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Old 30-08-2014, 02:33   #16
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

Anyone actually know how many OS boats check into OZ annually?
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Old 30-08-2014, 02:54   #17
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

$380 isn't so bad in my opinion. 4 crew x $40 x 2 hrs + fuel, close enough to actual cost to do it. A lot of other countries don't do quarantine inspections so no fees, but I can tell you it cost more for a cruising permit in Croatia or Greece than $380.
Btw that's about 350USD or 270EUR
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Old 30-08-2014, 05:22   #18
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

$380 is just the Quarantine fee.

How much are the other fees?

It is crazy!

Thats more than the Suez transit including bribes.

I pity the cruisers who take cats and dogs.
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Old 30-08-2014, 12:08   #19
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

Living in CA, I'm hyper sensitive to gov't wasting money and simply finding new ways to steal it out of our pockets. When I first registered my truck in 2002, the reg. fees were based on the purchase price of the vehicle. After a while, they figured out they could charge more for trucks by weight, so now 12 yrs later, the reg. for that truck is still $750. Then add in a fishing permit, plus a fee to actually fish in a lake or stream, plus offroad tags for my toys, plus (illegal) recreational fees of $150/season to recreate on public lands, plus gas taxes, now they're talking about hiway fees per mile, in addition to using tax dollars to build toll roads!! That's over and above sales tax, income tax, property taxes, all ridiculously high. You guys would have a heart attack if I showed you my water and electricity bills.

That's part of why I'm interested in cruising and living aboard, to escape some of the ridiculous theft of money I've earned, but everyone else gets to share because they're lazy.

But hell, they might as well charge fees to enter every port based on OAL, size of water tanks, size of fuel tanks, number of engines, size of sails, number of people on board, number of pets, mandatory screening for STDs at $500 per, mandatory screening for colon cancer, blood tests for HIV and of course a 4 week quarantine to prevent the spread of Ebola.


"That will be $14,345 per night for a mooring ball. Will that be cash or charge?" Maybe not today, but soon.

Some of my fondest sayings...

"There is no paradise that one man can find that others won't destroy out of greed or stupidity."

"The key to gov't expansion is the ability to find new words for "tax." Surcharge, fee, permit, assessment, fine, and now the newest one "The Lottery", which is simply a tax on the mathematically challenged."

"There is no processor invented that will not be brought to it's knees within 6 months by the newest bloated operating system."
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Old 30-08-2014, 12:29   #20
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

Quote:
Originally Posted by Catalpa1 View Post
The standard of "enjoyable" living is becoming more and more for the rich only. A lot of my friends have families, are paying off mortgages and between this and the cost of living going up a lot faster than wage growth are really struggling to make ends meet. And I'm talking about guys in well paid occupations too.

I think the most ridiculous thing about the charges is that they double it outside of "normal" working hours.

Not everyone plans their passage to enter Australia between M-F 8am to 4pm.


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

So anchor somewhere quiet when you arrive and don't pick up the VHF until 8.01 am when you ask for directions to the local customs buoy.

The people to feel sorry for are those who must pay for a visit from the sniffer dog and the dog finds nothing . . . . . no refund though.
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Old 30-08-2014, 13:15   #21
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

I love Australia although I've only been there on business. I admit to being shocked when flying in at the spraying on the airplane. I'd never been sprayed before. But then I understood. When you're an island and there are so many things that you haven't had exposure to and have no natural protection then you do have to be extra cautious. If it takes something extra and costs incoming boaters or aircraft more, then to me it's worth it to protect their environment.

I look at the steps the US took a few years ago against beef from Canada because of mad cow disease. I look at the history of smallpox and vaccines and now that it doesn't naturally occur, the US still keeps enough vaccine on hand to vaccinate every person in the country.

I respect Australia's efforts to protect their country. I realize all charges can lead people to avoid stopping there. But Australia citizens have to decide to we want to supplement the costs of inspection. Closer to the US people constantly complain about the entry fee for the Bahamas. For a boat over 30 feet it is now $300. And it has nothing to do with inspection but is strictly for revenue. Plus each person over 3 pays $25 additional to exit. I'm sure some have chosen not to go, but most haven't been deterred.

When I go to a country I'm doing two things. First, I'm contributing to their economy. Second, I'm utilizing their services. Sometimes as boaters we contribute more than we use, but other times less. Even if it's invisible, I'm using their police and fire services, I'm using their walkways or parks or highways. I'm using their Coast Guard. Residents are paying taxes so I can do that.

When is a tax or fee too much? That's an individual choice. It's just like the choice of where we live. Someone mentioned California. Beautiful state I look forward to visiting soon. But living there as I do in Florida would more than double my costs. I live in a state with no personal income tax and no property tax on boats.

Interesting topic. All the fees are. They add up. We each have to decide which are worth it to us.
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Old 30-08-2014, 13:24   #22
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

From what I understand, Australia has more poisonous and dangerous animals than anywhere else on earth. What exactly are they afraid will be transported in that's worse than what they already have?

Yacht owners?
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Old 30-08-2014, 13:57   #23
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirage Gecko View Post
Is $380 really a lot of money in the total $ scheme of sailing a fully equipped yacht to Australia from another country?Maybe it is compared to some other countries but like most things in this great land our expected standard of enjoyable living comes at a price.Certainly not defending the Govt here and probably a bit inciteful but why should it be free or lower?If you actually did a full costing on the excercise and had to pay the real cost it would most likely be higher.
I know tourism is suffering a bit at the moment but as for lower costs to promote tourism from visiting yachties well just how many potential overseas cruisers do we really miss per year because of the sub $400 fees.
Chris
Yes!!! It's a lot of money. Checking into Mexico is $50 for a 10 year permit. You can't justify paying to live in a nice country. In the US boat inspections are free from the USCG. The San Doego also inspected my boat...no charge. They also wanted to know if my vessel was safe and not carrying anything that could blow up, dump waste in the water or something that might slither off the boat. It's free because the citizens of the country pay taxes. The same is true in Aus and NZ. Peoples taxes pay for Gov. workers to carry out their duties.

Quote:
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If you complain about an extra $50 for all the time that you are here it's unlikely that you are going to put a lot of money into the economy perhaps.
Coops.
That has not been the case in the past. All cruisers spend money there. They have to unless the country is now giving everything away for free. It's not about the $50 extra. It's about the $380. being a ridiculous amount.
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Old 30-08-2014, 14:31   #24
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

Many threads will contain the comment that yachts are a small part of the overall customs/immigration flow. Here are some figures on the volume of shipping entering Australia. Private yachts seem to be roughly 2% or less of all vessels.


.........................2011-12......... 2012-13

Below 25m loa.......188............... 207

Above 25m loa.... 14,165...........9,672
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Old 30-08-2014, 14:49   #25
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

Do you have any figures from before they charged for quarantine? Perhaps there was a big drop in yacht visits as a result of them charging for it.

As beautiful as Australia is, and as fond as we are of the people, 207 yachts per yr seems like a pretty low number, enough to make me wonder why people are staying away if I were working for the tourism board.

That's also a disturbing drop in >25M LOA from 2011-12 to 2012-13. I wonder if they raised the tariffs on some imported goods as well.
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Old 30-08-2014, 14:49   #26
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

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Originally Posted by socaldmax View Post
From what I understand, Australia has more poisonous and dangerous animals than anywhere else on earth. What exactly are they afraid will be transported in that's worse than what they already have?
Yacht owners?
Yacht owners carrying insects that they don't have natural enemies for. Termites. Rabies.

Just because you have some danger already doesn't mean you want more.
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Old 30-08-2014, 15:04   #27
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Re: Yet another fee hike in Oz

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Yacht owners carrying insects that they don't have natural enemies for. Termites. Rabies.

Just because you have some danger already doesn't mean you want more.
Hawaii has no indigenous snakes, virtually no poisonous animals. They have even more reason to want to prevent the invasion of foreign species. I don't recall hearing of any quarantine fees for cruisers, although there is one for those bringing dogs in as permanent residents.

Here are the fees for Hawaii from Noonsite:

Fees
Overtime is charged outside of working hours, and on Sundays and public holidays. Service will be provided at pro-rata overtime rates, not to exceed US $25 per boat.

Customs charges: A user fee of US$25 covers the annual processing. A decal will be issued for this fee and must be displayed in a prominent position.

Cruising Licence fee, US$19.

An additional $2 per person per day live-aboard charges for cruising vessels is added onto anchoring, mooring or dock charges.


That all seems pretty reasonable to me. A family of four could stay in HI for a month and the total gov't fees appear to total $284.

A couple would only get charged $164 for a month, and I've heard people complain that HI is an overpriced tourist trap.
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Old 30-08-2014, 15:09   #28
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Re: Yet Another Fee Hike in Oz

Just a note here, the Australian Quarantine fees also apply for Australian owned yachts returning from a trip offshore. It is not only "rich foreigners" who have to pay. Local offshore cruisers are not too happy about this. It is not that the AQIS fee is a large portion of one's total cruising costs, it is that it is way higher than New Caledonia and NZ, and that the reason for it appears to be funding for empire building.

Ann

on edit.... Just saw the fees for Hawaii. Used to be no charge. Have checked in in Hilo once. Actually, quite a pleasant experience, as such things go. Long before 9/11 though.
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Old 30-08-2014, 15:25   #29
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Re: Yet Another Fee Hike in Oz

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Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
Just a note here, these fees also apply for Australian owned yachts returning from a trip offshore. It is not only "rich foreigners" who have to pay. Local offshore cruisers are not too happy about this. It is not that the AQIS fee is a large portion of one's total cruising costs, it is that it is way higher than New Caledonia and NZ, and that the reason for it appears to be funding for empire building.

Ann
Do these Australian yachts have to pull into a foreign port on their trip in order to get the shakedown, or just leave port for X number of days?


Some days I think the Mafia would be better than big gov't. They wouldn't intrude in your private life so much, the total "taxes" per month would be lower, and the infrastructure would be much better. Not to mention the protection is better...

when was the last time you saw a crime family putting up red light cameras??

Just look how well they're already handling the trash removal and recycling business. Another organized crash/theft of taxpayer's money on Wall St like what AIG, Lehman Bros. and Goldman Sachs pulled off in 2008? They wouldn't dare try it, they'd all be dead on their yachts in the Hamptons by the next morning. No TARP, just 2 slugs, one in the chest, one in the head. Think of the trillions taxpayers would save, not to mention the retirement funds that would not have been stolen

Sure, they're criminals, but they're the lesser of 2 evils. The current system we have the gov't is stealing us blind in collusion with Wall St. and the mafia is still in business, and costing us virtually nothing in comparison. I also think terrorists would respect/fear them a LOT more than the current regime.
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Old 30-08-2014, 15:38   #30
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Re: Yet Another Fee Hike in Oz

Just imagine, you feel you got ripped off by the local marina. What recourse do you have? Go to court and get ripped off by an attorney and if you're lucky, recover 1/2 of what you got ripped for?


Or, go see Luigi and present your case, along with a copy of the bill. A couple of hours later, the marina owner is standing next to your boat, with 2 big Sicilian guys and he's got a freshly broken finger, a refund, a VERY sincere apology and a promise to never do that again.

Remember how many times the LAPD got called to OJ's house for a domestic disturbance, only to leave with an autographed pic of OJ until finally, she was dead. They then proceeded to mishandle the evidence and lose the case.

Well, things would be different with the mafia in charge. One call about a domestic disturbance, and OJ would be nursing a broken hand and missing a couple of prized momentos. He'd never do it again, she'd be alive today and we wouldn't have this ridiculous "the nearest male goes to jail" policy every time someone calls 911.
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