa if you're going to stay more than 30 days."
Hogwash, There are no forms, all you need is your passports. In Greece , turkey and croatia there ( still are for non EU ) are cruising permits. They can all be acquired(bought) on arrival at the port of entry. They are not expensive, nor widely inspected, simples.

Quote:
Where do you go to get out of the EU? How long do you have to be gone before you can come back and continue?
People continually mix up the VAT allowances with the Visa allowances.

Vat( 18 months) is "reset" as described earlier by the simple process of leaving the Customs Terrority of the EU , no minimum time is specified. technically out to 12 mile limit and back is sufficient. In practice NO ONE CARES ABOUT VAT on a non EU leisure boat crewed by Non-eu citizens.

IN the Schengen Area you are limited to 90 days out of 180. Once you have used up the 90 days you must leave for 90 days. By playing the timescales you can get in effect about 179 days in two 90 day blocks back to back.

You reset the Schengen visa by staying out of the Schengen area countries for the allotted time .

IN general , if you stay in any EU country for more then 180 days out of a calendar year, you can be regarded as a residxent and subject to local laws, just like any other resident, that can mean exposure to wealth and asset taxes, compulsory national registration of the boat, compulsory certificates of competence, etc etc etc, please dont do this without thinking about it. ( Or if you do , don't be like the fool Belgian when asked in a Spanish marina, how long are you there " oh 1 year" and then screamed when they taxed me like a Spaniard!). Try and look gormless and shrug your shoulders, that usually works.!!.


Yes you are correct the Schengen tourist visa is restrictive for long term cruisers, No doubt in time, it may be dealt with , but the number of long term non-EU cruisers in Europe amounts to a handful and there are still ways to handle the issue legally and enjoy your self.


Quote:
I would love to see Europe but to be honest, I'm not even sure what's in the EU. Am I going to run into the same thing? I would think you have to contact the particular country's embassy to check in and out, is that correct or is there some central place since it is the EU?
Yes contact EuroBoat, Commission Strasse 9999, Brussels present your first born, 1000000 euros, 5 triplicate passports, 10 copies of a form in two languages neither of which you understand and withstand a 2 hour interview , where an aloof Frenchman will berate your culture. OK feel better now, formalities passed, go cruising

Quote:
I'm not even sure what's in the EU
Im not even sure even I can answer that!!!!!!!!
Half the problem is people cant seem to accept there is such a light touch and go seeking trouble!!.
Dave
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Old 19-06-2013, 05:45   #97
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

Milna on Brac is perfect, good people running it and nice clear water.

Ok Dave covers that pretty well, we have dual citizenship English and Australian so using the English passport we can stay forever should we choose.

The boat's a different matter being Australian and VAT not paid, when we entered Greece from Croatia we started the boat's clock ticking, the boat get's a 6 month Transit log which is extendable for a fee.

Our intention is to winter in Turkey so that's good enough to stop the ticking and we can re-enter Greece next year with a fresh sheet according to Dave. That sounds cool, he knows his stuff.
Contact IVONA and start the interest in wintering there you wont be disappointed. milna@marinavlaska.com

Cheers enjoy
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Old 20-06-2013, 00:21   #98
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

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Originally Posted by d4raffy View Post
Beware Kakan Bay (north of Split). This beautiful anchorage - have used frequently over 5 years - is now completely full of buoys !

In April we managed to squeeze our anchor in last remaining free space between the buoys - only yacht in the bay - and they still charged us 300kn.
In May we dropped the hook just for lunch - they still came over and tried to charge us by the hour !! We left.
I'm all for a restaurant to run a few paid buoys - but this is over the top.
If you want to see where the anchorages are, and which ones have buoys and charge for anchoring etc, follow the links in the second paragraph
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Old 20-06-2013, 00:33   #99
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

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Originally Posted by monte View Post

Idiots Guide to Sailing in the EU

Quote:
Since then, I've talked to other people who say " Good God no. You need these forms filled out in triplicate, an I-something or another, a ten thousand dollar bond and a visa if you're going to stay more than 30 days."

<big snip>

Dave
Nice one Dave!

I've formally recorded all this stuff about European rules, together with GoBoatingNow's help, together with links to official sources where I could track them down.

You're right, generally, European regulation is largely a light touch. People only look closely at you and your boat if there's some sort of incident . . . then things can get rough if you haven't played the game straight.
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Old 20-06-2013, 10:28   #100
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

This is the list i from the Charter co. They told me that due to joining the EU they would be enforcing it.

regards
Paul
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File Type: pdf list_of_licenses_1604_2012.pdf (381.8 KB, 29 views)
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Old 20-06-2013, 10:50   #101
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

Looks like last year was cheaper and less issues!
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Old 20-06-2013, 10:52   #102
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

That only concerns Croatian flagged vessels, other vessels must conform to their own law as they are foreign flagged..

Cheers Frank
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Old 20-06-2013, 11:12   #103
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

They also give licenses for 750 kuna to tourists/people wishing to charter Croatian yachts in their waters, the exam takes two beers to complete.
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Old 20-06-2013, 16:54   #104
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

I have The Mediterranean IP cert issued by USSA and its listed as 500 Gt. I can't remember what I sent in to get that but I only have Asa 104 and 105.
Maybe it's experience based?
Regards
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Old 20-06-2013, 17:09   #105
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Re: Looking for Feedback On Croatia

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Originally Posted by Palarran View Post
I will look for her. I'm thinking of heading to Sipan this afternoon, then Lastovo, Vela Luka, Vis, and Trogir. We have family coming in there and will work our way back to Dubrovnik. Then to Montenegro for 3 days then back to the Ionians.

We got pretty hammered on the way here from Corfu. 25 knot winds straight on the nose off the coast of Albania. My family all got sea sick so I had a nice 24 hour watch. Man did I sleep last night!! I just hope we get the same winds on the way back as that would make for a nice fast return to Corfu.
Col's in Montenegro at present.

Check out his blog finally my darling for some tips.
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