What count as a cycle (battery life)

[john61ct]

Very easy.

The best battery value by far is Duracell FLA deep cycle golf cart batteries, 2x6V, around $200 per 200+AH pair from BatteriesPlus or Sam's Club.

And true deep cycle, actually mfg by Deka/East Penn, very respected maker.

And lower cost per AH than the shoddy "marine" fraudulently labeled only pseudo "deep cycling" 12V JCI-made **junk** sold in automotive and big box retail

likely lower even including the trip.

Even the slightly better Trojan T-105's are often available locally, at cheaper $/AH than what you're talking about.

I have done my best to remain polite and objective about the topic, my true feelings are much stronger.

US consumer protections are a joke compared to the rest of the developed world, and the scammers take full advantage in this industry.

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
......but since it’s there, why not set it as correct as I can?


Balmar’s “Bulk” setting is really another absorption setting as I see it, cause Bulk is current limited, not voltage, and Balmar assigning a voltage level to “Bulk” is non sensical.
Makes about as much sense to me as the cell phone providers “unlimited” plans, which have limits.

I think it well may cause confusion, and maybe they ought to call it Absorption 1 and Absorption 2 or something, just not Bulk.

Very astute reasoning.


a64, Maine Sail covered just this in his excellent Programming an External Regulator article.

[Standbly]

Aaah you get pissed off with "marine yachting" products and prices as much as I do. We agree on that.
I'm sure that the golf cart batteries are much better in quality than plain automotive batteries but...

200Ah @ 6V is only 100Ah @ 12V

That means that the golfcart batteries should last twice as long as automotive batteries before they break even. Givin' that they each cost about 1 buck per amp.

I'm not racing you. I'm just trying to make a point here. Costumers of batteries, do the math. Buy what you need and pay nothing more for a "marine yachting label".

[john61ct]

My pricing was for the pair, and 200+AH @12V , $1 per 12V AH as stated

Just the facts ma'am, your rig your choice.

Any batt labelled marine is automatically suspect.

Fewer than 1% of units on the market labelled as "deep cycling" are that in reality.

With these you get **much** better quality, **and** pay less!

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Stu Jackson

Very astute reasoning.


a64, Maine Sail covered just this in his excellent Programming an External Regulator article.

Yes, I have now read that article and will likely reprogram my 614 based off of what I have read there.
I have been trying to adjust ffl to be what trips the drop to float as opposed to just the timer. If I can’t make that work, then I will just set four hours of absorption or something, but I haven’t given up on ffl yet.
Problem is I need to be underway to really set that as it takes hours to get a result, and underway, I’m not watching voltage.
I guess I need to set up a temp voltmeter at the helm.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Standbly

To stirr things up and at the same time be very serious... My advice would be: Buy 65 amp car (automotive) batteries. Put them in parallel to ad up to your desired amperage. Do not pay more than 1,20 per AMP!

My advise would be: don't take battery advise from someone who doesn't know the difference between Amps and Amp hours.

[Standbly]

Originally Posted by StuM

My advise would be: don't take battery advise from someone who doesn't know the difference between Amps and Amp hours.

Luckely batteries are all rated in Ah's so it doesn't quite matter if a bloke on cruisersforum (me) call's them 'amps' in his reply. If I confused you, please excuse me.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Standbly

Luckely batteries are all rated in Ah's so it doesn't quite matter if a bloke on cruisersforum (me) call's them 'amps' in his reply. If I confused you, please excuse me.

The problem is that that's not true either.



We've had several previous threads where posters who didn't understand the difference between automotive batteries and deep cycle batteries thought that a battery rating in "cold cranking Amps" was an indication of the Ah capacity of the battery.


There's only one way to avoid such confusion - use the correct units.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Standbly

Luckely batteries are all rated in Ah's so it doesn't quite matter if a bloke on cruisersforum (me) call's them 'amps' in his reply. If I confused you, please excuse me.

How about AH(10), AH(20), RC, PHCA, CCA, HCA, MCA.

ODYSSEY Batteries - Extreme series

[Standbly]

Originally Posted by Wotname

How about AH(10), AH(20), RC, PHCA, CCA, HCA, MCA.

ODYSSEY Batteries - Extreme series

I clicked the link... You must be kidding me! I hope that they sample-test those specs because if they're all tested to meet their specs... You'll be buying a worn or at least heavily used battery.

Anyway. I'm sorry I posted uncomplete information or took the shortcut in my plea for a cheap solution concerning batteries. But I'll try again.

Here goes:

Car batteries are produced by the millions. The same probably goes for golfcart batteries, I'm not familiour with those yet. They are therefore a lot cheaper. Usually they are smaller and have less capacity. Placing (a lot of) them in parallel deals with that. They maybe less quality and this should be noticable in a shorter lifespan. However, in my experience, replacing them more often is still a lot cheaper than buying long life "marine batteries". Not to mention a certain warranty given on car batteries.
It's probably not for everyone to make a choice as radical as I did, going with normal domestic batteries instead of marine labeled ones.

I start replacing my AGM's with domestic car batteries in Suriname and later the Caribbean. The temperature played a big role in the lifespan of my AGM's. I was not the only one with this problem. I couldn't bear to see $1500 dollars worth of marine batteries being "cooked" slowly in those climates. So I bought car batteries worth $400 bucks. Total capacity was about the same. (the total weight was about the same, eventually it's about the lead and the acid that makes the capacity no matter what the specs sell you). My break even point concerning lifespan was a couple of months ago and the car batteries are still going strong. Very happy so far.

I'm not trying to be a "know it all" but please do not comment "this guy does not know what he's talking about" with some smiley's attached. Try to be nice

[a64pilot]

Your correct in your assertion that car batteries are manufactured in large numbers, with a lot of competition and this drives the price way down, compared to expensive “Marine” batteries.
However they are not made to be deep cycled, so if you do it cuts into their life significantly.
However “golf cart” batteries are also made in large numbers, and there is a lot of competition, this drives the price way down, compared to expensive “Marine batteries”

Difference is they are made to be deep cycled, so their lifespan if done so is considerably longer than car batteries. So by buying a golf cart battery, you get low price and long life, not just low price.

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by Standbly

I'm not trying to be a "know it all" but please do not comment "this guy does not know what he's talking about"

Sorry but just that post contained quite a few false statements.

But uttered in complete confidence.

Uncorrected, the falsehoods lead others astray.

Maintaining consistent truth in the forum is more important than sparing your feelings.

Correcting each wrong statement takes time, if you're skeptical then we rehash the same constant repeating debates over level-101 settled topics, wasting hours of our time.

So sometimes for efficiency, it is easier to just warn others "don't listen to this guy, he doesn't know what he's talking about".

[daletournier]

Hi standbly, you just can't compare deep cycle golf cart batteries to car starting batteries regarding your intended use as yacht house batteries. With all due respect you need to do some research regarding this.

And in regards to the Carribean climate doing in your batteries you need to do some research in this area as well.

There's some really knowledgeable guys on this forum, in fact in this thread, it's free information that you can take advantage of.

As Steady would say "the above is said in a friendly tone".

[a64pilot]

No, being nice is very, very important here.
We can make our point, and be nice. There is no good reason not to be nice, especially if the other person isn’t.

[john61ct]

Here's a good start from Maine Sail about battery type basics

https://marinehowto.com/what-is-a-deep-cycle-battery/

Everything at his site is golden