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Old 19-12-2017, 00:04   #16
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

It's actually even a little sadder. The lady I have onboard at the moment knew this chap, said he was just a wonderful older gentleman. Unfortunately is wife was killed by the boom on their previous yacht three years ago. Now this, the poor family.
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Old 19-12-2017, 01:36   #17
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Originally Posted by kmacdonald View Post
More support to leave the life raft at home. Maybe even the ring buoy.

I guess if you need that false sense of security, go for it. I have confidence in the boats I have.
Kim, if you ever decide to sell one of your boats-let me know! I've never yet encountered one immune from mishaps. If you've got some that can't sink or burn, you need to patent them and start selling those puppies!

If you could scale it up, you could REALLY make a fortune. Imagine all the ships of the world spending all that money on their false sense of security! Nobody would need lifeboats/rafts, anywhere.

Seriously, though. Do you really think that safety equipment is just a false sense of security? I've never met a mariner who feels that way, and it's my profession. Most of us like to have a chance of making it home if the main platform is lost, for whatever reason.
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Old 19-12-2017, 02:31   #18
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

So sad to learn this. Johnny was always friendly and a true gentleman whom I had the privilege to know for a short time. My sincere condolences to the family and friends.
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Old 19-12-2017, 06:42   #19
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Originally Posted by TJ D View Post
Kim, if you ever decide to sell one of your boats-let me know! I've never yet encountered one immune from mishaps. If you've got some that can't sink or burn, you need to patent them and start selling those puppies!

If you could scale it up, you could REALLY make a fortune. Imagine all the ships of the world spending all that money on their false sense of security! Nobody would need lifeboats/rafts, anywhere.

Seriously, though. Do you really think that safety equipment is just a false sense of security? I've never met a mariner who feels that way, and it's my profession. Most of us like to have a chance of making it home if the main platform is lost, for whatever reason.
Hi TJ,

Actually it isn't unheard of for serious, experienced cruisers to eschew a life raft, for several reasons.

The most common is the idea that on some level, even subconsciously, it makes one less diligent in insuring the integrity of the boat.

Another reason is that some cruisers prefer not to cause others to risk their lives in a rescue of someone that chose to go cruising for the fun and adventure of it. This however usually applies more to the use of an EPIRB than exclusively a life raft.
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Old 19-12-2017, 08:39   #20
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Originally Posted by TJ D View Post
Kim, if you ever decide to sell one of your boats-let me know! I've never yet encountered one immune from mishaps. If you've got some that can't sink or burn, you need to patent them and start selling those puppies!

If you could scale it up, you could REALLY make a fortune. Imagine all the ships of the world spending all that money on their false sense of security! Nobody would need lifeboats/rafts, anywhere.

Seriously, though. Do you really think that safety equipment is just a false sense of security? I've never met a mariner who feels that way, and it's my profession. Most of us like to have a chance of making it home if the main platform is lost, for whatever reason.
I carry what I consider reasonable safety equipment. I've never attended a SAS seminar and never will though. I've never felt the bogey man is lurking over the next wave.
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Old 19-12-2017, 10:16   #21
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Hi TJ,

Actually it isn't unheard of for serious, experienced cruisers to eschew a life raft, for several reasons.

The most common is the idea that on some level, even subconsciously, it makes one less diligent in insuring the integrity of the boat.

Another reason is that some cruisers prefer not to cause others to risk their lives in a rescue of someone that chose to go cruising for the fun and adventure of it. This however usually applies more to the use of an EPIRB than exclusively a life raft.
I don't think it makes anyone less diligent about the integrity of their boat. No one wants to lose their boat. But it (along with an EPIRB) might make people more willing to take voyages they might otherwise avoid out of caution.

As an example, there is no way I would have crossed the Caribbean non-stop from Key West to Cartagena without a life raft and EPIRB on board. I might have done it by island-hopping and coastal sailing with just a dinghy, but I would not have done the straight shot. And I was worried about the integrity of the boat the whole way!
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Old 19-12-2017, 10:35   #22
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

It looks like 2 of the crew are alive, perhaps they will be interviewed and more light shall be shed on this story.

Is it not a requirement by insurance policy writers that boats carry safety gear?
Fully owned private boats may skirt some requirements, but I was always under the impression if the bank still owned the boat it was mandatory to carry certain safety gear?
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Old 19-12-2017, 11:06   #23
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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The most common is the idea that on some level, even subconsciously, it makes one less diligent in insuring the integrity of the boat.
I don't think this is true. To me, it is like saying that one is less likely to maintain his automobile's brakes if it has airbags.
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Old 19-12-2017, 11:28   #24
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Originally Posted by TJ D View Post
Kim, if you ever decide to sell one of your boats-let me know! I've never yet encountered one immune from mishaps. If you've got some that can't sink or burn, you need to patent them and start selling those puppies!

If you could scale it up, you could REALLY make a fortune. Imagine all the ships of the world spending all that money on their false sense of security! Nobody would need lifeboats/rafts, anywhere.
..
Regarding safety, security an sales things are not easy to understand. Etap produced unsinkable boats, mostly small ones and the last ones where even well designed nice boats.

A bigger offshore unthinkable boat seems to make even more sense and therefore would attract a bigger market than a coastal one, so they made a nice well designed one (it still looks nice), not even very expensive...and they bankrupted on that boat.

The Etap 46DS was a true Deck saloon and in what regards shape it looked a bit like the Jeanneau 50DS but had a nicer interior.
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Old 19-12-2017, 11:57   #25
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

there aren't many worse ways to die than how this gent died....maybe fire....eekkss. Will await more information. But Boatman has it right...and I never heard it before..."Step up into the dingy/liferaft as the main boat is going under."

Safety gear...if the cruiser was still afloat...but they abandoned...and that is one heck of a nice boat....why was the life raft not deployed? It is almost like they got totally freaked out and just jumped off the boat...

The other two guys survived so it will only be a matter of time before the story comes out.
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Old 19-12-2017, 12:43   #26
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

My question is whay were the philipiens left to do the search and rescue when every 2 dollar reffo that jumps on a boat heading for Australia gets the best treatment from the Australian SAR <<<<<

this really rattles my cell door ,,!

Rest In Peace , sailer ,
very sad day ,
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Old 19-12-2017, 13:34   #27
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Originally Posted by Robert Tilbury View Post
My question is whay were the philipiens left to do the search and rescue when every 2 dollar reffo that jumps on a boat heading for Australia gets the best treatment from the Australian SAR <<<<<

this really rattles my cell door ,,!

Rest In Peace , sailer ,
very sad day ,
Don't quite understand your point....Philippines is way outside Oz SAR logistical range to save lives.

Local Coast Guard is far too thin and underfunded to be relied on.

To put things in perspective...
..*In the Philippines, there were 3044 reported deaths due to drowning in 2010....and many more unreported.
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Old 19-12-2017, 14:15   #28
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Don't quite understand your point....Philippines is way outside Oz SAR logistical range to save lives.

Local Coast Guard is far too thin and underfunded to be relied on.

To put things in perspective...
..*In the Philippines, there were 3044 reported deaths due to drowning in 2010....and many more unreported.


Im not even going there ,,, alll i will get is " Raciest bla bla bla ,,,"
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Old 19-12-2017, 14:42   #29
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Im not even going there ,,, alll i will get is " Raciest bla bla bla ,,,"
For those of us (Expats), who live in the Philippines....
.... we thank you for not being here
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Old 19-12-2017, 14:49   #30
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Re: Australian yacht sinks near Philippines

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Im not even going there ,,, alll i will get is " Raciest bla bla bla ,,,"
Thats waaaaaay out of the range of Oz SAR isn't it? I don't even get your point. Whats a '2 dollar reffo'
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