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Old 30-03-2011, 11:16   #1
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42' Leopard - Do I Really Need a Double Halyard ?

I seem to have big problems with the double halyard on my Leopard 42 - ie the halyard comes down from the top of the mast, round a block on the mainsail head, and back up to the top of the mast where it is tied off.

I think what happens is that the block bangs against the top of the mast, or something, but whatever, the end result is that the block gets damaged.

In one case I was completely unable to lower the sail, and had to climb the mast to cut it down. The halyard had gone down the side of block, jammed between it and the sheave. Wasn't a bid deal in the gentle 10knots at anchor, but could have been a big problem at see with a storm brewing.

In any case that is now two expensive blocks destroyed, and two trips to the top of the mast to fix it.

So, do I really need that extra purchase, or can I just tie off the halyard at the main head and use a single line?

I am using 12mm dyneema for the halyard. I can cope with the mechanics of hoisting, just asking about strength of rope really. Or any other issues?

Love to hear your experiences!

Noel
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Old 30-03-2011, 11:38   #2
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

You should be able to lift the entire boat with 12MM Dyneema. Switching back to a single part halyard should not be a problem. 12MM can handle the load.
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Old 30-03-2011, 12:27   #3
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

The halyard can handle the load, but it will require much more effort to raise the sail. The two-part tackle is there in order to gain mechanical advantage - the same reason that multi-part tackles are used on mainsheets. You could experiment quite easily, although it strikes me that the problem is with either the block, or the way it is mounted.

The cheeks should not separate so as to allow the halyard to become caught. It could be that the block is insufficient for the loads generated by the halyard winch. I would buy a block that is rated for a much higher load; I would also check to make sure that the sail runs freely up and down the track. Especially if you have an electric halyard winch, if something jams it would be very easy for too much force to be applied in an effort to overcome the resistance.

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Old 30-03-2011, 12:54   #4
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

Lots of Leopards out there-what do other owners say. I had this system on a boat once, and never had a problem.
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Old 30-03-2011, 13:06   #5
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

we've got two parts on the SF44. I guess the question is do you want to lift twice the weight that you do now? It's probably around 120-140lb main or so.
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Old 30-03-2011, 13:08   #6
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

I must be missing the point...this is an external main halyard with a block at the mainsail head?

Sure, you get mechanical advantage, but where's the halyard winch?

Isn't it possible to flip this setup and put the block on the mast with a shackle at the head of the main?

Is there a reason for the absence of a sheave box?
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Old 30-03-2011, 13:41   #7
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

Thanks guys,

I'll just leave it single part then, seems a lot easier!

Alchemy - it is the block on the mainsail head that got jammed. Halyard goes from winch, up the mast down to mainsail head and back to top of mast.
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Old 30-03-2011, 19:06   #8
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

Ah, OK, thanks for the clarification. Maybe trade up to a bigger winch to lose that troublesome block?
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Old 30-03-2011, 19:31   #9
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

Seems there was a thread not too long ago about mainsail halyards and the various setup people had. Lots of discussion and examples as well as I remember. You might do a search for it. Could have an answer for you.
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Old 01-04-2011, 07:27   #10
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

I've got the same setup on my 7 year old FP 43'. Never had a problem and using the original block (Lewmar Ocean Series, I think a #2).

I'm wondering if you are driving the block into the top of the mast? I have about 18 inches between the head of the sail and the top of the mast, plenty of room for the block to sit there freely without touching anything.

Or, as others have surmised, the block you are using is just too light, try a heavier duty one.

I grimace at the thought of eliminating the purchase, I like to pull my sail up by hand until it gets too heavy (~ 3/4 of the way) before using a winch. I'm sure I couldn't do that on a single line.
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Old 01-04-2011, 07:33   #11
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

How about keeing the 2:1 but replacing the block with a wichard MX 2:1 halyard shackle.
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Old 01-04-2011, 12:45   #12
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

Tried it a couple of times now without the extra purchase. Can't pull it up manually as far as before, of course, but on the other hand the winching the rest of the way goes much faster now. And also the first bit, when I have to squeeze it between the lazy jacks at just the right time goes quicker too. So I think I will leave it with the single purchase for now, and see what happens.

Yes, DotDun, I think that is what was happening - jamming up against the top of the mast and getting beaten out of shape.

The wichard MX 2:1 halyard shackle looks interesting. Not heard of that before. I might try that if I get tired of the lack of purchase. Though I wonder how much friction there would be in that system.

The other thing I noticed with the 2:1 was how easy it was to get twists into the halyard - and then how hard it is to get them out again. Again, should be less of an issue without that extra purchase, so we'll see how it goes. :-)
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Old 01-04-2011, 12:53   #13
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LifePart2 View Post
The wichard MX 2:1 halyard shackle looks interesting.
If you can handle the single halyard, then simplier is usually better.

The cats meow in 2:1 halyard hardware is the antal halyard shackle even nicer than the wichard but more $$. Both will prevent halyard twisting.
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Old 01-04-2011, 15:33   #14
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

You only get the twist if the block is not fitted to the head the way it should be. There should be no swivel.

You need the block for the mechanical advantage. It is a big mainsail with heavy battens.

I would stick with double just fix the block properly.

b.
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Old 01-04-2011, 17:34   #15
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Re: 42' Leopard - do I really need a double halyard?

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
If you can handle the single halyard, then simplier is usually better.

The cats meow in 2:1 halyard hardware is the antal halyard shackle even nicer than the wichard but more $$. Both will prevent halyard twisting.
I have a headboard with cheeks for a sheave built in. Originally I used a plain composite bushing on it and it was okay. But putting in roller sheave made a very noticeable difference both in ease of hosting and the amount of tension I could get. If going 1:1 I'd want to have a very powerful cunningham set-up. There should not be any swivels in the system at all.

Tom.
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