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Old 03-12-2012, 10:37   #1
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Paris Rhone Alternator Output

As part of the charging system upgrade, I purchased an Adverc Alternator Regulator, and a Sterling "No Loss" battery splitter.
The original alternator charging system had the output from the alternator to a diode type battery isolator/splitter, to three battery banks. With the alternator running, would see 13.8V on the battery monitor.
I've now fitted the Adverc regulator, and the Sterling charge splitter, and with the engine running, the battery monitor shows 14.6V (same when measured with multimeter across the B+ terminal and negative), but, the Adverc does not seem to be functioning. The Adverc regulator is meant to hold the boost voltage to 14.6V for 5 minutes, and then drop to 14.2V for 15 minutes, and then repeats the cycle.
I did not get any drop in voltage. Disconnected the Adverc, which leaves the standard regulator controlling the output, and voltage is 14.6v.
I called the Adverc makers, and was told that the Adverc cannot drop the voltage from from the standard regulator, hence the reason why the voltage remained at 14.6v with the Adverc connected.
They suggested trying to connect the sense wire from the standard regulator direct to the B+ terminal rather than to sense terminal on the charge splitter. (not tried that yet, but when I was testing the system, I was getting 14.6v across B+ and negative)
The regulator attached to the alternator is a new one,
Wood Auto Supplies Ltd :: VRG4699
which according to the spec has a voltage set point of 14.2V.

Anyone have any suggestions what the problem could be, 14.6V is too high for a long duration. Could it just be a dodgy regulator on the alternator. I have a spare regulator I could try, but before going to the effort of replacing, would like to hear any ideas
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Old 03-12-2012, 11:45   #2
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

could be that the paris rhone alternator has a battery sensed regulator,as opposed to a machine sensed regulator,and is allready doing what your new regulator is supposed to do.
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Old 03-12-2012, 11:54   #3
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

Why would you be running both regulators?
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Old 04-12-2012, 01:00   #4
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

Hi Atoll, the PR regulator does have a battery sense connection, can be either connected to battery, or to machine. Currently it is connected to battery.
According to the spec of the PR regulator, the voltage set point is 14.2V, so I would not expect it to go above that.
As to why both regulators are connected, is because that is how the Adverc works, the Adverc does not have brushes, and is remote from the alternator.
It is designed that in the event that the Adverc fails, the Paris Rhone regulator will continue to regulate.
All the Adverc is meant to do is improve the rate of battery of battery charging.
I'll try the old regulator and the spare during the week, and see what happens, just a PITA to remove.
BTW the batteries are pretty well charged, so I would expect to see a lower voltage output from the regulator, bit I'm no expert
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Old 04-12-2012, 02:16   #5
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

i'm no expert either,but all the volvo engines i have had on various boats have had paris rhone alternators,either 60amp 12v or 80amp 24v units,regulating at 14.4v and 28.8v when fully charged but putting out very little current.

on discharged batteries the initial voltage will be around 13.4-13.6,but putting out 30-40 amps,or 26.6v-28v at 40-60 amps charge tapering off as the voltage comes up.

by"machine sensed" i was refering to the type of regulator you would find in a typical car or truck alternator,that does not have a charge cycle programmed in ,for which the adverc type regulator,would effectively convert the alternator's ability to incorporate in a charge cycle as you would find on a "battery sensed" marine type alternator.

ie your marine "battery sensed" paris rhone is allready doing what the adverk reglator is supposed to do on a conventional alternator.

edit you should also try testing with discharged batteries if you want to see the charge cycle,could be that there is high voltage,but very little charge current.
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Old 04-12-2012, 02:40   #6
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

Hi Alex
I'll run the batteries down and then try again.
When I ran the engine yesterday, with the batteries near charged, (and cold), the monitor showed 14.6V and about 3 to 4 amps.
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Old 04-12-2012, 02:42   #7
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

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Originally Posted by nigel1 View Post
Hi Alex
I'll run the batteries down and then try again.
When I ran the engine yesterday, with the batteries near charged, (and cold), the monitor showed 14.6V and about 3 to 4 amps.
that sounds about right,was that a proper multimeter,or a vdo type guage?
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Old 04-12-2012, 03:13   #8
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

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Originally Posted by atoll View Post
that sounds about right,was that a proper multimeter,or a vdo type guage?
That was measured with the NASA Battery Monitor, and I used a multimeter to double check the output voltage.
I'm just a bit concerned that 14.6 v (even with low amps) could cause the batteries to gas if the alternator is running for a prolonged period.
I tried to get hold of the regulator makers today, but unfortunately their techy person is out today. Spoke to Adverc, and they reckon that if the Paris Rhone Regulator has a set voltage point of 14.2, then it should not go above that when run with the Adverc disconnected.
While I was looking for info yesterday, I did see some Paris Rhone rgegs advertised with set points of 14.6, but the one I have definitely says 14.2.
Have to wait until the weekend, need the GF to hold a spanner while I get the alt off again.
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Old 04-12-2012, 06:54   #9
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

I dont know the age of your system, but many of the Paris Phone/Valeo regulators are set to 14.4. There has been a gradual increase in setpoint over the last few years.

Ultimately the BM unit doesnt really have a lot of advantages these days.

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Old 04-12-2012, 07:15   #10
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

Thanks Dave, according to the regulator maker/supplier, the set point should be 14.2.
If it is in fact 14.6, then the Adverc has been a waste of money I think.
BTW, is 14.6v set point OK, or will it cause batteries to gas if the engine is running for some time??
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Old 04-12-2012, 08:21   #11
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

Quote:
Originally Posted by nigel1 View Post
Thanks Dave, according to the regulator maker/supplier, the set point should be 14.2.
If it is in fact 14.6, then the Adverc has been a waste of money I think.
BTW, is 14.6v set point OK, or will it cause batteries to gas if the engine is running for some time??
You'll need a temperature sensor on the battery 14.6 can be too much in certain temps. Check teh specs on your batteries, some have slightly higher absorption voltages

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Old 04-12-2012, 11:27   #12
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
You'll need a temperature sensor on the battery 14.6 can be too much in certain temps. Check teh specs on your batteries, some have slightly higher absorption voltages

Dave
According to the battery specs, 14.4v is recommended for absorption.
The Paris Rhone regulator does not have a temp sensor, but the Adverc BM does.
Before I try changing out the PR reg, I'll run the batteries down, and then run the alt. to see what volts I get.
Hopefully will be able to talk to someone from the makers tomorrow about the reg. set point
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Old 17-12-2012, 10:15   #13
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Re: Paris Rhone Alternator Output

Just to close the thread. I tried the spare alternator regualtor, same output as the other one, 14.6.
Ran the batteries down to about 50%, then tried it again. Output was 13.6V, lots of Amps, then the Adverc started to do its thing, and so all OK.
Makers of the regulator reckoned 14.6 was within range, even if the rated set point of the regulator is stated as 14.2.
Guess so long as I dont run the alternator for hours and hours with no load on the batteries, it should be OK
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