Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 22-07-2018, 19:01   #16
Registered User
 
Terra Nova's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Marina del Rey, California
Boat: President 43 Sportfish
Posts: 4,105
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallythacker View Post
Another question came to mind.

If the current for a particular run is going to be almost twice what the cable can carry is it OK to run another cable in parallel and crimp/solder them together to form a two conductor bundle?
NO way!
__________________
1st rule of yachting: When a collision is unavoidable, aim for something cheap.
"whatever spare parts you bring, you'll never need"--goboatingnow
"Id rather drown than have computers take over my life."--d design
Terra Nova is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2018, 19:20   #17
Registered User

Join Date: May 2018
Location: Niagara Falls
Boat: Oops -jumped the gun
Posts: 62
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terra Nova View Post
NO way!

So doing that plants one firmly into PO STATUS?
__________________
What have I done?
wallythacker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2018, 19:24   #18
Registered User
 
Reefmagnet's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: puɐןsuǝǝnb 'ʎɐʞɔɐɯ
Boat: Nantucket Island 33
Posts: 4,864
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terra Nova View Post
Welding companies can do whatever they're allowed. On boats we have other regulations and considerations because of vibration and the safety of lives at sea.

Actually they cant. They have to manufacture to standards as well. Welding machine open circuit voltage can be high enough to kill in certain environments. Also, if you think a welding cable has a sissy life, think of applications on wharves, sky scrapers, oil rigs, cross country pipe lines, steel storage tanks, ship repairs and building, etcetera, etcetera.
Reefmagnet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2018, 19:34   #19
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Cruz
Boat: SAnta Cruz 27
Posts: 6,683
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Having replaced a failed welding cable on a boat, I would never recommend it. The fine strands turned to fairy dust over time, and it wouldn't conduct enough amps to run a windlass. I kept cutting back the end of the cable to find a good section, and gave up after 8 feet.
donradcliffe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2018, 19:36   #20
Registered User

Join Date: May 2018
Location: Niagara Falls
Boat: Oops -jumped the gun
Posts: 62
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Here's a great link to description of welding cables in general and alternative cables that substitute for them. I found it a good read.

https://www.anixter.com/en_ca/resour...ing-cable.html
__________________
What have I done?
wallythacker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2018, 21:04   #21
Commercial Member
 
CharlieJ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St. Petersburg, FL
Boat: Gulfstar Long Range Trawler; 53'; BearBoat
Posts: 1,524
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Tha ABYC Standards are used by surveyors to inspect a recreational vessel. The insurance companies use the vessel's survey report to determine if they will write an insurance policy for coverage of that vessel.

For DC systems, ABYC Standard E-11 specifically requires that insulated conductors and cables conform to the requirements of UL1426 or SAE J378 and SAE J1127 or SAE J1128.

Welding cable does not conform to these requirements.

BTW, there is no ABYC requirement to use tinned conductors or cables on recreational vessels.
__________________
Charlie Johnson
ABYC Master Technician
JTB Marine Corporation
"The Devil is in the details and so is salvation."
CharlieJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2018, 21:40   #22
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Slidell, La.
Boat: Morgan Classic 33
Posts: 2,845
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieJ View Post
Tha ABYC Standards are used by surveyors to inspect a recreational vessel. The insurance companies use the vessel's survey report to determine if they will write an insurance policy for coverage of that vessel.

For DC systems, ABYC Standard E-11 specifically requires that insulated conductors and cables conform to the requirements of UL1426 or SAE J378 and SAE J1127 or SAE J1128.

Welding cable does not conform to these requirements.

BTW, there is no ABYC requirement to use tinned conductors or cables on recreational vessels.

This isn't dated so...

jimbunyard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2018, 23:46   #23
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: canada
Posts: 4,634
Re: Using arc welder wiring

most wire is not gas or diesel proof. a spill / leak with eat though the insolation. I've seen unfused 2/0 welding cables, pos and neg, side by side with 1' of insulation missing on both cables. he's so lucky they never touched.

one of many reasons to use marine cable.

I'm pretty sure ABYC says you can't use welding cable.
smac999 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-07-2018, 05:06   #24
Commercial Member
 
CharlieJ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St. Petersburg, FL
Boat: Gulfstar Long Range Trawler; 53'; BearBoat
Posts: 1,524
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Post #22
Good to know but...the ABYC requirement also requires SAE J378 for the cable to be conforming. I did not include in my original post the very specific labeling required on the wiring and cabling.

To the OP: I recommend that you sell the windfall welding conductors for scrap and then use the $ to buy UL 1426 BC5W2 Boat Cable. An internet source with a good reputation is Genuine Deals (no connection between them and me) ; Marine Battery Cable, Tinned Marine Grade Battery Cables : AWG Gauge Size Genuinedealz.com
__________________
Charlie Johnson
ABYC Master Technician
JTB Marine Corporation
"The Devil is in the details and so is salvation."
CharlieJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-07-2018, 07:37   #25
cruiser

Join Date: Jan 2017
Boat: Retired from CF
Posts: 13,317
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallythacker View Post
Worst case is for me to sell the welding cable, or get scrap metal prices for it (it cost me nothing) and buy marine cable.
Do that.

And crimp / heat seal it properly, as per Maine Sail. https://marinehowto.com/marine-wire-termination/

https://marinehowto.com/making-your-own-battery-cables/
john61ct is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-07-2018, 08:26   #26
Zil
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 361
Re: Using arc welder wiring

quoting a link from post above.


"Welding cable’s flexibility and durability makes it attractive to use in non-welding applications. However, most welding cable is not Listed by a Nationally Recognized Testing Laboratory (NRTL) like UL, meaning it does not meet NEC requirements for fixed wiring. Even UL Listed welding cable that meets UL 1276 Welding Cables is not approved for use as fixed wiring or general use portable cord unless it carries an additional Listing.3 Authorities having jurisdiction (AHJ) can approve the use of welding cable in applications where the installation is judged to be safe, but using welding cable as fixed wiring without discussion with the AHJ can lead to problems."
Zil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-07-2018, 08:44   #27
cruiser

Join Date: Jan 2017
Boat: Retired from CF
Posts: 13,317
Re: Using arc welder wiring

UL 1426 is the spec to look for.
john61ct is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-07-2018, 08:45   #28
Registered User
 
AKA-None's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Lake City MN
Boat: C&C 27 Mk III
Posts: 2,647
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallythacker View Post
Another question came to mind.

If the current for a particular run is going to be almost twice what the cable can carry is it OK to run another cable in parallel and crimp/solder them together to form a two conductor bundle?


Bundled wires behave differently. Crimp pressure changes characteristics depending on the insulation. To long of parallel runs can induce currents
__________________
Special knowledge can be a terrible disadvantage if it leads you too far along a path that you cannot explain anymore.
Frank Herbert 'Dune'
AKA-None is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-07-2018, 09:10   #29
Registered User
 
Colin A's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: East of the river CT
Boat: Oday Mariner 19 , Four Winns Marquis 16 OB, Kingfisher III
Posts: 657
Send a message via Skype™ to Colin A
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terra Nova View Post
NO way!
Technically ABYC allows you to parallel two conductors as long as both are over 8AWG and meet the ampacity requirement individually. In other works you can use them to lower voltage drop.
__________________
mysite: Colinism.com
Colin A is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-07-2018, 09:12   #30
Registered User
 
Colin A's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: East of the river CT
Boat: Oday Mariner 19 , Four Winns Marquis 16 OB, Kingfisher III
Posts: 657
Send a message via Skype™ to Colin A
Re: Using arc welder wiring

Also as I recall on soldering it has been submitted to ABYC as clarification by another forum member asking if solder could be added after a crimp, and I believe it was confirmed that was OK.
__________________
mysite: Colinism.com
Colin A is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
arc, wiring

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Crew Available: Ind / Med / ARC / ARC+ / transAt (24k nm exp. USA citizen) shoej Crew Positions: Wanted & Available 0 22-06-2018 06:58
ARC or ARC Europe Time2Go General Sailing Forum 3 31-01-2017 09:25
Doing the ARC-USA or ARC-Europe? We need you! BlueBuddha Our Community 0 17-03-2016 12:50
Crew Wanted: ARC Regatta 2012 + ARC Europe 2013 skip-per Crew Archives 2 07-02-2012 23:48
Alternator/Welder Wukong Construction, Maintenance & Refit 0 27-09-2005 21:01

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:54.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.