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Old 20-06-2012, 01:41   #31
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Re: LED CONVERSION

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
"It is the best color, but we found they were a little to harsh for general lighting in the cabin area. " White LEDs actually come in a range of colors, even from the same single production run. If you think about paint, or yarn, you know that you have to buy a matching "color lot" or else the colors will not match from one piece to the next. Same thing with LEDs, even the best are sold as "assorted" or "graded" and if the wholesaler wants all the LEDs to be the same color and brightness--they may pay 5x-10x more for them. Otherwise "the same" white LEDs from prime makers may come in four distinct colors, with a brightness that doubles in four steps (i.e. 1x, 2x, 4x, 8x as bright).
The question of quality of light from LED's is more than just a question of color. It's a question of coherence of the light and the beam pattern, too.

Most LED light has an unpleasant and unnatural appearance. It seems to lack warmth, somehow, and to be strangely harsh, even if a yellowish tint is added (I understand that "warm white" LED's simply have a filter layer over them). You do get used to it to some extent, but it is a fact of life with LED cabin lighting.
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Old 20-06-2012, 02:44   #32
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Re: LED CONVERSION

I replaced my cheap $1.98 each Chinese bulbs with Sensibulbs. The light is quite warm and I really like the level. There is some radio noise however.
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Old 20-06-2012, 07:12   #33
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Re: LED CONVERSION

Dockhead-
There's adding tints (not so great) and there's making the light right to start with. There are a couple of "white" LED technologies, and one of the better ones actually makes the LED into a small fluorescent bulb. That is, there's actually an ultraviolet invisible LED in the middle, surrounded by a phosphor coating that glows and emits the "white" light, pretty much the exact same way that a fluorescent tube does. (But you call the "neon" tubes in the UK, don't you?)

You may recall how harsh fl. lights were in the 60's. Same problem, same reason, if you want a mix of phosphors that provide a good spectrum, a wide spectrum, an attractive spectrum, that bumps the price WAY UP. And if the right spectrum isn't there to start with, no amount of tinting can make it happen. Tints only block excess, they can't add anything to the mix.

I've used some "warm" (to me, yellow-golden) LED strips in kitchen lighting and they make a nice color for what they are doing. But for primary lighting...I'd still think I was in the anteroom of a I don't know what. The white LED bulbs sold to replace home incandescents do a much better job but they're rather pricey right now. ($15-20 for a 40W equivalent ?!) They actually look yellow when not lit.
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Old 20-06-2012, 10:12   #34
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Re: LED CONVERSION

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Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
(...) You may recall how harsh fl. lights were in the 60's. Same problem, same reason, if you want a mix of phosphors (...)
I remember reading an explanation where it was claimed that harshness was due to frequency.

We are using (220V) modern fluos here that give absolutely fabulous light temperature, cost a fraction of a decent LED and deliver lumens at least to match a typical LED bulb (actually better lum/Watt as compared to most of off-the-shelf LEDs).

Alas, we are stuck with 220 Volts as the only source of same 12 Volt bulbs I found is Stecca (?) and none of local shops has them in stock here ;-(.

Cheers,
b.
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Old 20-06-2012, 10:37   #35
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Re: LED CONVERSION

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
I have about three trillion halogen puck lights on my boat. Well, I'm exaggerating, but I think in reality dozens. I have been gradually converting them to LED over the three years I have owned the boat using a few units each from a different maker every time. I don't much like the light, and I've found that bad light comes in a remarkable variety of forms.

I found the expensive Sensibulbs to be pretty much carp, among the worst, and extremely dim. Unfortunately I bought a fairly large quantity of them at great expense. Imra were ok, if somewhat greenish. Superbright were much better, but had an amazing failure rate - one out of 4 just burned up when first switched on - a definite fire hazard.

Now the last few I bought were from Bedazzled in the UK. Eureka! For once, light nearly indistinguishable from halogen. And at a very reasonable price. When I get around to it (can't be futzing with the lighting all the time; the list of truly urgent repairs and upgrades is far too long) I'm going to deep-six the Sensibulbs and the remaining halogens and convert the rest of the boat to Bedazzled.
Please let me know what Bedazzled lights you are getting and what what kind of fixture you are putting them into.

Pic's also if you can.

Regards

Bill
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Old 20-06-2012, 10:49   #36
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Re: LED CONVERSION

barnakeil-
"Alas, we are stuck with 220 Volts as the only source of same 12 Volt bulbs I found is"
I'm not understading. A fluorescent bulb is something like a 30,000v bulb, not 220 and not 12. The voltage that goes into the fixture, has nothing to do with the voltage the bulb runs at. It gets stepped up to a much higher voltage before it hits the bulb.
If you want to replace the entire fixture with a 12-volt fixture, that's something else again. There aren't a lot of fixtures designed for the marine/rv market--but often the rv market will have them when the chandlery doesn't.
The fixtures, and bulbs, can be extensively swapped as long as the tubes are the same type. (Wattage, pin configuration)
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Old 20-06-2012, 10:50   #37
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Re: LED CONVERSION

$1000 for leds? I converted all 26 interior lights for the same amount in US$ ie $26, I spent about $130 on good leds for the nav lights and anchor light!

I'm pleased with the results.
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Old 20-06-2012, 10:56   #38
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Re: LED CONVERSION

We went with Bebi when we converted our boat due to the fact that the interior fixtures were old flouros and they were corroded. We needed new fixtures and the bebi lights solved that. Also converted nav and anchor lights. Couldn't be more pleased.

Warm interior lights with dimmers.



Nav lights in full sun



Conversion of the existing nav fixtures:



Also the "green" light mode on the interior bebi's are awesome. Good night vision and lights up the whole boat. We have four of them that can turn on green lights. The anchor light is very bright.

Running almost every light in the boat draws about a half amp.
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Old 20-06-2012, 11:08   #39
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Re: LED CONVERSION

From:
http://www.doctorled.com/Dr_LED_PRESS_RELEASE_0612.pdf


Seattle, Washington, 25th February 2010 – Dr. LED today announced that it’s White
Polar Star 40TM, Red Polar Star 40TM, and Green Polar Star 40TM after-market
replacement LED light bulbs for the Aqua Signal series 40 navigation lights have been
certified by a U.S. Coast Guard (USCG) accepted independent laboratory as compliant
with the USCG COLREG 1972 (International Maritime Organization, “IMO”) standards
and verified to be in conformance with the navigation light regulations of ABYC A-16.
These are the only after-market navigation replacement light bulbs that have received
such certifications.



Their LED anchor light had previously been certified.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
hlev,
You are correct. If you are concerned about USCG certification, they only certify a complete fixture including a specific bulb. Changing the bulb type invalidates the certification.

"It is the best color, but we found they were a little to harsh for general lighting in the cabin area. " White LEDs actually come in a range of colors, even from the same single production run. If you think about paint, or yarn, you know that you have to buy a matching "color lot" or else the colors will not match from one piece to the next. Same thing with LEDs, even the best are sold as "assorted" or "graded" and if the wholesaler wants all the LEDs to be the same color and brightness--they may pay 5x-10x more for them. Otherwise "the same" white LEDs from prime makers may come in four distinct colors, with a brightness that doubles in four steps (i.e. 1x, 2x, 4x, 8x as bright).

Sometimes cheap is good, sometimes cheap is for a reason. "Ignore the man behind the curtain."
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Old 20-06-2012, 12:18   #40
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Re: LED CONVERSION

I need your help - how do I choose which LED light?


I have read about them being too bright, too dim, green, white, yellow, cold, and warm.
All of these outfits sell on-line and they are all over the planet – meaning I cannot visit them and “see” the light being emitted. I can exclude the not so good manufacturers from the posts here, but


my question is: Is this a trial by error thing and we have to drop lots o’ bucks to determine which light best suit our needs?
Is there any way to choose from specs?


The help is much appreciated.
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Old 20-06-2012, 13:11   #41
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Re: LED CONVERSION

SVTatia,

Just try a few of these LED's. Their already used by a lot of boaters, so they work well with out you doing the testing

Defender.com Search Results: led replacement bulbs
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Old 20-06-2012, 13:47   #42
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Re: LED CONVERSION

Cotemar

Thank you for your reply but I am not out to test anything.
What I need is orientation on where to find education material about the brightness as I mentioned - warm white, yellow, etc. for the different uses.
Or we do it by trial and error.
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Old 20-06-2012, 14:42   #43
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Re: LED CONVERSION

SVTatia,

All LED's inside your boat should be Warm White, 1 or 2 watts is all you need.

Use Bright White out side or behind any red or green navigation light lense. Works well in engine rooms also.
The internet will get you all the education material you need and provide you with a good nights sleep while reading it.

In the end you will want to go with what all the other boaters are using that has worked for them.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf LED_conversion_table.pdf (292.7 KB, 51 views)
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Old 20-06-2012, 21:22   #44
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Re: LED CONVERSION

Cotemar, many thanks. Excellent conversion table.
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Old 21-06-2012, 07:10   #45
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Re: LED CONVERSION

Shame so few manufacturers give lumens in their specs!

b.
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