Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 21-11-2010, 05:05   #1
Registered User
 
hoppy's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,844
ICC in Greece - Laws vs Reality

The Noonsite states that in Greece "The skipper must have an International Certificate of Competence"

http://www.noonsite.com/Countries/Gr...ties#Documents

But certainly there are many skippers cruising in Greece without the ICC.

I know there are plenty of Swedes chartering in Greece and there are quite a number of Swedish yachts there, and in all likelihood none of these Swedes have an ICC as Sweden does not issue them.

So what is the reality when you are there?

Do the Greeks just accept any official looking skipper document so they can stamp a few documents and get back to their afternoon nap?
hoppy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-11-2010, 05:45   #2
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Cruz
Boat: SAnta Cruz 27
Posts: 6,683
The reality is that they don't ask and the Swedes don't tell.
donradcliffe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-11-2010, 06:15   #3
Senior Cruiser
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,561
Images: 2
pirate

The reality is it depends on the officer who clears you through the the Corinth Canal or the bridge at Khalkis....
The Corinth we cleared in 10mins as he glanced through eveything fast and did not question my word we were insured....
At Khalis it took over 2hrs... and he questioned every document and insisted I should be carrying original documentation for the boat... Insurance, Bill of Sale, Registration etc etc.... he did not give up haranguing till I said if he did not clear me through I'd just reverse course and reach Turkey by going back and rounding the Southern tip of Evia...
He then stated I should be careful.. if I was stopped by a patrol boat I'd be in big trouble...
During the trip through Greece there were repeated VHF broadcasts about Coalition Forces seizing/sinking vessels non-compliant with regs/suspicious behavior in the Eastern Med...
So it could happen... but the chances are they'll only stick it to you if your an EU citizen
__________________

It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-11-2010, 08:41   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Cruz
Boat: SAnta Cruz 27
Posts: 6,683
Sounds like the Khalkis guy was looking for an excuse to shake you down--like the Canadian reported on noonsite Noonsite: Evia Channel - Khalkis Bridge

So what did you show him as a certificate of competence?? I've got a US 100 ton license, but was never asked for it in 4 seasons in the med. Perhaps its becasue I don't look like a pirate...
donradcliffe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-11-2010, 09:36   #5
Senior Cruiser
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,561
Images: 2
pirate

Quote:
Originally Posted by donradcliffe View Post
Sounds like the Khalkis guy was looking for an excuse to shake you down--like the Canadian reported on noonsite Noonsite: Evia Channel - Khalkis Bridge

So what did you show him as a certificate of competence?? I've got a US 100 ton license, but was never asked for it in 4 seasons in the med. Perhaps its becasue I don't look like a pirate...

My RYA Coastal Skipper/ICC.... and I looked like this at the time....
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCN47991.jpg
Views:	376
Size:	344.2 KB
ID:	21362  
__________________

It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-11-2010, 10:26   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Corsica (France)
Boat: Bavaria 37
Posts: 238
Hello,
We passed the bridge at Khalkis last may and nobody did asked for any competence certificate. I am sailing in the Aegean sea for years and i have never heard anything about this certificate, neither my different boat neighbors (Americans, Germans, English..)... I have friends who were asked for it in Croatia, but never in Greece.. Maybe is it a misunderstanding because of the language and coastguards were asking for another document ?
IMO, It is not the first time a rumor arrives with Noonsite..
Jacques2
Jacques2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-11-2010, 10:26   #7
Registered User
 
swagman's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Winter land based UK New Forest. Summer months away. Making the transition from sail to power this year - scary stuff.
Boat: Super Van Craft 1320 Power Yacht
Posts: 2,175
Images: 10
Send a message via Skype™ to swagman
Through 2006 / 7 we never once had a Greek official ask to see an ICC, and despite being a UK registered vessel for much of the time we chose to fly the Australian national flag off the transom. Point is no one cares much and you need not worry until they do. But when they do, it matters not if you legally have the docs or fly the right flag or whatever.
What actually matters is what the local official says on the day.
JOHN
__________________
Don't take life too seriously. No ones going to make it out alive......Go see our blog at https://www.sailblogs.com/member/yachtswagman/
swagman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-11-2010, 12:50   #8
Registered User
 
hoppy's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,844
The whole licensing thing is quite funny. The Swedish government likes to regulate and control many things and yet, in Sweden then there is no licence requirement aside from the radio licence for my boat. On the other hand I need a licence to play golf, although playing the ignorant foreigner card gets you on the course
hoppy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-11-2010, 12:53   #9
Registered User
 
hoppy's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,844
Quote:
Originally Posted by swagman View Post
Through 2006 / 7 we never once had a Greek official ask to see an ICC, and despite being a UK registered vessel for much of the time we chose to fly the Australian national flag off the transom. Point is no one cares much and you need not worry until they do. But when they do, it matters not if you legally have the docs or fly the right flag or whatever.
What actually matters is what the local official says on the day.
JOHN
I wonder what reaction I would get flying my "dual nationality" flag
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	australia sweden.jpg
Views:	666
Size:	64.5 KB
ID:	21368  
hoppy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-11-2010, 01:03   #10
Registered User
 
swagman's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Winter land based UK New Forest. Summer months away. Making the transition from sail to power this year - scary stuff.
Boat: Super Van Craft 1320 Power Yacht
Posts: 2,175
Images: 10
Send a message via Skype™ to swagman
:-)

You'd cause a few to go check their book of flags, for sure. Very good.

JOHN
__________________
Don't take life too seriously. No ones going to make it out alive......Go see our blog at https://www.sailblogs.com/member/yachtswagman/
swagman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-11-2010, 02:44   #11
Registered User
 
simonmd's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sant Carles, S Spain
Boat: 30ft Catalac 900 "Rubessa"
Posts: 876
The point is, you should have one. Normal day to day, you'll not need it but if there was some kind of dispute and you didn't have one, they'd have a good excuse to make life difficult for you.
simonmd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-11-2010, 03:26   #12
Registered User
 
hoppy's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,844
Quote:
Originally Posted by simonmd View Post
The point is, you should have one. Normal day to day, you'll not need it but if there was some kind of dispute and you didn't have one, they'd have a good excuse to make life difficult for you.
How can one have what one cannot legally obtain?

The ICC is currently not enforceable in Greece unless they are happy to empty their waters of sailors from countries that do not issue the ICC. I have a feeling the EU might have some issues with Greece stopping memebers from some EU countries from sailing in their waters.
hoppy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-11-2010, 04:04   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Corsica (France)
Boat: Bavaria 37
Posts: 238
To simonmd :
Maybe is there a difference for motor boats.
In Greece, it is the same as in France : motorboats must have a special permit ; sailboats do not (it doesn't exit, except for professionals on charter boats).
Jacques2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-11-2010, 06:00   #14
Senior Cruiser
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,561
Images: 2
pirate

Personally speaking... having never sailed to Turkey before, I checked all the info I could find on Noonsite... enquired on here (3 answers) and other sites so was expecting all kinds of entry hassles/inspections etc... the reality was I anchored 5 times through Turkey.. once just of a military base in the Canakkaale for two nights after being pushed back from the Marmara by a NE8.... not a peep...
Greece.. which I'd expected to be more laid back than 15yrs ago was tougher... but that was in just the one place.. the rest of the time the most difficulty was finding cash machines.... one place involved a 23k trip inland... the villiage shops did not accept plastic..
__________________

It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-11-2010, 06:31   #15
Registered User
 
swagman's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Winter land based UK New Forest. Summer months away. Making the transition from sail to power this year - scary stuff.
Boat: Super Van Craft 1320 Power Yacht
Posts: 2,175
Images: 10
Send a message via Skype™ to swagman
Quote:
Originally Posted by simonmd View Post
The point is, you should have one. Normal day to day, you'll not need it but if there was some kind of dispute and you didn't have one, they'd have a good excuse to make life difficult for you.
Correction on that - the point is you do not need to have one one under maritime law in either Greece or Turkey.

But again back in the real world and despite you not requiring one, go often enough and you will one day meet up with some officious little chappie who insists he wants to see your proof of competence.

It happened to us perhaps the third time we wanted to clear out of Turkey - and the fact we'd cleared in / out at other ports meant nothing to this guy. We had to sail on and exit elsewhere (with no issues and still no ICC).

For that kind of situation alone it is worth getting something in print and ideally under plastic saying you are qualified.

If you can't be bothered or have no facility to get an ICC or similar then I suggest you test yourself, issue yourself with a nicely offical looking document in Swedish. Provided you are not forging a real document, you cannot be in the wrong.

Cheers
JOHN
__________________
Don't take life too seriously. No ones going to make it out alive......Go see our blog at https://www.sailblogs.com/member/yachtswagman/
swagman is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
Greece, icc

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What Are Firearm Laws in Turkey ? mountholly Europe & Mediterranean 3 25-10-2010 03:59
Stupid Laws mmckee1952 Flotsam & Sailing Miscellany 20 03-11-2009 20:22
Anchoring laws- Alabama capn-d Rules of the Road, Regulations & Red Tape 31 30-11-2008 13:02
anchoring laws and restrictions kkugley Liveaboard's Forum 10 12-07-2008 17:26
Murphy's Lesser Known Laws Lancerbye Flotsam & Sailing Miscellany 14 18-07-2007 19:52

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:01.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.