Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 06-12-2008, 07:08   #46
Registered User
 
RBEmerson's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SE PA
Boat: Baba 35 - One With The Wind
Posts: 392
Talking with someone about wind turbine design in general, one unexpected source of noise is the air coming from the blades and striking the mast supporting the turbine. With the right (or wrong...) circumstances, the air mass between the blade disk and mast can resonate and make any, otherwise minor, noise louder. One of the changes in the Air Marine, for example, was to slightly tilt the rotor disk slightly, relative to the mast, to avoid the worst of this resonance.

In talking with people about their Four Winds unit, they mentioned that the blades of their wind turbine were damaged in a storm; something hit them. With all of that in mind, I suggested checking your unit to see if anything happened to your blades.
__________________

__________________
S/V One With The Wind
'85 Baba 35
"You and I may agree, but we could both be wrong."
RBEmerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2008, 22:17   #47
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
cool thing about my Air Breeze on an all-night passage...

...is that it works all night.

When we anchor I tell the crew that any noise they hear coming from the wind turbine is the sound of an engine not running.

Wise cruisers don't think of solar vrs wind. They think solar + wind.
__________________

__________________
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2008, 08:16   #48
Registered User

Join Date: May 2003
Location: East Coast & Other Forums!
Posts: 913
A plug for the 4 winds. Great output in 10 kts. which is what you should be most concerned with. Low noise and brushless generator. You need big blade designs like the KISS and 4-winds if you want usable output in the winds you normally get in protected anchorages. Everything works great in 15kts and up...but that is not what you get in most anchorages mostr of the time. Check this 4 winds chart out:



Since it is DONE by 4 winds...I suggest you disregard their results for their unit...but look at the other brands at 10 knots. Look at the KISS vs. the Airmarine...that is 2 amps difference...in 24 hours of 10 knot winds that is the difference between 96 amp hours and 48 amp hours!!
My own experience with the 4Winds is closer to the KISS curve than is drawn but still EXCELLENT output.

Just some more food for thought.
__________________
Cam - I am no longer a member here. Look for me on other forums...same name.

camaraderie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2008, 08:53   #49
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
yeah, but...

...a problem with the big-blade systems is how they perform in big-wind situations. Check this out regarding KISS failure

BlueJacket: KISS Wind Generator Failure, Belize

With home waters in SF bay, I opted for the Air Breeze precisely because of how it handles wind of 25+ knots, which for me is a typical summer sailing day. But just as every boat is a compromise, so is every wind generator. So I've had to sacrifice a bit of low-wind productivity in order to assure high-wind stability for the system.
__________________
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2008, 09:09   #50
Registered User
 
RBEmerson's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SE PA
Boat: Baba 35 - One With The Wind
Posts: 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by bashful View Post
...a problem with the big-blade systems is how they perform in big-wind situations. [...]
Um, I'd take that with a grain of salt or two or three. Four Winds units have larger blade disks than the three blade units (e.g., KISS). I've spoken with Four Winds owners whose units have weathered hurricanes or at least winds strong enough to, in one case, bend the supporting mast and, in another case, hurl debris that finally broke blades. Which isn't to say I'd care to just walk off, before a storm, and leave a Four Winds to its own devices. But if it has the mechanical speed brake installed, there is some hope the unit will survive.

As to the KISS, its one big design flaw is the thermal cutout blocking the electric brake. Once the breaker pops, the only way to arrest the blades is to turn the disk parallel to the wind and grab a blade. The brake won't work until the breaker cools down and resets. Bad design flow...
__________________
S/V One With The Wind
'85 Baba 35
"You and I may agree, but we could both be wrong."
RBEmerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-01-2009, 21:30   #51
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 120
Air-X 3 year warranty: it works

We arrived in Bundaberg, Australia, shipped our Air-X to the Melbourne rep for Air-X, and got it back, fixed, 10 days later in Mooloolaba. Total shipping cost: AUD 35.
We are happy customers again, hoping the new electronics they put in will last at least another 3 years.
I am hesitating now, to order these cheaper "silent" blades: TLG Windpower Products, replacement blades for AIR 403, AIR X, AIR Marine, Land AIR, TLG-403-MM rotor blade
although I just noticed they have become "unavailable" since I last checked on them.
Anybody has experience with these blades?
__________________
claire
claire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-01-2009, 22:14   #52
Registered User
 
theonecalledtom's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Socal
Boat: Beneteau 36.7
Posts: 386
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bash View Post
Wise cruisers don't think of solar vrs wind. They think solar + wind.
Sounds like the truth of the matter!

I frequently walk past a lonely Gemini with a Rutland913 on the back. If there's wind that thing is moving and if theres a gale you can hear it but it's not annoyingly loud (more of a hum than a shriek).

Seeing it create all that electricity for no reason makes me sad but perhaps its owner will return one day and make use of it.
__________________
theonecalledtom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2009, 11:02   #53
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Corpus Christi Texas
Boat: boatless atm
Posts: 722
Send a message via MSN to bobfnbw
IN the recent practical sailor wind gen review, they rated the superwind 350 as the best overall, ahead of the kiss and airbreeze.

anyone have expirance with the superwind 350?
__________________
bobfnbw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2009, 03:35   #54
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,577
Images: 240
Testing the Power Curves of Small Wind Turbines ~ by Paul Gipe
Testing the Power Curves of Small Wind Turbines : by Paul Gipe

More Wind Turbine Articles by Paul Gipe
Archive of Articles on Small & Household-size Wind Turbines by Paul Gipe
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2009, 23:08   #55
Registered User
 
RBEmerson's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SE PA
Boat: Baba 35 - One With The Wind
Posts: 392
The only experience I've had with the Superwind, as mentioned earlier in this thread, wasn't super.
__________________
S/V One With The Wind
'85 Baba 35
"You and I may agree, but we could both be wrong."
RBEmerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-05-2009, 06:36   #56
Registered User
 
Zanshin's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Caribbean
Boat: Jeanneau 57
Posts: 1,621
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Willems View Post
...So now I can buy a D400 for a good price. I found a lot of positive info on the internet. It is hard to interpretate the windgens...
I am very happy with my D400 and it supplies a lot of power, even in lower winds found at night in anchorages. But it is a very heavy beast and I think that can make a difference on smalle boats; I had an especially thick mounting system made for mine.
__________________
Zanshin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-05-2009, 20:38   #57
Registered User
 
c.spots's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Now in Davao, the Philippines.
Boat: Leopard 40 catamaran
Posts: 121
Send a message via Skype™ to c.spots
It wouldn't be a problem except for the freezer - but it has to stay. My solar panels keep up unless there is a cloudy day or other electrical items being used - such as when sailing. They put out a huge amount of power, unless they are shaded by the boat.
I am considering three options, but can't afford all three:
-More solar panels, but in locations that won't be shaded when the main ones are.
-Another alternator and smart regulator on both engines. Both engines have 80 amp alternators, but with dumb regulators. I usually just run one at a time.
- A wind generator. This wasn't on my list until recently, but now in Grenada, I can appreciate the trade winds. I checked out the boats at anchor in Prickly Bay today, and the D400 was amazingly quiet. But, once you add the regulator for it, it is about twice the price of most of the others, and much heavier. It probably has somewhat better output too, especially at higher wind speeds (more than I need).
Unfortunately, the companies don't want you to compare their units with others, since they use different measurements. Most of us don't care how many watts the unit puts out at 60 kts wind speed, but are more interested at the output between 5 and 15 (20?) kts.

Other than the D400, the price is amazingly similar for the three options.
Any suggestions? I have read the 07/2007 Practical Sailor article but it didn't compare all the units out there now.
__________________
Robert W.
c.spots
www.changingspots.net

Life shouldn't be a race to the finish line - enjoy the journey.
c.spots is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-05-2009, 21:59   #58
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
this is the problem with comparisons of wind turbines

Quote:
Originally Posted by theonecalledtom View Post
I frequently walk past a lonely Gemini with a Rutland913 on the back. If there's wind that thing is moving and if theres a gale you can hear it but it's not annoyingly loud (more of a hum than a shriek).
That Rutland 913 is far more quiet than my Air Breeze. But in a 20-knot wind it's only generating 90 watts, while my unit will be producing 200. Is it more quiet? Certainly. But it's more quiet much in the same way that the eight-horse outboard on my dink is more quiet than the twin 454s on the Cigarette zooming past.

Likewise, that D400 is twice as powerful as my Air Breeze. But it's also twice as heavy and more than twice as expensive. How do they compare?
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-07-2009, 18:27   #59
Registered User
 
RBEmerson's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SE PA
Boat: Baba 35 - One With The Wind
Posts: 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zanshin View Post
I am very happy with my D400 and it supplies a lot of power, even in lower winds found at night in anchorages. But it is a very heavy beast and I think that can make a difference on smalle boats; I had an especially thick mounting system made for mine.
We have since installed a D400. At 15 kg (33 lbs) "heavy" isn't a description be taken ...ah... lightly. Putting the thing on the mast was not a job for the weak and faint of heart.

But it is quiet! We've only had a chance to check it out in winds of about 15 kts but at its loudest, the sound is like wind in the pines and not at all intrusive.

Output is in line with the published curve:
10 knots wind speed produces 40 watts
15 knots wind speed produces 120 watts
20 knots wind speed produces 190 watts
25 knots wind speed produces 280 watts
32 knots wind speed produces 400 watts

Nonetheless, we'll be mounting a solar panel, too - might as well gather all the "free" electrons we can!
__________________
S/V One With The Wind
'85 Baba 35
"You and I may agree, but we could both be wrong."
RBEmerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-10-2009, 20:57   #60
Registered User
 
RBEmerson's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SE PA
Boat: Baba 35 - One With The Wind
Posts: 392
Having now experienced the D400 at higher wind speeds (close to 30 kts in gusts), it actually quiets down at about 20 kts - going from the "wind in the pines" noise at 10-15 kts to something much quieter. And, of course, it helps that the wind in the rigging covers that up. But overall, I'm pleased with the D400.
__________________

__________________
S/V One With The Wind
'85 Baba 35
"You and I may agree, but we could both be wrong."
RBEmerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
generator, wind generator

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wind vs. Solar? Recommendations? NatKat Electrical: Batteries, Generators & Solar 20 19-08-2013 23:20
Portable Generator vs Solar Panels or Wind Generator Sweet As Electrical: Batteries, Generators & Solar 120 16-09-2010 19:27
Wind Generator luso Electrical: Batteries, Generators & Solar 3 13-07-2010 19:48
Wind Generator billangiep Electrical: Batteries, Generators & Solar 60 07-06-2008 13:06



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 23:16.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.