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Old 24-03-2013, 06:02   #1
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Solar Panel charger battery Question

Hi all, I have just installed 2 x 130watt panels running through a Blue Sky Solar Boost 3024iL MPPT solar charger, with a IPN-Pro Remote, I have 6 x 6v 225ah Trojans hooked in series and parrallel for 12v, I also have a 12volt deep cycle marine battery as a starter, I have hooked up the 240v charger neg side to the load side of the shunt along with the solar charger negative as stated in instructions, I have a BEP VSR relay module which cuts in at 13.7v to charge the start battery and cuts out at 12.8v, my start battery positive runs to the start side of this relay and the negative hooks up to the house batteries, hope this is all correct, I am currently in marina and have 240v charger switched on, as we live aboard and are using more power than we would if out on hook, my question finally, now you have all the info !!!!! in the IPN-Pro Remote it asks total amp hours, do I include the start battery amp hours ???? I also have a Victron BMV602S dual battery monitor, can I hook this up using the shunt so I can have this at the Helm, so I can monitor especially start battery state whilst sailing, its good also has an alarm.
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Old 24-03-2013, 14:46   #2
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

Hi Mike, cant answer your question, but at least it gets bumped.
I have the 3024iL with IPN Remote and current shunt, but only using it to charge the house bank, I dont have a VSR, if needed, I can parallel the start battery to the house bank.
I also have a NASA battery monitor which was fitted before the solar was installed.
I have the shunts for both monitors wired in series on the negative side of the battery. The shunts have different ratings so needed to use both.
From what I have read of the BMV602, it only measures current on one bank, but can read the voltages of two banks.
I've seen DC circuit drawings showing two shunts in place to monitor two banks, so I guess its doable, you could put the 602 shunt on the start battery.
I'm not that bothered about the start battery monitoring, the start battery switch is only closed when the engine is running, soon as the engine goes off, I isolate the battery at the switch. I'm still able to start the engine from the house bank if I need to.
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Old 24-03-2013, 15:14   #3
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

Not a good idea to use a deep cycle (unless its AGM) battery for start.
Start batteries have thin plates designed to give a lot of current for a short time. Deep cycle batteries are exactly the opposite
1. If the starter battery neg is connected to the house bank negative then both battery's current goes through the shunt...include the start battery in your total (sounds like your set up)
2. If the start negative goes to the ground side of the shunt (my preference) don't include the start battery in your total.
My preference is 2. above since you really only need to know the capacity of your house bank. If everything is setup and working correctly the start battery is charged everytime you run your engine and / or whenever your solar gets above 13.7.

However I would have thought you should have the neg of your 240V charger and the neg off your solar on the ground side of the shunt not the load side. Otherwise your meter will never see the charge current. My understanding is that these monitors would need to see the current going into and out of the battery bank.

But maybe I'm wrong...just seems sensible?
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Old 24-03-2013, 15:53   #4
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

Typical practice is to run all the negative loads through the shunt and measure the SOC on the negative side. As I understand the description the OP has the battery negs connected to one side of the shunt and all the other negative connections on the other side of the shunt. That is correct.

The question is whether to include the capacity of the start battery in the total amp hours value. My guess is the answer is "no". The reason I say that is I believe the start battery is isolated from the house bank. Put another way, if the house bank can be discharged without affecting the state of charge of the start battery then DO NOT include the ampacity of the start battery in the total amp value.
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Old 24-03-2013, 15:59   #5
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

Generally most boats are only interested in the amp hours in and out of the house bank.
Starting the engine uses a lot of amps, but only for a very short time, so the amp hours out are very small. The start battery should normally only drop in capacity very slightly.
It's worth monitoring the start battery volts so you can see if the charging to the start battery has failed, or as an early waning of failing battery (look at the volts while cranking the engine), but monitoring its amp hours or state of charge is not very useful, and most battery monitors will only do this for the house bank.

The exception is some European boats that run the anchor winch and bow thruster from the start battery. Particularly with a bow thruster draining from the start battery, monitoring the state of charge of the "start" battery can assume greater importance, but if you want to do this two battery monitors are usually needed. For most boats this is overkill.
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Old 24-03-2013, 16:47   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobofthenorth View Post
Typical practice is to run all the negative loads through the shunt and measure the SOC on the negative side. As I understand the description the OP has the battery negs connected to one side of the shunt and all the other negative connections on the other side of the shunt. That is correct.
I agree Bob, my answer was not very clear... one end of the shunt should have all the charger negatives and load negatives connected together and the other end of the shunt connected to the battery negative (and nothing else)...that way all current goes through the shunt..in and out.
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Old 24-03-2013, 17:05   #7
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

To answer your question, do not include the AH rating of the Start battery in programming the battery monitor. Its erring on the safe side.
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Old 25-03-2013, 00:38   #8
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

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Originally Posted by ozmike View Post
....my start battery positive runs to the start side of this relay and the negative hooks up to the house batteries, hope this is all correct........
As others have said the ONLY negative connection to the house bank is to the shunt so all negative connections go via this. Usually a new busbar is needed for all the cables. The starter battery negative must also go via this new busbar, not directly to a house battery negative.

Sell the second battery monitor and buy a cheap digital voltmeter for the cockpit to monitor the starter battery if you're worried about that.
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Old 25-03-2013, 04:19   #9
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

Thanks everyone, Yes I have just entered the house bank total, with 260watts of solar I was getting 4.2amps at 2.30pm, nigel1, I don't understand the Equalize now at 15.4v ? That comes up on the menu, and what's with the Aux Bat on menu ? I am slowly figuring it out we are testing usage at the moment at 8pm it said we still have 10 hrs, someone suggested today that I should charge the start battery first then the house, ahhhhh I have already wired it the other way, and anyway nothing but the engine is on the start battery, what's it going to use, will move the start battery neg to the load side of the shunt, thanks again for the replies, need as much help as I can get with this stuff.
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Old 25-03-2013, 05:02   #10
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

The Aux Bat on the menu is for Auxiliary Battery. The 3024 has an auxiliary output which you can use to charge another battery. If Aux Bat is enabled and if you have connected another battery to the Aux connection on the 3024, the 3024 can provide 2A charge current to that battery, provided the 3024 is in float or acceptance mode.

The Equalise Now function: The 3024 is shipped with the Equalise function disabled.
As you have the IPN remote you can control equalisation using the remote, but need to set the Dip switch 5 in the 3024 to the on position. The equalise settings (voltage and time and interval) can be set with the IPN remote.(Setup menu 3)
You can now elect to enable auto equalise, or you can disable the auto mode and start a manual equalise cycle using the "Equalise Now" function

This is how I have set mine, equalise voltage 15.4V, Time 2 hrs, Set Auto Equalize : Off

If I want to run an equalise cycle, I just use the Equalise Now function
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Old 25-03-2013, 05:54   #11
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Thanks heaps nigel1, went straight over my head with the equaliser but more I read the more I understand, aux battery output like a little trickle charge, will check that out, thanks for the menu instructions, a few more months and I will be a Pro with the Pro haha, hear you are having a bad cold spell over there, guess you don't want to hear 5 of us boats from the club are going out to an island, just one the hundreds we have in the Whitsundays, for the 4 days, thanks again for the help
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Old 25-03-2013, 06:28   #12
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Re: Solar Panel charger battery Question

Quite right, I do not want to hear about your trip to the Whitsundays
Now in the 6th day of bouncing around the North Sea waiting for the swell to drop down before moving a jack up rig.

I did spend some time many years ago crewing on the "Southern Cross" out of Airlie Beach doing trips out to the islands. Happy days
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Old 26-06-2013, 20:55   #13
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Nigel, have tried for the past few months to set this IPN remote up with the 3024i charge controller, with no luck, the victron meter seems to be reading it correctly, but the 3024 reads wrong. Something must be set up wrong. I have 6 6v 225ah T105 Trojans, linked together to give me 3 x 225ah @ 12v plus a 100ah start battery, my readings on the meters are as follows.
Victron. House. 12.72v. Start. 12.66v. SOC. 96.2%
3024. House. 12.8 v. Start. 12.7 v. SOC. 20.0%
Could you give me a run thru of what I should set things at, as I have tried everything, I also hooked up the start battery to the 2amp aux, do I have to switch the #4 to on, when I do the aux light comes on, but the ipn says load control output - ON, the aux bat screen has gone ? Have set the equalize to the settings you use, it is currently at 12.9v equalize is flashing continuous green, when does the 120 minutes start counting down ?
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