Strange Generator Problem

[Three Sisters]

Originally Posted by ontherocks83

Eh, a little gorilla tape and you'll be grand

Riiight. You'll have to promise to post in my upcoming lawn mower thread.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

This one?

Attachment 131160

I wonder if I can just epoxy this in place?

Drilling and tapping it would be pretty involved, and I'd have to find a fitting.

Ranger42, is this the same problem you had? Did you replace the housing or how did you solve it?

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

This one?

Attachment 131160

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I wonder if I can just epoxy this in place?

Drilling and tapping it would be pretty involved, and I'd have to find a fitting.

Ranger42, is this the same problem you had? Did you replace the housing or how did you solve it?

Yes, looks like it, sorta. The metal on ours is gray pot metal...

I just replaced with a new unit. Our unit was about 13-14 years old at the time... so perhaps it's an age thing. The part is a Yanmar part (sold by Kohler as Kohler but organic to the Yanmar diesel; very similar to the filter in our John Deere tractor with a slightly different 3-cylinder Yanmar diesel). Thinking about adding a hose clamp to hold it all together.

In retrospect, I may have had some warning that I didn't recognize. Sometimes there'd be what seemed like a bit of weeping around the filter sump. I interpreted that as not having the sump tight enough... but it might have been the inlet port was trying to tell me something.

I talked to Kohner about the idea of drilling and tapping. They suggested not so good, but he also admitted that's 'cause they'd have no way to test that. The concern was about being able to handle the pressure... although that's not high pressure, there. He also said they'd never heard of this kind of failure happening... although I'm not confident that's meaningful.

Shopped on some potential replacements, but the only one I found that came close (so far) is a small Racor... which would have been very elegant, but the port positioning made it so I couldn't mount it without interference from water pump hose or whatever.

-Chris

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by ranger42c

Yes, looks like it, sorta. The metal on ours is gray pot metal...

I just replaced with a new unit. Our unit was about 13-14 years old at the time... so perhaps it's an age thing. The part is a Yanmar part (sold by Kohler as Kohler but organic to the Yanmar diesel; very similar to the filter in our John Deere tractor with a slightly different 3-cylinder Yanmar diesel). Thinking about adding a hose clamp to hold it all together.

In retrospect, I may have had some warning that I didn't recognize. Sometimes there'd be what seemed like a bit of weeping around the filter sump. I interpreted that as not having the sump tight enough... but it might have been the inlet port was trying to tell me something.

I talked to Kohner about the idea of drilling and tapping. They suggested not so good, but he also admitted that's 'cause they'd have no way to test that. The concern was about being able to handle the pressure... although that's not high pressure, there. He also said they'd never heard of this kind of failure happening... although I'm not confident that's meaningful.

Shopped on some potential replacements, but the only one I found that came close (so far) is a small Racor... which would have been very elegant, but the port positioning made it so I couldn't mount it without interference from water pump hose or whatever.

-Chris

Thanks; very useful.


I'm thinking about just epoxying it in place. Mine is also pot metal, which doesn't tap very well (also immense hassle). The joint is smooth so I would think should glue pretty well. Do you see any reason not to do it that way?


Did your lift pump fail at the same time? Did you replace it with the Kohler part?

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I'm thinking about just epoxying it in place. Mine is also pot metal, which doesn't tap very well (also immense hassle). The joint is smooth so I would think should glue pretty well. Do you see any reason not to do it that way?

Did your lift pump fail at the same time? Did you replace it with the Kohler part?

I don't see any reason to not try epoxy.

The lift pump failed a couple months later. We replaced with a Kohler part number, but the lift pump is by Carter (clearly marked), what came is by Carter (in a Kohler box)... and a Carter unit (sold as Carter) would have likely been less expensive. I didn't have much time to fool with it, though, so we went with fastest solution at the time.

-Chris

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by ranger42c

I don't see any reason to not try epoxy.

The lift pump failed a couple months later. We replaced with a Kohler part number, but the lift pump is by Carter (clearly marked), what came is by Carter (in a Kohler box)... and a Carter unit (sold as Carter) would have likely been less expensive. I didn't have much time to fool with it, though, so we went with fastest solution at the time.

-Chris

Thanks. I'll try epoxy.

The Kohler pump is not all that expensive, so probably not worth messing with.

[a64pilot]

No, go with something meant to hold metal together, like maybe red loctite, there are specific loctite products just for this type of thing, just not familiar enough to recommend one.
Red loctite is awfully tough though.

Would an S-120 Racor work?

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

No, go with something meant to hold metal together, like maybe red loctite, there are specific loctite products just for this type of thing, just not familiar enough to recommend one.
Red loctite is awfully tough though.

Would an S-120 Racor work?

I thought epoxy works ok on metal?


Is red Loctite adhesive enough to hold this kind of thing together, which is not bolted or threaded?

I'm now in Cowes so can buy any kind of adhesive tomorrow, so not limited to what I have on board.

[Dockhead]

Looks like Red Loctite CAN be used for this:

"Q4: Can I use a threadlocker for non-threaded assemblies like locking bearings or bushings in housings or on shafts?
A: Yes, you can. Traditionally we recommend retaining compounds like LOCTITE 609 or LOCTITE 603 but threadlockers are the same base chemistry and could be substituted in many cases. In fact, years ago Threadlocker LOCTITE 271 was referenced as Stud & Bearing Mount. Inversely, you could use retaining compounds "


But wouldn't epoxy have more body and seal more solidly?

[a64pilot]

I don't think anything holds metal to metal like Loctite, that is it's sole purpose.
Stuff is tenacious, just do not use red Loctite (Stud and bearing mount) on anything that you want to take apart readily.
If you have a loose bearing shell that the shell will rotate in the housing, that is what it is for, will adhere that bearing shell into the housing so no more movement, and of course that is not threaded.
It says right on the package may require excessive force and or heat to remove, heat is the trick, get it hot and it softens right up.

Try it, you will like it

[a64pilot]

Loctite is I think based on Eastman's 910 adhesive, the original superglue, it hardens when air is removed, I know cause I ruined a big bottle years ago, I squeezed the air out thinking it would last longer that way

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Thanks. I'll try epoxy.

The Kohler pump is not all that expensive, so probably not worth messing with.

Yeah, wasn't huge cost... but the marina chandlery charged me $140 US and I'd bet some shopping would turn it up for $80 US or so. Just speculating, though.

-Chris

[ranger58sb]

Speaking of either epoxy or Loc-tite... not sure you could get the stuff to run inside, between the female and mail parts of the inlet fitting... without separating the pieces first.


That'd be good to know; if I thought red Loc-tite would seep into there, I'd probably try that in a heartbeat... but after all, the fitting is originally supposed to be liquid-tight...


That was why I'd first thought of some kind of mechanical fastening, like a hose-clamp...


-Chris

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by ranger42c

Speaking of either epoxy or Loc-tite... not sure you could get the stuff to run inside, between the female and mail parts of the inlet fitting... without separating the pieces first.


That'd be good to know; if I thought red Loc-tite would seep into there, I'd probably try that in a heartbeat... but after all, the fitting is originally supposed to be liquid-tight...


That was why I'd first thought of some kind of mechanical fastening, like a hose-clamp...


-Chris

No way to use a mechanical fastener on it -- the fitting is pressed into a hole in the pot metal filter housing. It's absolute carp design -- utter carp.

Maybe really worth trying to use a different and better filter.

But in the short term I will try Red Loctite or JB Weld or epoxy.

[ranger58sb]

Yep, carp.





But I think a big-a$$ hose clamp around the whole upper assembly, including the inlet port/hose fitting, could work. Or maybe a wire tie or zip tie. At least enough to avoid catastrophic failure.


-Chris