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Old 26-03-2018, 05:04   #1
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Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Hi,

we have a pretty heavy Honda style air cooled 2kw genset on board.
At the moment it "lives" in the portside aft lazerette. All with proper exhaust pipes and extraction fans (which we run before starting it!).
We open the hatch too of the lazerette when we run it.
The lazerette is completely separated from the boat interior.

Still for service access its a real pain. I am thinking about relocating it.
So I wonder about how other people handle and possibly install their 2Kw Honda style gensets.

The smaller 1Kw models are easy to take out of a locker, but the bigger ones?
If you have pictures of your installations even better.

I'll take some of mine next week.

Btw. This is not about seawater cooled diesel gensets.
They are not an option on a lot of boats due to cost and weight.

It's appreciated if you share your thoughts and experiences with those air cooled gensets.

Franziska
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Old 26-03-2018, 06:03   #2
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Most of the ones I see are run on Deck. I have a neighbor that covers his with a big tupperware container when not under use of course this is at anchor if you were under way you would have to secure it
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Old 26-03-2018, 06:59   #3
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

I keep my Honda 2000 in the aft lazarette and put it on deck when I use it. It is stored in an old sail bag and I use this as a cover when on deck at anchor. It has a 30 amp twist lock connection. Back in the locker when underway. This locker has no communication with the inside of the boat except through tight wire chases as I worried about fumes.

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Old 26-03-2018, 07:10   #4
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

When I had one I strapped it to one of my stern lockers that was behind the cockpit.
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Old 26-03-2018, 07:10   #5
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Franziska, I am afraid that this is one occasion being a girlie isn't in your favour. Lifting our Honda 20i out of a cockpit locker was a one handed lift.

However, what to do about it? Do you have space on the cat for a deck box with lourvred sides and a canvas cover to keep the weather out when not in use?

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Old 26-03-2018, 07:53   #6
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Franziska

Sorry I missed the female part, although as I age my daughter is getting stronger than me.

I could easily attach a block and tackle to the handle of the Honda and hoist out of the locker. I have not used a block and tackle but have used a rope on the handle at times I donít feel like being bottoms up in the Lazarette.

When I am being smart (brains not brawn) I use mechanical advantage, Iím just not often smart. I use falls utilizing the arch or boom or a pole and halyard (gin pole) to lift things. Lifting the Honda 2000 is at the top end of my unassisted lifting abilities.

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Old 26-03-2018, 08:54   #7
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Hey guys, thanks for the thoughts.

If I pull myself together I manage just about to lift it vertically up under calm weather conditions.

It gets more tricky when there is a swell and that the tiller gets in the way does not help.
Unfortunately my boom does not reach over it neither.
To add more I need to wrestle it 1m forward.

So I think it will have to be an on deck box in the cockpit after all.
The issue I have with that is that I am afraid to have it "live" outside, might turn into a rust bucket quickly.
Maybe I should source an oversized watertight bag for it and spray it frequently with WD40 or similar.

Just thinking aloud in this thread.

Hmmmm, sometimes it would be nice to be the green skinned Hulk :-)... not.
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Old 26-03-2018, 09:15   #8
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Franziska View Post
Maybe I should source an oversized watertight bag for it and spray it frequently with WD40 or similar.
Don't go completely waterproof or condensation will take it out in short order. Think of american barns with roof and sides walls but gaps in walls to allow air to circulate. So yes to a cover to keep rain off but can allow air underneath.

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Old 26-03-2018, 09:24   #9
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Good point.

Alternativly I could add space for a dehumidifier inside the bag.

But that's probably overkill.

Only stupid thing is now, that I decided where to relocate it to, I need to come up with a new location for the liferaft :-)
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Old 26-03-2018, 09:26   #10
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

I was going to replace the 2kW with a 1kW but I think realistically I ought to keep the bigger one.
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Old 26-03-2018, 09:29   #11
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

I moved away from a large one and went to a Clark 850w which is only about 8kg. I don't use it underway and simply move it to a downwind spot. It's quiet, 850w is enough for our purposes and so far, so good. Sell the large one and get a small one!
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Old 26-03-2018, 09:52   #12
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Franziska View Post
Hey guys, thanks for the thoughts.
Hmmmm, sometimes it would be nice to be the green skinned Hulk :-)... not.
Agreed - "Hulk -NOT" choice, its not a good look.

I have had this as we moor on a pontoon without power. I had a 1Kw kipor, I could lift it and it lived in the shower tray when not used. It was not enough to run a 2Kw heater when the eberspacher failed or a microwave, not enough spare umph, so I bought a 2Kw Kipor, I struggle with it, it lives on the saloon floor but I'm warm, charged and microwaved. I have now fitted a new 5Kw heater but I still like having 2Kw of power available. I also have a 1kw inverter so I could go back to the smaller genny and get a bigger inverter.

Definitely a work in progress.
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Old 26-03-2018, 09:52   #13
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Franziska View Post

So I think it will have to be an on deck box in the cockpit after all.
The issue I have with that is that I am afraid to have it "live" outside, might turn into a rust bucket quickly.
Ours has lived outside completely uncovered for 2 years of cruising. However it is somewhat protected on our cat and never sees salt water spray. Sure its rusted a little bit (the fasteners required coating in Tefgel). I will post a picture if you are interested in how its been affected.

We are thinking of making a cover soon as the black plastic panels on the back and front are starting to sun fade.
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Old 26-03-2018, 09:55   #14
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

Years ago I was able to design a simple safe and reliable generator, here is the Patent: https://patents.google.com/patent/US6579137B2/en

A 1000W honda EU or Yamaha will be much easier to handle, they run a mini HVAC 4200 able to dry and keep comfortable a cabin set on econo mode, 3/4 gal for 7 hours. if you follow the dry heater exhaust of a diesel heater, that is basically the same principle, extend the exhaust tube, and discharge overboard, do not go more than 10 inches, isolate pipe with carbon fiber motorcycle exhaust tape, open a discharge thru hull bronze or stainless larger than the generator exhaust pipe with insulation about 1 1/4 ID. locate a dry location for your air intake. add a carbon monoxide detector smoke detector inside to prevent accidents and you will be in business. the amount of air needed for the engine combustion is about the same as the one needed to cool the engine. we did over the years several tests on RVs with just the exhaust coming out. The compartment was always safe and no danger of fire. we used a remote fuel tank for safety. kit is sold on ebay.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Franziska View Post
Hi,

we have a pretty heavy Honda style air cooled 2kw genset on board.
At the moment it "lives" in the portside aft lazerette. All with proper exhaust pipes and extraction fans (which we run before starting it!).
We open the hatch too of the lazerette when we run it.
The lazerette is completely separated from the boat interior.

Still for service access its a real pain. I am thinking about relocating it.
So I wonder about how other people handle and possibly install their 2Kw Honda style gensets.

The smaller 1Kw models are easy to take out of a locker, but the bigger ones?
If you have pictures of your installations even better.

I'll take some of mine next week.

Btw. This is not about seawater cooled diesel gensets.
They are not an option on a lot of boats due to cost and weight.

It's appreciated if you share your thoughts and experiences with those air cooled gensets.

Franziska
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Old 26-03-2018, 11:51   #15
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Re: Small air cooled generators, installations, handling. Examples anyone?

@TravellerW
Thanks for instilling some hope that the genset could survive a while in the deck box.
Yes, love to see some pix how it looks now.

@Fiona
thats a thought, bigger inverter on the small genset.
Still I am afraid it will not pump out enough current (even at 110V or 220V) to run a 2kW inverter which could run the 2kW space heater.
It's a question of what goes in can come out. Higher voltage does not mean more watts.
At the moment I have the genset to produce hot water, charging the batteries and occasionally run the space heater.

Mind you, thinking of getting a Diesel heater (despite not using Diesel for anything else).
Than I would only need the big genny for the future RO watermaker.
So maybe the plan would be:

*Keep big genset for now
*Buy and install Diesel heater
*Swap the 2kW genset for 1kW
*Get a Power Survivor 40E as watermaker

We do not use a microwave and are used to use little water +rain collection adds also occasionally.



@Mabru
the outboard style genset would have been great! Shame noone built it.
To bad there are no inexpensive small (lightweight) water-cooled petrol driven gensets around. Diesel is always heavy, fuel cells are no option for real cruising.
If the petral genset compartment is totally separate and properly force vented before ignition they are not so risky as some people feel.
After all there are still a lot of boats with petrol inboards around too.
Is the HVAC4200 an electric space heater? Over here I could not source one with less than 1500Watts.

@Grant
Regarding downsizing, I have contemplated this for a long while too, the drawback is that even a small 2kW space heater will not run on them, neither will some of the smaller watermakers. I'm still in a norther n climate, so sometimes the electric heater comes handy.

With the 2kW genset I can produce hot water and charge the batteries or produce freshwater and charge the batteries.
In both cases running times get reduced.

Another option would be though to get two Honda i10eu and run them in parallel if needed.
That would also give redundancy too, which is never bad.
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