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Old 16-02-2015, 06:51   #31
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Re: 220 AC switch on 24v DC "starter" v. LED bulb in 240v fixture

240v? AC? I would expect on brief millisecond of REALLY bright lite, consequently followed by the associated puff of smoke. Then nothing more.

BTW, were you aware that in the electrical manufacture of components, they only put a finite amount of smoke in them, and if you let it out , you are screwed! Word to the wise!

Thats a joke......

I'm thinking you mean 24v DC system, so as to the 24v, I'm not that versed on the excitation of electrons in LED lighting so others may chime in to that aspect. The difference in design voltage will cause an impact, what? Time will tell.

What I was pointing out is a 24v design would have physically smaller wire awg sizing and all factors of design ampacity would be the use of 24v.

IF, AND I say only IF, 12v is input into smaller wire, it causes heat. Its a physical law of the universe, no amount of writing or conjecture on an internet forum will change that.

If it is actually 240v AC, I would like to be listed as beneficiary on your life insurance policy, if possible!

That all being said, as always "Listen to everyone, Follow no one"
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Old 16-02-2015, 08:43   #32
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Re: Picture of Light: Now not working at all

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Originally Posted by ur2slo View Post
................ Ohms law states that E=I*R, so consequently when the voltage drops, the amperage INCREASES, .............
This is not true, you are misusing ohms law. Following your logic, if the voltage drops t zero, the current would rise to infinity. Obviously, this is not the case.

As the voltage drops, the current drops. Once the voltage reaches zero, the current will also reach zero.
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Old 16-02-2015, 09:27   #33
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Re: Picture of Light: Now not working at all

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This is not true, you are misusing ohms law. Following your logic, if the voltage drops t zero, the current would rise to infinity.
I didnt make the law........... we used to say electricity just lets us think we control it.

This is an example of leading/lagging current, we can get into discussion of ferroresonance later.



Ain't electricity amazing...........
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Old 16-02-2015, 09:33   #34
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Re: What's causing flickering 12v light?

In internet terms...........enjoy.

Ohm's Law Calculator

Wattage is the actual figure for work done.


http://www.rapidtables.com/calc/elec...calculator.htm
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Old 16-02-2015, 09:41   #35
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Re: Picture of Light: Now not working at all

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I didnt make the law........... we used to say electricity just lets us think we control it.

This is an example of leading/lagging current, we can get into discussion of ferroresonance later.


Ain't electricity amazing...........
I have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say but I made my living in electricity and electronics. Reducing the voltage in a circuit will not increase the current regardless of how you spin it.
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Old 16-02-2015, 11:13   #36
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Re: Picture of Light: Now not working at all

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I have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say but I made my living in electricity and electronics. Reducing the voltage in a circuit will not increase the current regardless of how you spin it.
I didnt say that, you did........

"Following your logic, if the voltage drops t zero, the current would rise to infinity. Obviously, this is not the case.

As the voltage drops, the current drops. Once the voltage reaches zero, the current will also reach zero."

ANd you are right, reducing the EMF will reduce the amperage, but in a working light circuit that we are talking about, the voltage isn't varying by outside influence, ie: a dimmer.

For a given state of work I stand as before.

Now....I'm out.

I learned a long time ago, the ole saying "Arguing on the internet is like competing in the Special Olympic's...even if you win, your still retarded."

Toodles............
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Old 16-02-2015, 12:29   #37
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Re: Picture of Light: Now not working at all

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.............. Now....I'm out. ..............
Good plan!

If you want to learn about basic electricity there are some good books. If you want to learn more, there are some good schools.
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Old 16-02-2015, 14:24   #38
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Re: Picture of Light: Now not working at all

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Originally Posted by rwidman View Post
Good plan!

If you want to learn about basic electricity there are some good books. If you want to learn more, there are some good schools.
FAA Airframe & PowerPlant
FAA inspection Authorization
FAA Avionics Repairman
4 Manufacturer Turbine Engine O/H Schools
Manitex 155' Hydraulic Crane School

IBEW Journeyman Electrician
Medium Voltage (2001v -35kv) Cable Splicer Certification
NETA Test Qualified
15 years HV cable Splicing

I know I may have forgot a few more, but what the hey.........

Your Up.......
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Old 16-02-2015, 17:22   #39
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Re: What's causing flickering 12v light?

And yet you post "Ohms law states that E=I*R, so consequently when the voltage drops, the amperage INCREASES,"


I don't know where you got your electrical education but you may still be able to get your money back.
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Old 16-02-2015, 18:31   #40
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Re: What's causing flickering 12v light?

Never mind, you will never design a light bulb. You missed the whole point. I'm not even gonna go into it any more, its a waste of time.

You can turn ur lights on and I will turn mine on, not here to finish an unfinishable discussion, your right , if it makes you feel that much better.

Was just trying to help a flickering light, but as always the idiots abound.


Question Stupidity....
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Old 16-02-2015, 18:34   #41
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Re: What's causing flickering 12v light?

Kitty fight, kitty fight...
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Old 17-02-2015, 05:48   #42
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Re: What's causing flickering 12v light?

BELL LAB PROVES EXISTENCE OF DARK SUCKERS!

For years it has been believed that electric bulbs emitted light. However, recent information from Bell Labs has proven otherwise. Electric bulbs don't emit light; they suck dark. Thus they now call these bulbs dark suckers.

The dark sucker theory, according to a spokesman from the Labs, proves the existence of dark, that dark has mass heavier than that of light, and that dark is faster than light.

The basis of the dark sucker theory is that electric bulbs suck dark. Take, for example, the dark suckers in the room where you are. There is less dark right next to them than there is elsewhere. The larger the dark sucker, the greater its capacity to suck dark. Dark suckers in a parking lot have a much greater capacity than the ones in this room.

As with all things, dark suckers don't last forever. Once they are full of dark, they can no longer suck. This is proven by the black spot on a full dark sucker. A new candle has a white wick. You will notice that after the first use, the wick turns black, representing all the dark which has been sucked into it. If you hold a pencil next to the wick of an operating candle, the tip will turn black because it got in the path of the dark flowing into the candle. Unfortunately, these primitive dark suckers have a very limited range.

There are also portable dark suckers. The bulbs in these can't handle all of the dark by themselves, and must be aided by a dark storage unit. When the dark storage unit is full, it must be either emptied or replaced before the portable dark sucker can operate again.

Dark has mass. When dark goes into a dark sucker, friction from this mass generates heat. Thus it is not wise to touch an operating dark sucker. Candles present a special problem, as the dark must travel in the solid wick instead of through glass. This generates a great amount of heat. Thus it can be very dangerous to touch an operating candle.

Dark is also heavier than light. If you swim deeper and deeper, you notice it gets darker and darker. When you reach a depth of approximately fifty feet, you are in total darkness. This is because the heavier dark sinks to the bottom of the lake and the ligher light floats to the top.

The immense power of dark can be utilized to a man's advantage. We can collect the dark that has settled to the bottom of lakes and push it through turbines, which generates electricity and helps push it to the ocean where it may be safely stored. Prior to turbines, it was much more difficult to get dark from rivers and lakes to the ocean. The Indians recognized this problem and tried to solve it. When on a river in a canoe traveling in the same direction as the flow of dark, they paddled slowly, so as not to stop the flow of dark, but when they traveled against the flow of dark, they paddled quickly so as to help push the dark along its way.

Finally, we must prove that dark is faster than light. If you stand in an illuminated room in front of a closed, dark closet, then slowly open the door, you would see the light slowly enter the closet, but since the dark is so fast, you would not be able to see the dark leave the closet.

In conclusion, Bell Labs stated that dark suckers make all our lives much easier. So the next time you look at an electric light bulb, remember that it is indeed a dark sucker.
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Old 17-02-2015, 06:28   #43
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Re: What's causing flickering 12v light?

How do I simply explain it? Hmmm,

My point was that his system has a set value of resistance, a constant if you will.

If at 12v and 5 amp, substituting for above:

E=12v
I= 5A
R=2.4

now...increase the voltage while the Ohms remains the same, which it does in a lamp circuit.

(ALL values are for computation value only, not representative of actual circuit)

E=24v
R=2.4 (the ohms value doesn't change in the circuit)

I=?

Schools out...I hope this explains my reasoning. I hate incompetence.

Stupidity should be painful.........
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Old 17-02-2015, 06:56   #44
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Re: Picture of Light: Now not working at all

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..............Ohms law states that E=I*R, so consequently when the voltage drops, the amperage INCREASES, hence your heat generated by trying to push 12v thru a 24v hole to put it simply, the amps produce heat instead of work.
Your words (emphasis added).

==================================

With a constant resistance, decreasing the voltage decreases the current (amperage)

Conversely, increasing the voltage (with a constant resistance) increases the current.

Of course if the resistance is a light bulb, as a practical matter we would have to change it or it would burn out. The new light bulb would have a higher resistance and use less current for the same brightness.
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Old 21-02-2015, 03:37   #45
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THE LATEST - new 12 volt LED bulb, socket, switch

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Originally Posted by ur2slo View Post
240v? AC? I would expect on brief millisecond of REALLY bright lite, consequently followed by the associated puff of smoke. Then nothing more.

BTW, were you aware that in the electrical manufacture of components, they only put a finite amount of smoke in them, and if you let it out , you are screwed! Word to the wise!

Thats a joke......

I'm thinking you mean 24v DC system, so as to the 24v, I'm not that versed on the excitation of electrons in LED lighting so others may chime in to that aspect. The difference in design voltage will cause an impact, what? Time will tell.

What I was pointing out is a 24v design would have physically smaller wire awg sizing and all factors of design ampacity would be the use of 24v.

IF, AND I say only IF, 12v is input into smaller wire, it causes heat. Its a physical law of the universe, no amount of writing or conjecture on an internet forum will change that.

If it is actually 240v AC, I would like to be listed as beneficiary on your life insurance policy, if possible!

That all being said, as always "Listen to everyone, Follow no one"
As noted above, only the new FIXTURE is 240 rated. As the photo shows, the old system had an AC 240 switch, and a starter rated at 24 volts DC. The input is 12 volts from two, parallel connected 12 volt marine batteries

So, to clarify, let me add that I decided to not use the 240 rated socket for my new LED bulb. Perhaps I should have used the word "socket" instead of "fixture" in my original post. In any case, instead of using it, I visited a solar shop nearby, and to my delight, found everything I needed to can the fluorescent stuff and go with LED. I found and installed a 12 volt LED bulb socket that came with a 12 volt switch, so I hardwired them into a junction box on the 12v, DC feed.

All are working fine, so the problem has been solved by following the advice of those who suggested LED.

Thanks to everyone for your help,

G2L
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