Adriatic - Zadar to Split, Brac, Hvar - End of April, 2011

[pjosip]

Again about the anchoring:

In bays you should be protected from stronger currents, but if they are present, take care on how much chain you release before removing power from the engine to let the wind and current push away the boat for chain to tighten. You do not want the chain to get close to your keel. Your previous experience is an advantage in situations like this. Include some intuition but do not hesitate to redo the anchoring if you don't feel confident about how you did it initially. We repeat several times if needed untill we are satisfied.

In general, do take care about the ropes in marinas of neighbouring boats. The boats are very close to each other in marinas (i wonder if there is some regulation on that regard) and naighbouring boat's moorings can literraly be touched by hand from your boat.
In my humble experience I experienced 3 cases of getting the keel tangled into the ropes and I don't call it a coincidence anymore.

The docking in marinas or ports can be tricky on bad weather. All of them are protected from most of the common winds but not all winds.

Before docking try to "feel" your docking place. When I say "feel" I mean, reduce the power of engine, try to detect the currents and to which direction the wind is pushing and you and don't be afraid to make a circle or two with your boat in port before indulging into docking procedure. This is specifically good advice on bad weather.

There will be people from shore who will wait for you to throw them the rope. If you do the docking procedure gently, you will notice the respectfull look of locals. If you don't - well, be prepared for some strange looks and maybe something you might interpret as gossiping in caffe bars once you are on the shore.

A good commander of boat is something that is appreaciated but even if you don't make it - don't worry, the looks and gossips don't hurt (phisically) and you will have another chance in tomorow's port.

[Dockhead]

In the area I cruised in Croatia -- Split, Island of Hvar, Island of Korcula, and others in that area -- the bottom was very difficult almost everywhere -- mostly loose shingle and rock. The boat we chartered (a lovely Salona 45 racer/cruiser) had a crap anchor, which didn't help, but we had a lot of trouble anchoring. Make sure you have a good anchor and do your anchoring with great care. Be sure to back down long and hard before you start making cocktails.

[Ram]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

In the area I cruised in Croatia -- Split, Island of Hvar, Island of Korcula, and others in that area -- the bottom was very difficult almost everywhere -- mostly loose shingle and rock. The boat we chartered (a lovely Salona 45 racer/cruiser) had a crap anchor, which didn't help, but we had a lot of trouble anchoring. Make sure you have a good anchor and do your anchoring with great care. Be sure to back down long and hard before you start making cocktails.

Yes I agree,and maybe the worst place I’ve sailed for anchoring- One thing I might add, Many places we sailed there was a charge for anchoring $75+usd a night to drop your hook in an unprotected sea? or coming alongside a town quay- or moorings---
200 +euros custom fees-- seems everyone was out to take your money-very expensive-this has kept me from coming back

[pjosip]

Originally Posted by Ram

Yes I agree,and maybe the worst place I’ve sailed for anchoring- One thing I might add, Many places we sailed there was a charge for anchoring $75+usd a night to drop your hook in an unprotected sea? or coming alongside a town quay- or moorings---
200 +euros custom fees-- seems everyone was out to take your money-very expensive-this has kept me from coming back

No way man-75$... ?!

Tha place in marina for most of the sailing boats (let's say up to 46 feet) does not cost more than 50 euros.


Maybe you were on big sailing cruiser?

[salsero]

Originally Posted by osullivanshane

Hello All,

Does anyone have any advice on conditions we might expect in this area around the end of April.

We will be four people, three dayskippers and a novice but we do not have a lot of experience - just some charters in Ireland and RYA courses in Croatia.

Main concern would be if it blows up a hooley really quickly, if bad weather or the Bora sets in for several days, whether big seas are common at this time of year?

Also the area - I think we should be in good areas for seeking shelter if necessary, but is there anywhere to avoid?

Any and all advice very gratefully received ;-)

Cheers,
Shane

Dear Shane,

as psjosip already said, the jugo builds up over a longer period and is therefore not so dangerous. Be aware however that after the worst of a jugo is over, the sea state might be quite uncomfortable (4-5).

The bora remains to be the most dangerous condition. Although the Bora is not completely predictable, it is my exprerience that DHMZ= predicts it quite reliably. If you do not sail to close to land, you will normally be able to see the ridge of the mountains. As long as the ridge is clouded or unclear, there is no danger of a bora. If the ridge is clearly outlined, in particular if you also see clouds at a small distance southwesterly from the ridge, then this is a good indication that Bora is imminent (meaning that it can hit you within the next 30 minutes or so. The surface of the sea will tell you whether it is actually coming, as long as you do not sail to close to the NE shores. The bora will not produce any major waves but in April the wind force may still be around BfT 8-9 or exceptionally 10. If it hits you while being out in the open, and if you cannot find any shelter, just put up your small foresail and go with the winds. The strenght of the bora will decrease with the distance to the croatian main land.

I would advise to buy a pre-paid Croatian mobile phone card to be able to download the wheather forecasts on a daily basis.

[DoubleWhisky]

Originally Posted by pjosip

No way man-75$... ?!

Tha place in marina for most of the sailing boats (let's say up to 46 feet) does not cost more than 50 euros.


Maybe you were on big sailing cruiser?

50 Euros = 72 USD
Approximately, of course

[swagman]

Hi,
Hope you have a good time.
One place I suggest you do avoid for anchoring and its been mentioned already - is Hvar itself. It's not just the bottom substance but the fact so many boats plough it up constantly, making holding very poor for everyone irrigardless of how good your ground tackle is.
Locals will always suggest you either get in there early and get a place moored stern to the town jetty (which is not real big) or seriously consider a slide over to the ACI small marina on the islet just opposite Hvar.
From there they run a regular ferry to Hvar town if you do want to explore the castle etc - and the marina is extremely well protected from winds from all quarters and only some surge if you got a strong easterly wind.
Another recommendation to anchor with good holding is the bay on the top inside edge of Mjlet Island. Great choice of restaurants ashore, great walks around the national park.
Theres a black and white pilot / guide called '777' in English (the 777 represents the number inhabited out of the 1,200 islands along the Croatian coast.
I suggest if you cannot get one before you go take time to buy it locally on arrival - worthwhile read.
Enjoy .
JOHN

[pjosip]

Originally Posted by swagman

Hi,
Hope you have a good time.
One place I suggest you do avoid for anchoring and its been mentioned already - is Hvar itself.

I agree.


If there was a place where people like Beyonce Knowles, Paul Allen (Microsoft guy), Simon Le Bon come, would you expect it to be cheap?

Let's be honest here?

[pjosip]

Originally Posted by DoubleWhisky

50 Euros = 72 USD
Approximately, of course

Well, that's the cost in marina.


I understood as if he payed that much for anchor in some bay.

If that is the case, in the bay, then he better called police because he was tricked.

It is true that city quays are payed but less than marinas cca 200 kuna (30 euros). I was only once charged 20 kuna (3 euros - three) for anchoring and that was in Komiza city harbour.

Pay attention that in Kornati (national park) you are paying entrance (70 kuna (10 euros) per person. Close to Kornati there is a nature park Telascica and there you pay anchoring but a lot less than in marina (100 kuna - 15 euros).

There is no way that they charge for anchoring on some deserted bays.

I am thinking - he was probably tricked by some daredevils.

[DoubleWhisky]

Originally Posted by pjosip

Well, that's the cost in marina.


I understood as if he payed that much for anchor in some bay.

If that is the case, in the bay, then he better called police because he was tricked.

It is true that city quays are payed but less than marinas cca 200 kuna (30 euros). I was only once charged 20 kuna (3 euros - three) for anchoring and that was in Komiza city harbour.

Pay attention that in Kornati (national park) you are paying entrance (70 kuna (10 euros) per person. Close to Kornati there is a nature park Telascica and there you pay anchoring but a lot less than in marina (100 kuna - 15 euros).

There is no way that they charge for anchoring on some deserted bays.

I am thinking - he was probably tricked by some daredevils.

Am I right that the list of places with authorized payments for taking the mooring buoy or anchoring was officially published in Croatia?

If so (I found such an info somewhere, but it was not important to me at the moment) - may be You can point us towards this document?
It would diminish the cheating possibilities

[pjosip]

Originally Posted by DoubleWhisky

Am I right that the list of places with authorized payments for taking the mooring buoy or anchoring was officially published in Croatia?

If so (I found such an info somewhere, but it was not important to me at the moment) - may be You can point us towards this document?
It would diminish the cheating possibilities

I don't think if such list exists? I might actually send a question to ministry of maritime...

I am drawing your and all others attention - no bay, no beach can be private in Croatia. That is the law. So, all the sea and land close to the sea is owned by government ie. the local authorities. There exist possibility that government (local authorities) give concession to beach but it never includes the bays.

So, for starters no private person can charge anything regardless to what they say. It has to be the city, county or national/nature park representative and they must clearly identify themselves. They operate that way - first identification.

As for the city quays - we payed 200 kuna but that included the electricity and water plugs! If electricity and water does not exist - I don't recall of ever being charged.

[Looking Glass]

Hello pjosip

You have a lot of knowledge - I think it will be good to share it.
May be You can start and help to keep going a general thread here for sailing in Croatia?
Something like DoubleWhisky did with in the thread "Tips for Greece"?
I think it can be interesting for much of us here

[pjosip]

Originally Posted by Looking Glass

Hello pjosip

You have a lot of knowledge - I think it will be good to share it.
May be You can start and help to keep going a general thread here for sailing in Croatia?
Something like DoubleWhisky did with in the thread "Tips for Greece"?
I think it can be interesting for much of us here

Well, though my vanity likes to hear the words you're saying I am far in knowledge compared to a lot of other people.

Nevertheless, I think that it is the good idea to open a separate topic with tips for Croatia and I might actually do that.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by swagman

One place I suggest you do avoid for anchoring and its been mentioned already - is Hvar itself. It's not just the bottom substance but the fact so many boats plough it up constantly, making holding very poor for everyone irrigardless of how good your ground tackle is.

Hvar harbor was where I had the worst and most frightening experience I ever had on a boat in my life. It was six or seven years ago. The harbor was completely full of Italian boats -- it was August. A thunderstorm blew up out of nowhere producing a vicious katabatic wind and horizontal rain, and every boat in the harbor dragged anchor. It was mass chaos which lasted all night. It is a miracle that no boats were wrecked on the rocky shore and that there were no collisions.

In the process of dragging across the harbor for the n-th time, my anchor finally caught on a disused mooring chain or something, which was what held me after all. I spent the rest of the night at the helm with the motor idling.

I was young and stupid and it didn't occur to me to just go out to sea, which is what I would do in such a situation today. I had no chart plotter and didn't know the rocky coast, it was pitch black, and I had at that time little experience with night pilotage, so it seemed to me that I was better off trying to stay anchored in the harbor, although I now know better.

The experience made me paranoid about anchoring, which is why the first thing I did to my new boat was to ditch the ground tackle and acquire overkill ground tackle consisting of 100 meters of 12mm chain and a 55kg Rocna.

Boy, Hvar is a gorgeous place, however. Absolutely magical.

[pjosip]

Well, what do you know... I just found out that anchorages started to be concessioned and that since the last of the year a tourist fee has to be payed for every boat.

I will post all info on the topic "Tips for Croatia" ASAP.