|
|
22-07-2018, 14:42
|
#1
|
Registered User
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Niagara Falls
Boat: Oops -jumped the gun
Posts: 62
|
Using arc welder wiring
I have a couple of hundred feet of arc welder cables. Most of it has seen limited or no use. It's a very fine stranded wire, the gauge is unknown, but it's from a diesel driven welder with a 500 amp output.
Is there any reason it can't be tinned and used safely in a marine environment?
__________________
What have I done?
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 15:00
|
#2
|
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Oregon
Boat: Seafarer36c
Posts: 5,563
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
The insulation breaks down after about 30 years. Might be hard to tin, it really sucks up the heat might and melt the insulation. A good crimp with an insulating compound and shrink tubing will be pretty good.
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 15:25
|
#3
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Martinique
Boat: Fortuna Island Spirit 40
Posts: 2,298
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
I personally prefer welding cable. It nice and flexible and easy to run. Just make sure you figure out the gauge (of mm) to ensure you are using adequate cable for the job.
I don't bother with tinning. I make a good crimped connection, followed by covering in silicon in the joint, then finally I apply adhesive lined heat shrink (once silicon kicks).
I have seen that cable drug through mud, muck, snow, chemical filled puddles, hit with grinding sparks, driven over, caught in track hoes... and still come away with zero damage. Last summer the company I was working for had me build some extension cables (yes seriously) out of disgarded 15 year old welding cable. The copper was still shiny and looked just like brand new.
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 15:51
|
#4
|
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Marina del Rey, California
Boat: President 43 Sportfish
Posts: 4,105
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
The gauge is easy to measure. The wire is not tinned and will remain that way, even if you tin the connections. Its thinner strands will be more susceptible to failure from corrosion.
Use marine grade cable.
__________________
1st rule of yachting: When a collision is unavoidable, aim for something cheap.
"whatever spare parts you bring, you'll never need"--goboatingnow
"Id rather drown than have computers take over my life."--d design
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 17:09
|
#5
|
Registered User
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Niagara Falls
Boat: Oops -jumped the gun
Posts: 62
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecos
The insulation breaks down after about 30 years. Might be hard to tin, it really sucks up the heat might and melt the insulation. A good crimp with an insulating compound and shrink tubing will be pretty good.
|
I have a lead/tin melting pot that I can vary the ratios. no problem to dip the end and it tins quite well. flux it up first of course.
Quote:
Originally Posted by travellerw
I personally prefer welding cable. It nice and flexible and easy to run. Just make sure you figure out the gauge (of mm) to ensure you are using adequate cable for the job.
disgarded 15 year old welding cable. The copper was still shiny and looked just like brand new.
|
It really is amazing quality and stands up well without oxidizing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terra Nova
The gauge is easy to measure. The wire is not tinned and will remain that way, even if you tin the connections. Its thinner strands will be more susceptible to failure from corrosion.
Use marine grade cable.
|
Worst case is for me to sell the welding cable, or get scrap metal prices for it (it cost me nothing) and buy marine cable.
__________________
What have I done?
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:02
|
#6
|
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: KH 49x, Custom
Posts: 1,759
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
We used welding cable on our last boat to go from the batteries, aft, to the windlass. Corbin 39, with the batteries in the pilot house. So round trip would be about 60 feet. After 6 years, and two atlantic crossings, there was no evidence of corrosion on either end.
I would do so again without issue.
Cheers.
Paul.
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:11
|
#7
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Martinique
Boat: Fortuna Island Spirit 40
Posts: 2,298
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Quote:
Originally Posted by wallythacker
I have a lead/tin melting pot that I can vary the ratios. no problem to dip the end and it tins quite well. flux it up first of course.
|
Don't bother.. The real problem is corrosion creeping up the insulation. Tinning the ends will not stop this.
Thats why I do the whole convoluted silicon and heat shink. However, I don't think it really necessary. Quality welding cable is made well enough that it seems to stop this. Sometimes I just like to "Guild the Lilly".
Go ahead and use it. It will work fine as long as its sized for the current you plan to carry.
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:12
|
#8
|
Registered User
Join Date: May 2008
Location: puɐןsuǝǝnb 'ʎɐʞɔɐɯ
Boat: Nantucket Island 33
Posts: 4,864
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Welding cable has a sheath designed to resist being melted or set on fire by red hot metal. Some cables achieved this by using a high natural rubber content which will break down over the years. Good stuff uses a synthetic rubber that will last forever. You'd have 50mm2 cable at a minimum, possibly even 70mm2, so corrosion won't slow it down too much in regards to boat supply current carrying capacity. Just make sure it's clean enough for solder to take to it easily. The usual method of applying a crimp lug (or even hammered down copper water pipe) is to crimp first, then solder the crimped connection. Because the insulation doesn't melt so easy, this technique works fine.
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:38
|
#9
|
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Marina del Rey, California
Boat: President 43 Sportfish
Posts: 4,105
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reefmagnet
...The usual method of applying a crimp lug (or even hammered down copper water pipe) is to crimp first, then solder the crimped connection...
|
No. The preferred method is to properly crimp using the right tool, then seal with a heat shrink sleeve. No solder.
OP--sell the cable, if you don't need it for welding, and buy marine grade tinned cable for your boat.
__________________
1st rule of yachting: When a collision is unavoidable, aim for something cheap.
"whatever spare parts you bring, you'll never need"--goboatingnow
"Id rather drown than have computers take over my life."--d design
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:42
|
#10
|
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Oregon
Boat: Seafarer36c
Posts: 5,563
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
It would scare almost everybody, my starter cable is 40 year old welding cable, maybe OO and the insulation is seriously cracked. The other cables in the batt system were so bad they had to be changed. Your savings will be passed on to somebody someday.
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:44
|
#11
|
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Lake City MN
Boat: C&C 27 Mk III
Posts: 2,647
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Do not tin before any crimp on any large cable. The wire can get hot enough to melt the solder before the wire melts through and this would reduce any physical crimp. Any job worth doing once is worth doing right.
You risk being one of those previous owners.
__________________
Special knowledge can be a terrible disadvantage if it leads you too far along a path that you cannot explain anymore.
Frank Herbert 'Dune'
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:46
|
#12
|
Registered User
Join Date: May 2008
Location: puɐןsuǝǝnb 'ʎɐʞɔɐɯ
Boat: Nantucket Island 33
Posts: 4,864
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terra Nova
No. The preferred method is to properly crimp using the right tool, then seal with a heat shrink sleeve. No solder.
OP--sell the cable, if you don't need it for welding, and buy marine grade tinned cable for your boat.
|
You might want to pass that advice on to the welding companies. They've been doing it wrong for years.
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:54
|
#13
|
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Marina del Rey, California
Boat: President 43 Sportfish
Posts: 4,105
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reefmagnet
You might want to pass that advice on to the welding companies. They've been doing it wrong for years.
|
Welding companies can do whatever they're allowed. On boats we have other regulations and considerations because of vibration and the safety of lives at sea.
__________________
1st rule of yachting: When a collision is unavoidable, aim for something cheap.
"whatever spare parts you bring, you'll never need"--goboatingnow
"Id rather drown than have computers take over my life."--d design
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 18:58
|
#14
|
Registered User
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Niagara Falls
Boat: Oops -jumped the gun
Posts: 62
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Another question came to mind.
If the current for a particular run is going to be almost twice what the cable can carry is it OK to run another cable in parallel and crimp/solder them together to form a two conductor bundle?
__________________
What have I done?
|
|
|
22-07-2018, 19:01
|
#15
|
Marine Service Provider
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Auckland, NZ
Boat: Compass 790 , 7.9 metres or 26 ft
Posts: 2,803
|
Re: Using arc welder wiring
Used the same sort of stuff for anchor winch cable. Had boat for 15 years & lasted fine. Hard to get harder usage than welders give them, IMHO they get a much cushier life on a boat except for the corrosion aspect.
|
|
|
|
|
Thread Tools |
Search this Thread |
|
|
Display Modes |
Rate This Thread |
Linear Mode
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
Advertise Here
Recent Discussions |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Vendor Spotlight |
|
|
|