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Old 08-12-2008, 02:47   #1
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How Much Red Tape in the Mediterranean?

Hello everybody,

Sailing in the Mediterranean has been a long time dream of mine. The plan was to stick to the eastern part of the region visiting Greece , Turkey, some of ex Yugoslavia coast and then continue to Egypt.

I intended to sail from March thru September in the Med and then winterize the boat in a fishing village . To avoid paying big bucks for a marina I was thinking of having a local guy keep an eye on the boat for a fee. Another scenario was to move to the winterless Red Sea, drop the hook either around Hurghada or Aqaba and explore Egypt and Jordan from there.

However after reading a number of sites on regulations and requirements in the area I am having serious doubts as to the feasibility of my plan.
My major concern is if I can meet the local requirements and whether I can afford it.

Greece in particular seems to be a bureaucratic maze combined with ubiquitous fees .

Just to mention a few gems from the Greek section:
The original boat insurance certificate is required with the minimum amounts as follows:
293,470 for liability from death or injury by sinking or collision
146,753 for damage
88,041 for pollution
All numbers in Euros.

The skipper must have an International Certificate of Competence.

To obtain a sailing permit one has to pay 10 Euros per foot. This permit is supposedly good for a month

Every time the boat touches a quay or enters a marina just to buy fuel for example a fee is charged.

What is the reality of the Mediterranean sailing ? Is it that complicated and pricey?

Any suggestions as far as the budget just for permits , fees etc would help .

I do carry a boat insurance but it's only good for the West Coast. Unfortunatelly I cannot afford an offshore insurance.

As far as certificates I have a Pleasure Craft Certificate, now required in Canada, and a VHF Operators Card. Other than those and some 20 plus years of sailing the West Coast and in the South Pacific I have no other credentials.

The boat is registerd in Canada.

Any comments especially from the sailors who have dealt with those issues first hand would be highly appreciated.

Chris
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Old 02-01-2009, 09:54   #2
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Greece is actually one of the cheaper places to cruise in the Med. Very few ports or harbours charge the fees you mention, and the marinas are cheap compared to the West Med and the Adriatic.

Yes, the cruising permit is boring and limiting, since you have to pay up every 3 months or face a fine. So you'd need to make arrangments with a local to pay on your behalf during the winter if you weren't on the boat.

You'll need insurance and certificates of competence in many parts of the Mediterranean, but the locals are usually quite happy with your country's qualifications. Insurance certificates for third part cover are essential in nearly all Mediterranean countries. Your insurer will be familiar with issuing the appropriate Greek language cert, and if he isn't, ask yourself whether he knows his job.

My web site is pretty thorough on Greece, so have a look at it.

JimB
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Old 02-01-2009, 11:02   #3
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Hi Chris,
Just backing up what Jim has said.
You can sail over to Europe uncovered by insurance, but you'll need cover if you ever wish to park up in a marina in most EU countries. Suggest you could source over the web - maybe a UK company if they'll cover a Canadian yacht.
The other stuff you refer to is misleading.
You'll not be asked to pay a fee in Greece each time to enter a harbour.
Definately not to fuel up.
The Greek Cruising permit is for 3 months.
Under international maritime law you only need the certificates you need in your own country and I likeyou crsuied the Med for yearswthout anything. But admit t running into a harbour master who did not see it the same way in Turkey - so easiest all round to get an ICC.
Frankly - from what I've read I'd be more worried about regulations on cruising around the US than the EU. Our blog has details on our Med experiences through 2004 - 7.
Good luck
JOHN
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Old 11-01-2009, 20:48   #4
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JimB and Swagman ,thanks for your input . Maybe the situation is not that bad as I first thought. On the other hand , after reading various threads it looks like in many cases it's a matter of luck and a fairly large number of so called" rules" can and are bent and interpreted at will by local officials . So it seems that the best strategy is to be prepared and then go with the flow staying optimistic.
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Old 11-01-2009, 22:26   #5
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Another country to look into is Croatia.
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Old 11-02-2009, 08:52   #6
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http://www.sailingbooks.co.uk/trolle.../101/index.htm

RYA books 1 & 2 may be helpful, and are not expensive. Im reading book 2 at the moment, and it lists most of the requirements for each country.

I was surprised at the insurance requirements, from this very forum I learned a lot of people don't insure their boats for various reasons. However it seems almost everywhere I am planning to go requires it.

Mark
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:51   #7
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Quote:
I do carry a boat insurance but it's only good for the West Coast. Unfortunatelly I cannot afford an offshore insurance
Chris,
You can get Liability Only offshore insurance, which is considerably less expensive than full hull coverage. The companies that we write policies with are aware of the documentation requirements, and issue a mulitlingual certificate when the navigation includes the Mediterranean. The certificate is in English, Spanish, French, Greek, & Italian.
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Old 15-04-2009, 00:57   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swagman View Post
Under international maritime law you only need the certificates you need in your own country and I likeyou crsuied the Med for yearswthout anything. But admit t running into a harbour master who did not see it the same way in Turkey .
Not strictly true that you do not require any certification for a British registered vessel in foreign waters.

The UK authorities do not require any licence for a private UK registered vessel being used in UK waters

Under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS)countries may (and do) take a different view when a vessel is being used (and based) in their waters no matter what flag is being flown and require some form of crew certification

More info is available at http://www.rya.org.uk/KnowledgeBase/boatingabroad/Pages/abroadscope.aspx and at http://www.rya.org.uk/KnowledgeBase/boatingabroad/Pages/boatingabroadpaperwork.aspx
http://www.rya.org.uk/KnowledgeBase/boatingabroad/Pages/infosources.aspx

In my experience the Turkish coastguard will regularly board both private and charter vessels to check paperwork and safety equipment. They seem to only accept a qualification which contains a photograph (RYA Coastal Skipper and above or ICC)

I personally know of two occassions last year where the skipper of a yacht was ordered back to port until he could produce a valid licence
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Old 15-04-2009, 04:49   #9
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Who said Red Tape?

For Australians:

Quote:
What is the International Certificate of Competence (ICC) and how do I obtain one?



This qualification is not available from Yachting Australia, and unfortunately has to be issued by the national authority for the country of residence. Therefore unless you hold residency or citizenship of another country, who do offer the ICC such as the UK, unfortunately, the qualification is not available to you at this stage.
LOLOL.

I'll just offer Nicolle as a bribe! (Or a threat!)
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Old 22-07-2009, 08:56   #10
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Hi Chris,
There is very little "red tape" in the Med, apart from documents showing proof of ownership and adequate third party insurance.
In the 11 years I've been cruising there so far, nobody was ever interested in my proud collection of certificates of competence; locals often don't have any and occasionally behave accordingly.
Customs might like to check if the navigation software on your pc is legal.
Good luck, Klaas
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Old 24-07-2009, 05:06   #11
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Customs might like to check if the navigation software on your pc is legal.
Where did they check you on that?
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Old 24-07-2009, 06:23   #12
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software & customs

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Originally Posted by Anders View Post
Where did they check you on that?
Ive heard that in France you get a substantial fine if they find a hacked copy of maxsea on your laptop. Though Ive never heard of this happening to anyone and news like that would spead like wildfire in cruising circles so probably very low risk.
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Old 24-07-2009, 06:48   #13
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Ive heard that in France you get a substantial fine if they find a hacked copy of maxsea on your laptop.
Oh for god sake , more third party rumors. The french are the LEAST officious of all the med countries. You can cruise the med on (a) Boat reg papers, (b) Insurance and (c) crews passports. Everything else is bumfluff. ( except in greece)
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Old 13-08-2009, 12:50   #14
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Working round the western Med we have always been asked for Certificate of Registration and Insurance at every marina so far, passports are often requested as well. Not been asked for anything else (yet).
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Old 30-08-2009, 11:58   #15
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How does an International Certificate of Competence compare with other esp. US qualifications? Is it like a USCG Aux basic boating cert, an ASA cruising cert, a USCG OUPV or Master's Cert, or an RYA Masters Cert? We have been trying to determine what is actually interchangeable but few we've asked seem to have the answer and no two answers are the same.
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