Risk of not checking in, new country / island

[sailpooka]

It is always a good idea to clear into and, if needed, clear out of any country you visit. I was recently a part of a delivery crew to Antigua. When we arrived, and checked into the Customs dock, it was discovered that when the boat we were on had not cleared out of the country on the previous visit. It cost the captain in the neighborhood of $2500 (US). Our passports were temporarily confiscated and some other inconveniences.
Follow the rules. It makes for a better experience for everyone cruising.

[Giro]

Sage advise from Mike O’Rielly. What possible reason would one have to try to smuggle oneself into a country without being noticed? I say play by the rules.

[belizesailor]

"Wild Bill" could tell you one reason!

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...73OyGl03zhX9FR


It did not work out well for him.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by BBViper

Just wondering what the risk would be of sailing to a new country, for example a Caribbean island, and not checking in with customs/immigration, etc. Of not paying fees, going through all the paperwork. Just sailing up to a remote part of an island, hanging on anchor or even going to shore for provisions or restaurant. If no official found out and you moved on to the next island, much of a risk? Certainly if yo were 'discovered' there could be fines and possible confiscation maybe but what is the likelihood of being discovered?

As others have said, it depends. One could argue "innocent passage" for a brief stop at anchor (maybe successfully, maybe not), but if discovered ashore you are in blatant violation and could suffer severe consequences. Some have more enforcement resources, some less. Some have more rigid attitudes, some lax. Some countries/officers you could bribe your way out, some not. It depends...roll the dice and lets us know how it works out.

What is it you percieve you gain by violating the laws of the host country?

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by Benz

It's wise to make every reasonable effort, and to have all your papers always in order, as much as it is in your power. I was checked twice by the Mexican navy one time as I cruised Mex. from Roatan, before ever I had a chance to access a check-in location. But my zarpe was in order, and they were reasonable about my being in transit to a check-in facility. I had similar experiences in El Salvador and Panama. No doubt you could blow off checking in and out with impunity over and over again, but the one time you get busted might not be worth all the freebies. Also, as Paul pointed out above, it's bad for the rest of us when cruisers disregard the local laws. We as a group need to maintain a reputation as good, kind, gentle, and respectful people.

Ive been spot checked here in the W Carib too...even when underway a couple of times. The USCG also sometimes patrols here and checks some vessels.

These checks were always professional and quick...likely would have been a much different experience with no papers.

[u4ea32]

We had trouble checking in to Tuvalu after leaving Honolulu without checking out with customs. Sure, the US does not care if you don't check out, but that leaves a gap in the paperwork that other countries don't like.

I have a close, very rich friend. He is frustrated, in that he is only worth a half billion dollars. Can you imagine only having a half billion? Explains a lot. He searches for adrenaline rushes to make up for this gnawing frustration. One game he plays and generally wins is the "Ignore those idiot customs people, or actively work around those losers."

We have done many trips where we often did not clear in or out. One trip from California to England, we checked in/out of Mexico and Panama, but not the other Central American countries, then Jamaica and Grenada (where we stayed for many months) but none of the other Caribbean countries, and we went to all of them. Bermuda and UK, yes. France, no.

On another trip from Florida to Antigua, we did not check out of the US, we did not check in or out in any of the countries from Florida to Antigua, and we anchored and went ashore in all of them: Bahamas, Puerto Rico, USVI, BVI, both St Martins, etc. All of them. Once we got to Antigua, there was the piper to pay, sorta. We were not allowed to leave the boat until the owner fixed the problem, which took about 36 hours. Some taxi, some time in front of a judge, some money. But afterwards, he said "Still took much less time, and much less money, than if we had checked in and out of all those countries over the past month."

Of course, you can lose your boat. My friend just enjoys the risk of possibly losing many millions of dollars of new and very fine yacht. It raises the risk to make the game interesting.

[sck5]

I would not hesitate to anchor for a night off an Eastern Caribbean island with the Q flag showing and then up anchor and get on my way as soon as it is light. Nobody will know or care and besides, customs is closed by the end of the afternoon and wont open again until 9am most places. Going ashore is a whole other thing. You might get away with it but there is really no excuse.

In the USA you need to call the number if the Customs office isnt open or nearby. No reason not to and lots of trouble if they catch you.

[Jimmyhenry]

Don’t try this in New Zealand. The French spies who bombed the Rainbow Warrior got picked up by the Neighbourhood Watch team. NZ has a system of voluntary Coast Watch also.
Best to call in. We arrived in SavuSavu , Fiji late at night. Got in through the reef but uncomfortable about heading in so called the Port and got an immediate approval to anchor off Cousteau for the night. Zero problem when we finally checked in.
Compare this with an arrival in Levuka. Another boat had had rough weather and because running late had dropped off a crew member at RakiRaki then proceeded to Levuka. We got dragged into the fracas taking several hours negotiating before the officials finally and very reluctantly agreed to clear their boat in.
Short answer. Play by the rules.
Pete

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by u4ea32

We had trouble checking in to Tuvalu after leaving Honolulu without checking out with customs. Sure, the US does not care if you don't check out, but that leaves a gap in the paperwork that other countries don't like.

I have a close, very rich friend. He is frustrated, in that he is only worth a half billion dollars. Can you imagine only having a half billion? Explains a lot. He searches for adrenaline rushes to make up for this gnawing frustration. One game he plays and generally wins is the "Ignore those idiot customs people, or actively work around those losers."

We have done many trips where we often did not clear in or out. One trip from California to England, we checked in/out of Mexico and Panama, but not the other Central American countries, then Jamaica and Grenada (where we stayed for many months) but none of the other Caribbean countries, and we went to all of them. Bermuda and UK, yes. France, no.

On another trip from Florida to Antigua, we did not check out of the US, we did not check in or out in any of the countries from Florida to Antigua, and we anchored and went ashore in all of them: Bahamas, Puerto Rico, USVI, BVI, both St Martins, etc. All of them. Once we got to Antigua, there was the piper to pay, sorta. We were not allowed to leave the boat until the owner fixed the problem, which took about 36 hours. Some taxi, some time in front of a judge, some money. But afterwards, he said "Still took much less time, and much less money, than if we had checked in and out of all those countries over the past month."

Of course, you can lose your boat. My friend just enjoys the risk of possibly losing many millions of dollars of new and very fine yacht. It raises the risk to make the game interesting.

Wouldn't a guy like that have a paid crewman to deal with the bureaucracy?


Seems like a silly game to me. But I guess different people like their thrills from different sources.

[sck5]

Antigua was by far the strictest of all the EC islands in my experience. They want you to follow their rules. If you try and are friendly they will help you. If you try to get around them it will cost you.

The French islands are the best. You can check in or out in bars and restaurants. Not very hard.

I always played by the rules but in all the years I sailed up and down the Caribbean islands, not once did a customs official visit our boat or even look out the window to see if there WAS a boat. They didnt check to see if people corresponded with passports either. But following the rules isnt hard so why try to cut corners?

[lo2jones]

Every captain should know the local port of entry prior to arrival in a foreign country and should make way to that port.

A delivery skipper friend once sent photos of a wonderful yacht he was transporting, taking full advantage of bragging rights, until the boat was impounded and he and the crew held captive: no check in or out by the East bound delivery crew...I have my own funny story I’ll save for another time.

[Normanskier]

It’s not just checking in. You need to check out. In the Leeward Islands the area that you check into wants to know when and where you checked out of. And if the dates don’t measure up you will have a problem.
This in and out represents money to these islands. They don’t have a lot to begin with so they are pretty zealous in enforcing their rules.
I always go by the “Benefit to risk ratio”. Be smart. Pay the fees.

[merrymac]

We sailed the Caribbean down to Grenada for 2 years and only got papers checked once by the Gendarmes on one of the French islands. But we always checked in as soon as we could, however we didn't go to extreme measures to make it to customs/immigration if we needed to just wait for the next day or something.

As far as I know, and we as well as many others have done this, you can "Q-Flag" it overnight and move on the next day without any problem, and yes sometimes people go ashore with the Q Flag up.

Just as we always went ashore together to check in and have breakfast together even though sometimes I (the Captain) was supposed to clear in before anyone else got off the boat. So bottom line, we followed the rules, but every place is different and most are very friendly and most are easy going on the time frame for checking in.

[theDangerz]

Not that I understand why you'd want to (other than simple laziness or trying to short the locals of money that helps keep those islands moving)... but yes, there is significant risk as we've recently been reminded.

I wouldn't put it up there with the risk of getting shot on sight like trying to cross the southern border into the states... but in a pretty similar way, why would you decide to give " guy/girl with a badge" a reason to take some aggression out on you (whether it be a verbal whipping, a monetary fine, losing your boat or prison time)?


Nobody is looking? -
We have only been at this for a single season, but have already been boarded and had documents checked in the Bahamas, BVIs, Montserrat and St Kitss&Nevis... i hate to think how any of those would have played out if we hadnt had the right paperwork in place. Its one thing to beg forgiveness from a customs official, but do you want to have that discussion with a kid in a coast guard uniform carrying a gun?


What can happen?
Lest week we literally got denied entry into St Vincent & the Grenadines because the length of time since checking out of Grenada was too long. After checking out we had some engine troubles and slow played things and then figured "whats the worst that can happen?" and made the crossing and tried to check in. Nope.

We suddenly found ourselves in a VERY uncomfortable situation. Not only did they harass my wife/the captain for hours on end, it seemed very unlikely to end without paying a hefty fine. In fact, they were very fast to pull out several receipts from the same week where other boats had been charged $500-$2500 and showed her how they were legally allowed to charge much larger fines and/or simply confiscate our boat or send her to jail.

Do i think most custom/immigrations officials are going to use those later options... probably not unless they are having a very, very bad day - but who's to say if the last person to come across the desk was the OP or someone else trying to take advantage of them and their fair country and pissed them off before your arrival...
Not worth the risk in our book, and I wouldn't exactly call us "rule followers" by nature.

As it was we had to turn around and return to Grenada, where we were met with an even more stern greeting because we hadn't left their borders as legally agreed and found ourselves stuck between the two countries' issues.

Lucky for us, my wife/captain is hard to say no to and we dodged a mess and got the whole thing resolved with nothing more than some harsh reminders... but seriously - why? What's the benefit to simply following the rules, checking in and out as expected and paying the fees?


At least for us...
Having now read several of these laws word for word... they are absolutely correct, and most of these islands/countries can confiscate your boat for as little as having broken a simple fishing rule.

One boat confiscation/auction would go a long way toward funding one of these island nations for a year... and i don't intend to risk being there on the day they decide to make an example out of some rich but lazy american... especially given the current political climate and the VERY real question that both customs agencies asked my wife during the process, "What exactly do you think would happen to me if I did this in your country, and how forgiving would your country be to me"

[pbmaise]

In SE Asia

When checking out of Phuket Thailand in theory there should be no stops in Thailand because you checked out. However they basically know yachts stop along the way to till Malaysia. I understand they also know this happens on the way from Langkawi to Phuket and the rule of thumb seems to be 7. If your check out papers from Malaysia show it took more than 7 days to get to Phuket they consider this a problem. However, if it is less than 7 they know you have not been a problem even though you did.

Anchoring and not going to shore in Singapore waters was problematic for me. They were not concerned that I had not checked in. Instead they were more concerned they designated the area a turtle sanctuary and that I should have anchored with the big ships. Maps do not show a turtle sanctuary.

Singapore authorities were understanding since I was short handed and couldn't be expected to sail nonstop forever. I had just crossed the South China Sea and was too exhausted to sail completely through Singapore waters.

If you have plenty of crew, the standard excuse is engine trouble and being forced to anchor for repairs.

I made several stops along Malaysia's coast however my paperwork showed I checked out of Malaysia and was going to Malaysia. Again a no risk situation and unlike what some wrote there is no fine for doing this.

Even a diversion from planned route is usually not a problem and you simply write a letter if arriving at a different country than the one on your checkout papers. The typical letter is you ran out of water. Although you arrive at a port of check in when you do this.