VAT

[bluesailorp]

Hello....
I need some one educated me to understand how VAT works and applies in Europe.Here it's the situation i'm planning to by a used sailboat in the Caribbean French made and German flagged and VAT not paid ,Now since I'm Canadian and European Citizen planning to take the boat back to Europe in the next one to two years and start living there how the VAT it's applied, it will reflect on the price I paid for it as used boat, or on the price tag when she was new ?? Should I register the boat in Canada and have the boat there as a foreigner vessel? I have no idea if that is possible or I have some other options?
My anticipated thanks to any one could give me some info on this matter.
Thank you very much

[Dockhead]

You will have to pay VAT on the boat at the first country you enter in the EU.


If you have an EU passport, you are not allowed to use a non-VAT paid boat in EU waters, whatever the flag.


You might find it more economical to buy a VAT-paid boat, but note that to preserve VAT-paid status the boat should not change hands outside of Europe.

[UFO]

Try this thread:


http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...es-205124.html

[bluesailorp]

Hello Dockhead...
Thanks for the reply to my post, I understand I do have to pay VAT if still go ahead with my plan second part of my question it's about when VAT apply in this case (used boat) that apply's to the price I pay for it or will be on price tag when she was a new vessel??
Thanks again for the info

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by bluesailorp

Hello Dockhead...
Thanks for the reply to my post, I understand I do have to pay VAT if still go ahead with my plan second part of my question it's about when VAT apply in this case (used boat) that apply's to the price I pay for it or will be on price tag when she was a new vessel??
Thanks again for the info

"In respect of yachts imported from outside to within the EU, VAT should be paid at the time and place of import. It is assessed on the value of the yacht at the time of import. Customs will not necessarily rely on the value stated on the invoice or contract, they may seek valuations from brokers if they consider there has been an under-valuation."

https://www.keystonelaw.com/keynotes...ers-and-owners

[bluesailorp]

And... yes salt not only run in my blood also my soul fills happy when I'm at sea!!!!!!!!!

[bluesailorp]

Very interesting the fact value stated on bill of sale may not be considered for tax purpose, almost a sword with two edge..........
Will check Keystonelaw .com
Thanks.....

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by bluesailorp

Very interesting the fact value stated on bill of sale may not be considered for tax purpose, almost a sword with two edge..........
Will check Keystonelaw .com
Thanks.....

What that means is that the tax is due on the VALUE of the boat at the time of importation. The VALUE of the boat may or may not correspond with the PRICE paid according to the bill of sale. If the authorities feel that the PRICE is lower than the VALUE, then they may use other means to determine the value for purposes of calculating the tax.


Is that more clear?


In practice it means that if I show up in a 3 year old Swan 60 with a bill of sale showing that I paid $100 000 for it, they will find other ways to calculate the tax, than the bill of sale.

[bluesailorp]

I think I got it:
Also I understanding in my case doesn't make any difference if VAT is paid or not, since the boat owner is EU citizen but the boat is sold in the Caribbean and will change ownership out side EU always I have to pay tax !!! Am I correct or still or still confused???

[goeasy123]

In a sense the VAT is not a transaction tax on the sale of a good. It's a license to use it EU waters. Paying VAT infers Union Goods Status on a boat meaning it can stay indefinitely in and travel freely between EU states.



You need to carry the VAT paid invoice on the boat.


The country of registration is independent of VAT status.



The EU has a 'blue book' that cites the value of new and used boats for VAT purposes.


Some boats are not in the book and can't be VAT paid 'cause they haven't passed EU regulatory compliance. Make sure you buy a boat that's in the book.



Each country can determine it's own VAT percentage. So pick an import location with the lowest rate.


If a boat does not have UGS is can stay is EU water for (I think, but check) 90 days. But all you need to do is sail in and out of EU waters to renew the period. There are exceptions to this, e.g. if the boat is on the hard for a longer period.... and there's the issue of EU citizens not being allowed to do this, but there are ways around it.



Do not buy a UK VAT paid boat unless you know what you're doing.... Brexit!



DON'T TAKE WHAT I OR ANYONE ELSE SAYS AS GOSPEL, INCLUDING LEGAL COMPANY WEBSITES. There's is a lot of misinformation. Go directly to the European Commission's website. All the info you need is there, if it's a little difficult to find.


... and then just buy a VAT paid boat in Europe.

[Axel_G]

I think there is an exemption of that if you import the boat to Europa as household good when moving to Europe.



For that the boat must be in your possession for some time (12 months? ) before moving to Europe, you must have hat your place of residence outside of Europe for this time period, the boat must be in your possession for at least 12 month after moving to Europe and you must have your place of residence in Europe for 12 months. And maybe some other stuff, I would believe having a german flag might be an issue.



But you still need to make sure it is CE approved.



Axel

[bellasailor]

Originally Posted by Andy Todd

If a boat does not have UGS is can stay is EU water for (I think, but check) 90 days. But all you need to do is sail in and out of EU waters to renew the period. There are exceptions to this, e.g. if the boat is on the hard for a longer period.... and there's the issue of EU citizens not being allowed to do this, but there are ways around it.

It's 18 months Checking out and sailing into international waters should do it, but without checking in to another country could be hard to prove. Worth knowing whether ports of entry will expect proof of where you were or not, ie if you merely went 12NM+ offshore (many can opine on their experiences with various authorities)

[goeasy123]

Originally Posted by Axel_G

I think there is an exemption of that if you import the boat to Europa as household good when moving to Europe.



For that the boat must be in your possession for some time (12 months? ) before moving to Europe, you must have hat your place of residence outside of Europe for this time period, the boat must be in your possession for at least 12 month after moving to Europe and you must have your place of residence in Europe for 12 months. And maybe some other stuff, I would believe having a german flag might be an issue.



But you still need to make sure it is CE approved.



Axel

..but I think that means it's a 'household good' and not a boat. I.e. you can have a boat, but you can't sail it.


BTW... there's also import duty as well as VAT. Make sure you work that one out.

[nauticalnomad]

Buy a pre 1983 ( I think the year is).. Boat..
It will be VAT exempt. It will be stronger, cheaper and then spend money on it to get it upto scratch to a new boat.. Refit it..

[Axel_G]

Originally Posted by Andy Todd

..but I think that means it's a 'household good' and not a boat. I.e. you can have a boat, but you can't sail it.


BTW... there's also import duty as well as VAT. Make sure you work that one out.

Looking at the German Customs Website it seems a leisure boat (explicitely listed) that belongs to the household is regarded as a household good and there is no payment on import duty or VAT required under the conditions I listed.



Not really sure how that works in detail, but may be worth looking at.