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Old 14-06-2011, 19:24   #31
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Re: Rolls verse AGM batteries

Over a couple of decades in the business and having sold and install all kinds of "exotic" and regular batteries, I have come to the conclusion that unless you are actually cruising far and wide and going places where you do not have access to replacement batteries - then buy the ordinary Liquid Lead Acid - Maintenance Free (sealed) batteries. This is by and large the most cost effective. They do not need state of the art charging regulators, and all the other stuff. Use them, abuse them and then replace them.
The exotics - AGM, Surrette/Rolls make sense only if you are going to cruise to places where it is next to impossible to get replacement batteries. And if you choose "exotics" then you do need the go the whole nine yards and get start of the art charging and regulation systems and battery monitoring systems. All of which add up to some serious money. But if you are in the Patagonian Canals working your way around to Cape Horn then they make sense.
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Old 14-06-2011, 19:36   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by osirissail
Over a couple of decades in the business and having sold and install all kinds of "exotic" and regular batteries, I have come to the conclusion that unless you are actually cruising far and wide and going places where you do not have access to replacement batteries - then buy the ordinary Liquid Lead Acid - Maintenance Free (sealed) batteries. This is by and large the most cost effective. They do not need state of the art charging regulators, and all the other stuff. Use them, abuse them and then replace them.
The exotics - AGM, Surrette/Rolls make sense only if you are going to cruise to places where it is next to impossible to get replacement batteries. And if you choose "exotics" then you do need the go the whole nine yards and get start of the art charging and regulation systems and battery monitoring systems. All of which add up to some serious money. But if you are in the Patagonian Canals working your way around to Cape Horn then they make sense.
^. This. 
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Old 13-05-2013, 14:06   #33
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Re: Rolls verse AGM batteries

Quote:
= My philosophy is to buy 'em cheap, run 'em hard, and plan on replacing them.
If that is indeed your philosophy then the Costco golf cart batteries are the way to go. About $100 each.
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Old 13-05-2013, 14:25   #34
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

We have both Rolls 8D's and FullRiver AGM 8D's in our separate house banks. The AGMs are located where it is almost impossible to service the batteries. What I have noticed over 6 years of use is that both banks are still in (apparent) good condition, but that the AGMs are faster to charge. We do charge both banks with our alternator set to AGM charging parameters but on shore power we charge both banks separately to their individual charge parameters. If I were to do it over I would go for the AGMs for both banks. Another factor to consider is that when charging from a generator, the AGMs require less run time because of the faster charge rate.
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Old 13-05-2013, 15:20   #35
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

My previous boat had six 6vdc wet cell golf cart batteries of some cheap noname brand that were 15yrs. old when we sold the boat and still going strong.

My current boat had two brand new banks of Rolls for house use. The invoice says $4,200.00. One bank is till ok. The other bank just died after 5yrs.

I'm going to chuck the other bank and go to no name golf cart battereis.
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Old 13-05-2013, 16:38   #36
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

I have had shiva for 28 years this August and have had several versions of batteries... switching and charging and amp hours.

flooded wet cells w/ 1, 2 Both switch bosch alternator w/ regulator, 110w solar cells
gels - 2 - 8D, BlueSeas 8080 switch, 120 amp w/ quad cycle smart regulator, 110w solar cells
AGMs - 2 - 8D, Optima blue top start, BlueSeas 8080 switch, Balmar 614 smart regulator, echo charge, 110w solar cells

The latest version has seen the AGMs replaced after 7 years... The replacements cost 950 for the pair. The first set were about 800 for the pair... so it's costing about $100+ / yr for batts. Current monitor is a Link 20.

I don't want to deal with topping off water and so prefer maintenance free. AGMs seem to work fine. Here's the current battery compartment. Not shown is the Optima which is in the next compartment (alone)

Boat is on a mooring all 7 months of the year and stored in water for 5
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Old 13-05-2013, 17:04   #37
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

This is an old thread from when I needed last to replace my batteries (I went with 6V golf cart Deka's).

My current thinking is screw batteries! I'm going use and abuse them for the most part (within reason meaning I'm not going to worry about them anymore). If they last 4 years great, if they last 7 years even better. But they are so low cost for the amount of use/time you get out them that it works out to be pretty cheap compared to the other stuff that gets replaced/fixed all the time. If they last 4-5 years that is $100/year cost; there are bigger things to think about than batteries that are costing $100/year!
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Old 13-05-2013, 17:33   #38
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

My current set of Interstate wet cell deep cycle 12-volt batteries is going on 6 years old and they still have plenty of life in them. The best bang for the buck is to get wet cell deep cycles on sale and cheap and then figure on five years or so then replace. One advantage of going 12 volt is you can always find another battery if you need one--maybe not deep cycle, but something to get you to a place where you can get a proper battery. It's also possible to pull a bad battery out of the system and still have 12 volts. Still, I might go Sam's Club 6-volt golf carts next time.
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Old 13-05-2013, 19:53   #39
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

[QUOTE=Don L;1234643]This is an old thread from when I needed last to replace my batteries (I went with 6V golf cart Deka's).

I am curious why you went with high quality Dekka's instead of el cheapo Costco GC for about $100 each.
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Old 14-05-2013, 04:56   #40
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

[QUOTE=northwestsailor;1234775]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don L View Post
This is an old thread from when I needed last to replace my batteries (I went with 6V golf cart Deka's).

I am curious why you went with high quality Dekka's instead of el cheapo Costco GC for about $100 each.
Because they were easier to go pick-up and were $110 each so why run all other the place.
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Old 14-05-2013, 05:29   #41
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

AGMs have no place on a boat, they have good characteristics that cannot be typically exploited on a normal boat and bad characteristics that unfortunately do manifest themselves on a boat. There are mis-sold by the industry as a 'better' alternative to flooded wet cells, The result , wasted money and underperforming batteries.

If your requirements are modest, get a open cell, flodded LA battery, bigger banks of cheaper batteries are better then a smaller bank of high quality batteries stressed to the max.

Given a similar cost for Rolls/Trojan to AGMs, is Rolls/Trojan all the way , better yet are traction batteries.

Just stay away from Gels and AGMS, ( unless you have a fighter jet!)

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Old 14-05-2013, 09:16   #42
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

BTW, depending totally on store policy, your local Costco usually will NOT tell you what batteries are in stock, or when they are due, or order them in for you. So if you want to buy Costco batteries, you need to go to Costco, treasure hunt on the shelf, and if they're not there, come back again tomorrow until they are. IF that store stocks that type of battery in that size at all.

Treasure hunt? For batteries?

Their idea is that this will bring you back to the store more often. My response was that I don't have that many hours to waste in this life.

Battery distributors and stores know how to answer the phone. Yes, this is way below Costco's normal standards of service, your local one may be smarter.
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Old 14-05-2013, 09:47   #43
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

Quote:
Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
AGMs have no place on a boat, they have good characteristics that cannot be typically exploited on a normal boat and bad characteristics that unfortunately do manifest themselves on a boat. There are mis-sold by the industry as a 'better' alternative to flooded wet cells, The result , wasted money and underperforming batteries.
[...]
That may be, but as a counterexample my boat has a house bank of 4 8D AGMs (almost 1000 Ah), which were installed in 2001. They have generally been lightly used, but have been stressed heavily during our various multi-week pacific passages. Once a year I do a 24-hour load test on this bank, and they are still delivering at near new capacity. I see no sign that they are due for replacement. These batteries are truly maintenance-free, and have served me well for well over a decade.

Of course, my chargers are set for AGM levels.
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Old 14-05-2013, 10:17   #44
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

I agree that Flooded LA has many advantages over AGMs, but many boats have the batteries located when watering them is difficult to impossible, furthering the likelihood that they will be allowed to run dry. Also, many boats are built assuming AGMs and the "compartments" are not suitable to flooded batteries, i.e. they offer no leak containment, inadequate ventilation, and are located in areas that are not ignition protected.
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Old 14-05-2013, 10:25   #45
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Re: Rolls versus AGM Batteries

I've always had good service from AGM for both EV use and remote home site use. For the EVs I've used the pricey Odyssey, and for off grid I've use 700 a-hr 2 volt AGM in a string for 48 volts to feed the inverter. Now that the price has dropped on Winston LiFePO4 cells, I have no need for lead anymore.
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