Caribbean to South Africa

[atoll]

Originally Posted by boatman61

It could actually be a really nice trip... straight to the Azores... 15-20 days then Madiera... 4 days... followed by Canaries 5-6days.... down to Cape Verde and across... if you were going in June...
Do the Islands..

+1 the trick is to follow the seasonal weather patterns,not to be in a hurry,and you can sail all the way with eased sheets at hull speed.

you need to be aware of the seasonal "gateways" ie
leave turks in june,,leave the azores/madeira before august,follow the african coast closely to avoid forming hurricanes aug sept,leave cape verdes/west africa in october,aim to be off the cape mid summer,dec jan.

[Bluewaters2812]

Originally Posted by boatman61

It could actually be a really nice trip... straight to the Azores... 15-20 days then Madiera... 4 days... followed by Canaries 5-6days.... down to Cape Verde and across... if you were going in June...
Do the Islands..

I think I agree my friend, sadly I don't have that amount of time this year.

I am caught by an early September departure ... now where's my wand so I can stop father time?

[Bluewaters2812]

Originally Posted by atoll

the attempt from st martin was in may- july,and he(solo) arrived back 60 days later with 20liters of water ,one onion and a bag of rice!,unable to get further east than mid way down the ne coast of brazil in a 35 ft boat that sailed reasonably well to windward,but carrying very little fuel.

the other couple we met in fortaleza brazil,in november on their way to rio,got as far as recife before deciding that downwind sailing was the better option,turned around and we later met them again in panama in april,on their way to the s pac!

turks to cape verdes the best is to ride the gulf stream,and azores high in june-october,jumping off from the cape verdes in nov

Heck, he still had food left fit for a king and could have circumnavigated with that hehe

I'm going to study the charts, I suspect he made the attempt in an even tougher time of year? I haven't had time yet to do the calculations but I have two "constraints" that will add to the challenge: 1 is my departure timing of early September: 2 is my arrival timing of 15 - 20 December. I won't bore you with why these are real constraints for me.

[Bluewaters2812]

Originally Posted by atoll

+1 the trick is to follow the seasonal weather patterns,not to be in a hurry,and you can sail all the way with eased sheets at hull speed.

you need to be aware of the seasonal "gateways" ie
leave turks in june,,leave the azores/madeira before august,follow the african coast closely to avoid forming hurricanes aug sept,leave cape verdes/west africa in october,aim to be off the cape mid summer,dec jan.

I couldn't agree with you more. My timing constraints I posted in response to your other post is my problem. Now turning attention to following the African coast, is it doable to head South all the way doing that and, is it safe? The Benguela is not as strong as the Agulhas I know. Would the prevailing trades make this attempt nigh impossible? Maybe I am misunderstanding what appears to be good advice? This thicket needs help here lol.

[atoll]

Originally Posted by Bluewaters2812

I couldn't agree with you more. My timing constraints I posted in response to your other post is my problem. Now turning attention to following the African coast, is it doable to head South all the way doing that and, is it safe? The Benguela is not as strong as the Agulhas I know. Would the prevailing trades make this attempt nigh impossible? Maybe I am misunderstanding what appears to be good advice? This thicket needs help here lol.

leaving from the uk in september it would be quite possable to get to cape town by december,....

(by following the african coast i meant as far as gambia or senegal,then heading south to about 33degrees south where you should find favourable winds to head to cape town.)

unless you can carry large amounts of fuel,and motorsail all the way i would not reccomend crossing the gulf of guinea to angola,and then south,though a jump off from angola would make you zig-zag much shorter.

leaving the turks in sept is a bit late to cross to canary islands,but doable,then heading south to ct,9000 miles in total,about 70-80 days sailing,possable to arrive by dec,but would be a gruelling first trip! with only brief stops

very little wind,vary variable in the gulf,and lots of opperunistic fishermen if you stay inshore across the gulf!

their are now a few sa catamarans that charter out of luanda,and senagal-gambia are considered relatively safe.

if the boat is in the turks,your best bet would be to cross over to europe first in sept,leave the boat in morocco or canary islands then head south the following year,aiming to be in ct around dec-jan

[salticrak]

This here is gold.

[atoll]

Originally Posted by salticrak

This here is gold.

i might add! this year it is predicted to be a very active hurricane season with lots of named storms,so a late departure from the turks might be a no no!

if it was me i would spend the time sept to dec getting the boat ready for the following year,enjoying the nice weather in t+c and bahamas,then be ready the following april-may for a 9000mile cruise over 7-8 months with stops horta,madiera,canary is,gambia ,(south brazil),ct,pe

[foolishsailor]

Originally Posted by atoll

i might add! this year it is predicted to be a very active hurricane season with lots of named storms,so a late departure from the turks might be a no no!

if it was me i would spend the time sept to dec getting the boat ready for the following year,enjoying the nice weather in t+c and bahamas,then be ready the following april-may for a 9000mile cruise over 7-8 months with stops horta,madiera,canary is,gambia ,(south brazil),ct,pe

+1

The OP is talking about time constraints and being forced to leave at an unfavourable time of year. This is a recipe for trouble.

We sailed the opposite direction from Cape Town to trinidad via st. Helen, Bahi de Ilha Grande, Rio, etc. and up the coast to Trinidad about two years ago. Would in no way recommend sailing against the current. We took the ideal time to sail against the southerly current from Rio around Cabo Frio and up to Receife and it was less than pleasant. Many boats turn back after several attempts to round Cabo Frio. Once you get near Recife the current splits and heads north - you would be fighting this all the way. We showed upto 2.75 kits of current at times and it extends well offshore.

The joke about how to get to Rio from the Caribbean is: Sail east till you get to Africa and then take a right. It's not far off.

The sail you are proposing would be a great trip, but not for someone in a hurry. For example, if you are going to head south along the coast of Africa you are going to want to look for weather windows. There are several areas where you can get hammered other wise, think coastal Nambia and southerly busters on last couple days approach to Cape Town for instance.

[Bluewaters2812]

Originally Posted by atoll

leaving from the uk in september it would be quite possable to get to cape town by december,....

(by following the african coast i meant as far as gambia or senegal,then heading south to about 33degrees south where you should find favourable winds to head to cape town.)

unless you can carry large amounts of fuel,and motorsail all the way i would not reccomend crossing the gulf of guinea to angola,and then south,though a jump off from angola would make you zig-zag much shorter.

leaving the turks in sept is a bit late to cross to canary islands,but doable,then heading south to ct,9000 miles in total,about 70-80 days sailing,possable to arrive by dec,but would be a gruelling first trip! with only brief stops

very little wind,vary variable in the gulf,and lots of opperunistic fishermen if you stay inshore across the gulf!

their are now a few sa catamarans that charter out of luanda,and senagal-gambia are considered relatively safe.

if the boat is in the turks,your best bet would be to cross over to europe first in sept,leave the boat in morocco or canary islands then head south the following year,aiming to be in ct around dec-jan

Thanks Atoll. I am taking it all on board, much appreciated input. I am figuring somewhere between 80-92 days was what I had calculated from Turks to Port Elizabeth (Probably closer to 92 days).

[Bluewaters2812]

Originally Posted by atoll

i might add! this year it is predicted to be a very active hurricane season with lots of named storms,so a late departure from the turks might be a no no!

if it was me i would spend the time sept to dec getting the boat ready for the following year,enjoying the nice weather in t+c and bahamas,then be ready the following april-may for a 9000mile cruise over 7-8 months with stops horta,madiera,canary is,gambia ,(south brazil),ct,pe

Yes, I do understand the reasons for what you are saying here. Our long term plans (haha), are somewhat different though. I will put this thought on the burner and chew over it. We have good reasons for wanting to be in SA with the yacht this year end (not business reasons lol).

[Bluewaters2812]

Originally Posted by foolishsailor

+1

The OP is talking about time constraints and being forced to leave at an unfavourable time of year. This is a recipe for trouble.

We sailed the opposite direction from Cape Town to trinidad via st. Helen, Bahi de Ilha Grande, Rio, etc. and up the coast to Trinidad about two years ago. Would in no way recommend sailing against the current. We took the ideal time to sail against the southerly current from Rio around Cabo Frio and up to Receife and it was less than pleasant. Many boats turn back after several attempts to round Cabo Frio. Once you get near Recife the current splits and heads north - you would be fighting this all the way. We showed upto 2.75 kits of current at times and it extends well offshore.

The joke about how to get to Rio from the Caribbean is: Sail east till you get to Africa and then take a right. It's not far off.

The sail you are proposing would be a great trip, but not for someone in a hurry. For example, if you are going to head south along the coast of Africa you are going to want to look for weather windows. There are several areas where you can get hammered other wise, think coastal Nambia and southerly busters on last couple days approach to Cape Town for instance.

All taken on board thanks. Just when is the "favourable" time of year to do this route then?

[Bluewaters2812]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Cross the Atlantic 3 times: first to the Azores, then follow the coast south a bit (Cape Verde's) then cross to Recife, Brazil, then follow the coast south again and then cross to SA.

nice trip

Thanks, this is looking like a definite option, except I would prefer to go direct to the Cape Verde. What do you think?

[boatman61]

Well Sept is gonna put you smack in the middle of the hurricane season... depending on which way they track this year is going to be the deciding factor.
I still feel a run towards the Azores is best... head NE to get out of the Alley... and across the stream ASAP... you should start hitting N'lys around 25N which will allow you to swing more E... then you can decide whether to carry on to the Azores or do a non-stop curve to Madiera or the Canaries possibly even the Verdes with the spin-offs from systems... then on to the SA...
Be kinder on both you and the boat... the other way is pretty tough on a untried boat.
Not touting for work (BVImatelot is closer)... but if she's bought and paid for why not get her delivered... even just to the Azores or Canaries would take the load off and get her out of Hurricane Alley...

[Bluewaters2812]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Well Sept is gonna put you smack in the middle of the hurricane season... depending on which way they track this year is going to be the deciding factor.
I still feel a run towards the Azores is best... head NE to get out of the Alley... and across the stream ASAP... you should start hitting N'lys around 25N which will allow you to swing more E... then you can decide whether to carry on to the Azores or do a non-stop curve to Madiera or the Canaries possibly even the Verdes with the spin-offs from systems... then on to the SA...
Be kinder on both you and the boat... the other way is pretty tough on a untried boat.
Not touting for work (BVImatelot is closer)... but if she's bought and paid for why not get her delivered... even just to the Azores or Canaries would take the load off and get her out of Hurricane Alley...

Haha, tks mate, you read my mind on your opening paragraphs, exactly what was brewing in my mind. Now, your last paragraph ... if I got someone to deliver I would ask you first, how's that? Problem is, I don't want to miss out on the fun and adventure lol. Also, we will be living aboard from early August so the Admiral and I would have nowhere to go (I suppose we could be allowed a little tent and air mattress in the tender dragged behind with occasional biscuits and water passed to us by the delivery skipper),

Jokes aside, I really appreciate the input here. I do prefer the "easier on the boat" (and on us, option). I reckon the wisdom here is telling me to: from Martinique head to Turks as soon as we can mid August, dodging Hurricanes lol (Martinique hasn't experienced a Hurricane in donkey's years so she might be cruisin' for a bruisin' this year, hope not).

Then, early Sept head towards the Azores and depending on how we make way, once we pick up favourable Northerlies, arc East to South East and head for Cape Verde. Restock/regroup/revitalise in Verde and then head South to somewhere along the Gambia/Guinea Bissau latitude, then turn SSW in the direction of Recife, Brazil hopefully using the prevailing trades reaching across our port beam?

Basically the plan would be to split the voyage into 3 phases. 1= Northerly Atlantic crossing (Turks to Verde). 2= SSW crossing from Verde to Brazil. 3= Work South to about 33-35deg S, turn for Cape Town and up the coast to Port Elizabeth. I'm reckoning 85-92 days. What yer tink friends?

You folks think it would be a good trip? I'm saying 85-92 days

[boatman61]

Well... its a plan and allows for a bit of R&R... I figured on 65days W Palm Beach to Cape Town non-stop last year...
Shame it never happened... mind... I did have fun but really fancied the 'Clipper Run' to Perth..